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benignbrett - 2025-06-30 21:04:19.684211

Hey, I'm looking for your feedback on my Gem TD inspired game: https://store.steampowered.com/app/3324380/Gattai_TD/ It includes weaving paths between waypoints, slates, and all that good stuff. (sorry for the promotion, but this seems like the most active Gem TD community)

superrichdom - 2025-06-19 18:46:29.308808

andddd for some unknown reason, my tab just refreshed...... I still gotta do the math, but I think I would've beaten my previous 1096 record... https://imgur.com/a/801-still-going-wS3bN60

WGW - 2025-06-19 18:15:44.654229

So cool to see folks are back! I haven't checked in for a while. I see, as usual, @216 has "giving good advice to new players" well in hand. :) Cheers all.

superrichdom - 2025-06-19 14:13:18.447042

801 and still going https://imgur.com/a/801-still-going-wS3bN60

G - 2025-06-17 4:53:14.645933

It's been a while but I've decided to come back to GTD! Just finished a run at level 1111. I probably could have made it to around 1200-1250 with that map layout but I decided to end it early to lock in the fun level number on the high scores. I didn't get a GO until level 1058! I ended up with 4 MBO at the end because I used 3 perfect opals to cover the maze with the cooldown bonus, plus 1 MBO for the damage bonus. No GO most of the game meant I had more LAJ and EE than I would have liked, which meant less levels in the late game. I'll probably start a new game this week and go for 1400+ because why not

odo - 2025-06-16 3:03:52.264902

Thank you for the tips on EE positioning, and this time my luck on opal is better. Only leak 4-6 air with your positioning, that's amazing. Despite 4 leaks on 150, i made it through 200 and gaining gold since 160. I think this could be my first success run without GO. https://imgur.com/a/yKLlXBk

216 - 2025-06-13 23:12:35.640277

8 air leaks is too much.. ofc 9th jade would give you gold to survive 100, but dont go that way.. Uranium is generaly weak gem(can be fun early, but BS better anyway), so yes, building 2nd is bad choice.. (unless 1-turn maybe). Forced to take 2nd fO? (in early lvls) - reset game (1st fO sometiems reset too - risk of geting next.. and better no uranium at all). I thought its obvious that all EEs MUST be in opal range - here 2 wasn't. About EE positions: lowest EE REALLY should be 0.5 gem higher, then it would perfect place! but if no, it dont hit at all, untill flyers are near c6. Your maze dont allow to build there, but it can be moved little letf/right Upper left 2 EEs: generally good, tactical place. but: 1. opal must range here. every EE must be buffed or it works too bad 2. consider adding few jades here, if that 2 EEs aren't stunning efficient enough ( but too long stun here means they wont stun on other side later) 3. might be too early to build here (not a mistake, but there are little better places) Upper-right: not so good at this point, that position is a little bait - "range 3 fragments", but its basicly 1 fragment of path(single-role EE, like that lowest). However after you have ~15 well placed EEs, this position becomes best(for a 2-3 EEs)... assuming opal range! where you missed EEs: - below c3 (that range flyers near exit too), most underesitated place to make stunzone, very effective. Need EG(s) here too -left (max 3.5-4 gems left) to your lowest EE, but at least 0.5 gem higher - near that empty space. -(as mentioned before), near that lowest EE but, again 0.5 gem above :) notice that all 3 places are on same "height" (though EEs below c3 can be little higher). Builing full line here was important part of my stragey leftmost EG - why so far? And generally could be few more EGs + upgrade your lowest BS. ABS on long stunned target is doing more than EG. Also 1 RC is enough (if central placed). But i guess the thing that ruined that run was having EEs outside opal range + bad RNG maybe. Notice that only middle stun+ burst zone nearly guerantee to kill 2 flyers( first stunned, then next when they come form c5), so leaking 8(unlesss visible very bad RNG) is a bad sign.

odo - 2025-06-13 1:41:46.042922

On the previous run I misunderstood EE and EG. This time position of EE is better? No ground leak, leaking 6-8 air after 48, and still died at 100, too less LAJ? Right most uranium was a bad choice? https://imgur.com/a/6zHIrOM

216 - 2025-06-09 10:51:07.970205

Its probably depends of order of placing gems, but i saw replacing 40% buff with 5%. Also SYS had 180 base dmg (blue dmg, it WAS matter), 800 cd in flash version

odo - 2025-06-09 3:07:00.768901

omg i never paid attention to SYS until you mentioned it. so if some gem is in range of both SYS and BO, the attack is only +5%, not +40%?

216 - 2025-06-08 12:42:28.604956

Really no BO at 128? +40% dmg helps a little.. But definitelly NOT too many EEs! only 8 and mostly not in "tactical" places. EE is a specific gem, if it had more range it could be .. worse (in most cases). The point is we want to stun different flyers at same time without having an option to set "random taget" on EEs. Looking at screenshot, imagine that 1st flyer get stunned (due to bad RNG in first shots) just near the middle , over that jade - it will take "attention" of all 8 EEs, while other 9 enemies will pass untouched ... unless its killed fast enough. That why you want to spam EGs that range middle (and more spread EEs, try limit EEs that can hit same point to 6) so, 1. avoid middle EEs (1 maybe ok if its first, here are 3), that 2 lowest placed EEs lets say dont count as "middle" - they have other roles too. But they could be placed 1 gem lower - which is ideal Y-position for such EEs - it would force those 2 to hit different target (at c2-c3 path) 2. That rightmost EE is too far - do not range c5-c6 path at all, after enemies pass c3 its useless. Avoid such single-role EEs (few exceptions, but after you have ~15EEs ). 3. all EGs should range mid or importat stun zone. (avoid upper EGs like that 2). Armor reduction is not needed on entire map (same for RCs) 4. Avoid junk gems like SYS(most bugged gem), star ruby,2nd malachite, silver (unless 1- turn and notihng else to take). 1 paraiba may be enough, can have 2 or 3 for lvl 150. Keep in mind it takes 4 turns to make and helps to kill faster olny grounds, so i recommend olny 1 (rarely 2) untill 130-140. 5. more dmg in middle, i would upgrade that BS near opal ( no good aoe here anyway) Some good places for EEs: -5 gems above lowest possible places (with not too far left/right position ofc) . The ones below middle can range mid and its ok - above/little below your leftmost EE - sometihng between mid and c3 EE positioning can be little not intuitive, but I hope it will help a bit (but its not all :)

odo - 2025-06-08 3:47:53.204691

Does this count as "putting EEs into tactical places"? https://imgur.com/UnolPyL This run failed due to gold income not catching up with air leaks, and ran out at 128. Too many EEs and too little LAJs at this stage for sure. ..

scgmeister - 2025-06-07 21:00:21.927108

I'm still able to get the universal speed hack to work. While chrome did initially disable it "to keep you safe" as it doesn't conform to Chromes new policies or something, it gave me the option to reenable it so long as I agreed to accept the risks associated with running older extensions.

216 - 2025-06-05 13:08:01.394681

GO makes game much easier and faster, but its not mandatory to reach high lvls. GOless runs require more jades to survive. With more optimal stategies you can survive with 5-7 jades, if less optimal... maybe need 20-30. Note that total chance of getting GO depends of jades ( more gold = more repicks). Problems with 152 suggest ground leaks in 150 (which rarely happens to me, mostly because EGs amount). losing lives at 150 is almost as bad as before 44 (but at 150 you dont want quick restart) General tips to reduce leaks: -concetrate damage gems (mainly EGs!) in middle -don't concentrate EEs in middle, put them into tactical places (that range 2 completly different fragemts of flyers path) -work on lvl 150 (i extend maze before it) VN: Sadly kills aren't transferred. But, at least stay on gem that you combine special.

odo - 2025-06-05 4:41:15.083122

Is GO mandatory? I can't get pass 152 without GO. The only two runs with GO got 220ish and 320ish, both ended due to chrome update... Chance to get a GO per repitch is like 0.16%. Any trick beyond luck?

VN - 2025-05-30 20:42:42.325583

Is the kills from the small gems not supposed to be transferred when combined into special gems?

Lisa - 2025-05-21 3:13:17.105384

Is there a new browser hack to speed the game up? previous one isn't working

216 - 2025-05-06 2:04:09.772994

Since my last comment i did much speedrun attempts (50?, i give up at 50-70 if no GO) and... only 1 GO. Many other Great gems. At least that GO run had decent times (despite some imperfections) - 1,9k in 60, 4,1k in 100. Breaking 4k seems possible, while i had problem to break 5k some time ago. Did screenshot in 90, can upload, if someone want (and read those comments) @WGW: before my comeback in 2019 generally i was a GTD noob. Also, jade performed a different role in flash version - there was rather enough gold (from other sources) for (super cheap) lives, so jade gold was for repicks. With non-bugged minimum speed jade's slow was crittically important as well. Now jades provides over 5x more gold, but you have to split gold between repicks and lives, slow (almost) no matter cause bug (only 1% stun effect is similar important in both versions) So, my 1JC success is not really related to not knowing about jade's gold in past :) How was my gameplay in past? - First time was playing in 2007 or 2008 (was 10 or 11 y old) on other webside, without special gem recipes. for some first runs i didnt even know that i can place gem on fly path to make maze and i was losing in easy mode :) note: maze in not needed to win in easy, but i was playing so bad. When i moved to survival mode my strat was: start from silver, absurd long maze and i was trying to keep 1 of each flawed, normal, flawless gems, and when got combine special, was trying to realize which gems dissapears. often was losing about 20, but i could get to about 100 sometimes, with many air leaks. I was coming back to this game in 2008-2015(?) several times, every time figuring out (or trying at least) spcial gem recipes (then forgetting them :) Some motivation to coming back to game was that i was really curious what would happen if i get 4 same perfects. but i knew the chances. I had few years break before 2019, then i found (fun fact: found just after figuring out almost all special gem recipes) this website, comments, wiki, sandbox. Started looking for more "serious" strategy (started to carrying about what flawed gems at start i take and i knew that EE are needed form comments), but i didnt have much hope for breaking 196 - i though it require super luck. Really helpful for testing strategies was sanbox - had to find out how to force EEs to stun different targets. One of first ideas (but very good) was builing line of EEs at max distance that range path. With some other ideas, it took me 4-5 months of rather hopeless runs ( wasn't much leaks, but 2x flyer stacks was a problem and i had no idea of solving it - somehow i made it to happen less likely later) to frist, unexpected succes - was nothing special run, but got GO (about lvl 80) and it started going well (also luck in some dangerous situations), then on my next run, 2 days after i broke 196 again, before even WGW relized my first score :)

WGW - 2025-05-05 12:06:21.730249

@216, took me a long time to answer, just preoccuppied with other stuff, but I wanted to finally comment about how amazed I am that you didn't know jades earned gold until so recently-- no wonder you were able to manage a "one jade" challenge run-- you were used to playing without counting on jades for gold at all! You're right, that the Flash version did have a problem displaying the full text of the jade's description. I know it did correctly scroll when I first started playing, but I don't even what browser I was using at that point (back in 2010 or so). I did notice at some point that I could no longer scroll the description, but I didn't need to since I already knew what I needed to know. So I guess due to the text scrolling issue, there must have been lots of people who played the Flash version who also didn't know that jades earn gold. I think it's even more important in this version, considering how fast the cost of buying lives skyrockets, and the inevitable leaks of air troops and on no-stun levels.

WGW - 2025-05-05 12:01:28.285015

@StarLion, sometimes quite a long time. I haven't been playing much for a while, but I do still try a run every few days and I haven't gotten a good run going in months. But. . . Part of that is because of self-imposed restrictions that make getting past level 150 much, much harder. E.g., using a sub-ideal maze layout in order to enable filling in the maximum possible number of spaces; not taking any single-turn tower except the first malachite and a single great opal (because each single-turn tower you build reduces the number of possible turns by 3); not building as many bloodstones and egyptian golds as I'd like to (so I can build mostly paraibas); etc. These restrictions, which serve only to make it possible to play out an ungoldly long and boring 2 week long run filling in every possible space and taking the maximum number of turns. Even playing in a looser style (as I have been lately, since I'm no longer interested in any more runs over level 1250), my first good run maybe since the start of the year was just this week, which I lost due an automatic Windows Update reboot. Getting past level 150 is far easier with a great opal. But of course you can't force a great opal pick. One of the big problems I've been having with so many runs lately is that the game is refusing to give me any decent opals, forget about a great opal. If you can't get anything better than a flawless opal by level 50, the run is hopeless. I've been getting lots of runs where I don't even get a flawless opal by level 50. Very frustrating-- except that it spares me having to play out another two week long run!

StarLion - 2025-04-30 16:26:16.050988

@WGW, how much time do you spend restarting before you get a viable run going?

216 - 2025-03-22 23:38:19.089198

I didnt know about jade's gold untill 2019 (!) Idk if from comment or wiki. In flash v. you had to scroll jade text to see gold chance, which was reported to not work in some browsers. Now there is (at least) yellow text over jades when gold drops, so it's more likely to realize it. ### Flash vs current version? flash had bugs and horrible lag. But v0.6.2 is just an unfinished game, without goal. Beating 196 was hard enough (little RNG based, but MUCH less than you think!), for first time it was really satisfacting (but very stressful too). Maybe even more than game itself, i liked disscusion and helping others to beat 196. Only @mmkay succesed, but nearly sure @lement would too...if stronger PC - lag was causing projectiles were relative slower, affecting average leak amount (stunning later). More specifically, he has a GOless lvl 196 run with SIMULATED ~52% chance for 0 leak (in 196) , but changing projectiles speed to looks like his run (he posted a gif with lvl 196) dropped chance to about 20%. (That run inspired me to do few 196+ GOless runs, which was much more possible than i expected). ofc, lives mechanic in flash (autocliker need) was a joke... So in GENERAL i liked flash more ... but NOW i prefer JS , cause i play olny to beat my 60,100,200 times. Remeber bloodstone lags? (and fact it had impact of actual times). There is counless things that i hate in JS version, but flash wasn't for lvl 200 speedrunners (extreme was ok) IF lvl 100+ game would be balanced, that some players can get to 200, better to 300, without clear max - it would be great. Anyway, i play rarley, basicly only comment activity is inspiring me to do osme more (speed)runs. Sadly 0 competition for that. Time score even no work btw, olny lvl counts + 1 point every killed enemy. Ah, and never again 1JC (very limited repicks was a disaster)

WGW - 2025-03-22 18:48:31.497408

I'm curious, for folks who have played GTD going back to the original Flash version, which version of the game do you prefer? I don't think this has ever been directly discussed here yet, but now seemed like a good time to ask when there's a new flurry of comment activity (which is great to see!) Worth noting that noth versions have very big bugs that fundamentally alter the designer's real intentions. E.g., Peter H. is on record in comments here that he did not intend it to be possible to play survival mode until you literally run out of room. But I'm asking about preferences for the game as it actually plays, bugs and all, whether you enjoyed the Flash or Javascript version more. For a whole bunch of reason, primarily that Flash GTD runs took 10 hours or so, now it takes literally weeks to play out a stable run, and it's just a slog for 800+ levels. I didn't love that the Flash version was nearly impossible to get past level 196 (only a few folks ever managed it, including @216-- I never did). And that having any shot of getting past 196 meant building endless amounts of enchanted emeralds. But man, oh man, do I miss the days when I could play through a whole run of survival mode in about a DAY. But there were also some much more annoying bugs in the Flash version, e.g., opal cooldown buffs getting overridden by whatever is the most recently placed opal.

WGW - 2025-03-22 18:34:20.241783

@Emmie, yes knowing that jades earn gold is an absolutely a game-changer. Survival mode past level 100 is practically impossible without the gold earnings from jades mitigating the cost of escaped air enemies. (Although @216 did manage an insanely difficult self-imposed "One Jade Challenege" run a while back!) I've said many times in comments here that I don't know how anyone new to the game gets anywhere in survival mode without knowing that jades earn gold, it's a central game mechanic that isn't noted in the jade's description anymore (where the old Flash game's description for jades did note that they earn gold). So folks like me who have been playing GTD since the Flash version days, well, we already knew, so it didn't matter whether the current game's jade description included this info or not. :) But for a newer player? Literally the only way to figure out that jades earn gold is to either (1) carefully observe a pattern of your gold amount going up when jades are hitting but never with other towers, or (2) read the 153 million lines of comment history and see where somebody talks about jades earning gold. I can't imagine how frustrating survival mode would be for someone who has no idea about jades earning gold!

Emmie - 2025-03-21 6:44:38.689733

I didn't know the jades drop gold! That's a total game changer. thanks! I will try to focus more LAJ early for the extra gold

216 - 2025-03-20 14:24:08.629246

Even if u leak 7 every flying lvl 44-76 (63 leaks), you need to buy 54 lives survive 76 (51579 gold). LAJ at lvl 60 has 5% chance to gain 35 gold, assuming perfect opal(227.5 cd) makes ~7.7 gold per sec. My best lvl 76 times are about 3k s (and its with GO rather), while 44 times are about 1.1-1.5k s. I assume jades can hit enoguh efficient for over 1k sec So every LAJ should make nearly 10k gold ( or more if killing ground slower) untill 76, which means 5-6 jades allows you to surive with 7 flying leaks every time If u leak average 6, requied gold drop for lvl 76 to about 30k. Its very important to not leak anything before 44. lvl 12 is often an issue (but only without fully upgraded malachite, which i ussually do). Also, jades should be able to hit an enemy most of time

Emmie - 2025-03-20 4:15:36.066259

Interesting! I only leak 4-7 flying guys every flying round but i seem to never have enough gold to buy lives after lvl 72. Long time lurker, been playing for like 8 years, recently started following @WGW 2022 guide, hope to get a good as you all soon! :)

216 - 2025-03-19 14:20:03.881533

Sanbox doesn't even work since year or more... Reaching 100 is really not hard if enough jades (with 0 IS very hard).

Emmie - 2025-03-19 6:39:52.579125

Wait so everyone reaching 100+ is this in survival or sandbox mode?

Aris - 2025-03-17 13:43:28.693586

thanks for the explenation. i was afraid of that so i didnt really think about the possibility too hard. yeah i guess that's it for me then. maybe another run to use the combined special bug from the start and maybe try to get a score entry in but i probably wont be up to tinker with low amount of special gems and shortening the maze during the run

216 - 2025-03-17 13:36:08.799525

1. VERY short maze (can start with longer then reducing) 2. Spam of paraiba gem (4 parts in recipe) Max possible lvl (if infinite gold) is 1341. Having a Great Opal reduce it by 3. Every 3-gem special reduce it by 1. The only person who got over 1300 is WGW, and its really hard to beat it ( maybe possible get very few lvls more). Also it takes weeks to get as far (so i wont even try).

Aris - 2025-03-17 10:55:56.516834

@216 there are people who made it to LV 1300 or something, how did they get there when space runs out?

216 - 2025-03-17 1:23:42.432225

Sadly after lvl 250 there is nothing fun/challenging in the game - the only limiting factor is space for gems (and patience). So you have to lose intentionally to submit score. Instead of going highest lvl possible i suggest improving time score (i can beat lvl 200 in ~13k seconds) or reducing total amount of leaks. @WGW: The combine bug was first reported in septebmer 2021 by Chr3y (i was suprised of that bug!) and it took little time untill we learned how to exploit it (little correction of "exploiting bug since JS release". If i got what u meant). Anyway, if u are still curious of more exac bug mechanic ( lets use EG example): Each time u select gem, the game is checking for combine special ( to display button or no), let say u selected fD. Then, the game loads list of gems needed (fs,FA,PA in this case) and searching the towers, naturally form first build to last. Let say the first build was PA. After finding PA its looking olny for FA + fD. Let say 2nd find was fD. If all 3 are found combine special is displayed. After click if selected gem is one of 3 found (1st PA, 1st fD, 1st FA), those gems are consumed( no chance to bug in that case). But if not - selected fD wasnt first fD , one of found gems is replaced by selected gem - due to bug its ALWAYS first. so it will be (selected fD, 1st fD, 1st FA). Bug reason is really stupid - copied similar line of code and one variable not changed (i think it was even looking similar, maybe "1" instead "i" , but i checked it much time ago so not sure)

Aris - 2025-03-16 22:56:14.041511

uhmm..... so what do you do when you have 0 space left where you could place a gem but you have only placed 4 out of 5 gems this round...... looks like i'm stuck https://i.imgur.com/nkTrIMd.png

Aris - 2025-03-13 20:23:32.929146

@WGW oh and i made an embarrasing mistake. the EG next to the MysticBlackOpal in the middle should have ben one space to the left and one space down. at some point i misplaced it and didnt notice until i turned it into the gold and now it cant be moved again. it slightly shortens the groud units path but at the current level that is completely meaning less since the one that makes it farthers barely gets passed the 3rd checkpoint. sometimes no one reaches the 3rd chekpoint. yeah leaking 3 - 7 fly units every 4 levels but i make so much gold that i always make more than it costs to heal back up to 11 (so even if i dont pay attention during the waves where they are immune to stun and all 10 flying units get through i dont lose the game)

Aris - 2025-03-13 20:20:09.702525

@WGW heeey, so many thanks! great explanation and it makes sense now that it did happen to me a bunch of times unintentionally because i was preparing multiple batches at the same time so i had duplicates of any given ingredient. also fun fact: i'm currently on a game that's been going on for 3 days. i lucked out and got a great opal slap bang in the middle. currently LV330 and going strong through the power of luck. 2/3 of the uraniums i throw down in a single round so i picked them because you dont turn down a gift like that. the fire star i built and yellow star sapphire i built because i felt bad leaving them out. im going to build another black opal over the yellow star sapphire. can't wait to try out a run with the detailed knowledge on the CSB though so thanks again. lets see how far i can take this run. https://i.imgur.com/mxZsSRP.png

WGW - 2025-03-12 18:58:08.334611

HOW TO EXPLOIT THE COMBINE SPECIAL BUG: I will use as an example building an Egyptian Gold, but the same pattern applies to building any special tower. 1: Pick a perfect amethyst. VERY IMPORTANT NOTE: this must be the FIRST gem on the board that is a part of the EG recipe. If you have, e.g., a flawed diamond gem already on the board when you pick the perfect amethyst, this will NOT work. 2: Keep playing till you pick a flawed diamond, and a flawless amethyst (the order doesn't matter) 3: Once you have all three necessary gems (the first pefect amethyst, and the subsequent flawed diamond and flawless amethyst), keep picking until you get EITHER a flawed diamond OR a flawless amethyst. Place this where you want the egyptian gold to be. For the sake of this example, let's say you pick a second flawed diamond. 4: Combine special on that second flawed diamond you just picked in step three, and voila, the game will consume the two flawed diamonds and the flawless amethyst to create the egyptian gold, and leave the perfect amethyst untouched. As I said below, there are a lot of nuances to how this works, which I'm avoiding explaining to keep this at reasonable length. But you'll probably be able to puzzle out some of this yourself once you get a basic handle on how the bug works without my blathering on about it. :) I hope this helps!

WGW - 2025-03-12 18:47:13.993474

@Aris, yeah, unfortunately the comments page has very quiet lately (it was also not working for a while recently), which led me to not check as often. Nice to see that folks are still playing and getting hooked! I'll try to explain how to exploit the combine special bug one more time. Probably your difficulty is because there are SO MANY comments on this page to digest, and the bug itself is more than a little confusing in how it works (there are nuances I still don't fully understand), but if you follow these steps, you should be able to use it. I don't think it's absolutely essential to exploit this bug to get a long run going (meaning a run that will go past level 150), just as it isn't absolutely necessary to get a great opal. But survival mode is already hard enough even *with* a great opal and exploiting the combine special bug. I really never continue runs past level 100 unless I get a great opal anymore. And I've been exploiting the combine special bug shamelessly since the Javascript version of GTD introduced it (the old Flash version didn't have this bug). fwiw, I think you're doing very well, good maze layout and good placement and choice of gems. I could suggest some minor tweaks, but you're not doing anything majorly wrong that I can see. EXCEPT. . . you should not upgrade the bloodstones. Getting a bloodstone early (by level 30 or so) is a HUGE advantage as it will rack up tons of kills and get a huge a damage boost as a result. The upgraded bloodstone, with the flame attack, is only good once you have a ton of stun power via dark emeralds. Usually you should leave the bloodstones (which should be near the center of the map) unupgraded until level 100 or so. If I hav e a ton of dark emeralds, I will maybe upgrade them as early as level 80, but usually not. And remember too that even if you do everything right, there's RNG in this game that can screw you over beyond what gems you pick-- primarily, the effect of dark emeralds on flyers. If they don't get stunned effectively in later levels, which can happen even when you have a ton of dark emeralds hitting them all along the air path, they escape anyway and you're screwed. This is, to say the least, often an extremely frustrating game. :) This is a very long comment so I'll leave a separate one with instricutions on the combine special bug. Cheers!

Aris - 2025-03-11 7:22:15.774909

LV108 yesterday. i still dont know how the CSB Exploit works but i got to keep a flawed emerald and a normal aquamarine by accident haha. i just dont know what i need to do differently so i don't have a mid game phase where leak ground units. i could get so much further if i didnt have to spend lives on ground units. i got a great aquamarine in an almost perfect location pretty early in the run and it did some HEAVY lifting especially with the black opal, perfect opal und parabia up. i also got a great topaz late in the run but that didnt do much i think. https://i.imgur.com/7OiSaGZ.png

Aris - 2025-03-09 19:35:04.639097

Whelp, made it to LV100, without understanding the Combine Special Bug. i got lucky in some regards. dropped a complete Gold and a complete jade and got 4 perfect opals in total, sadly never together for a great opal. the blood stone took forever though and i was leaking a few ground units in the early 80s before i finally got it. without those leaks i probably would have made it to level 104. dunno if i could get even further with a different distribution of EGs, LAJs and DEs.... though i am convinced that my BO, Paraibas and BSs where really really good. for a brief moment during LV99 and very early in LV100 i though it could make it through 100 and could rebound and build up lives again until LV104... alas it was not so... also not sure about the GPD but i always seem to have a bit of a ground crisis at some point and i feel it would always be worse without the GPD.... sad that apparently im the only one visiting the comment section regularly... guys where are you? i need someone to explain the CSB Exploit to me like im 5yo xD https://i.imgur.com/1fDjP0J.png

Aris - 2025-03-08 21:44:47.340948

made it to LV76 without CSBE hehe. dunno how far i could have made it if it had been with a great opal instead of a perfect one, maybe even more LAJ for more gold to buy more lives or repicks but i i dont think that would go very far. the bats just start leaking hard at some point. https://i.imgur.com/56wz8fs.png https://i.imgur.com/WOqY2O4.png

Aris - 2025-03-08 14:11:23.095220

so, i made it to LV68. lost some fly units early on and nearly restarted. i still dont understand how combine special bug works but i actually lost a perfect aquamarine due to the bug.... guess that's why someone said to not make duplicate gems hehe. got kinda unlucky with the dark emeralds, the first one was pretty far into the run as i just wouldn't get a perfect emerald or would have another higher prority gem dropped in the same round.... man i really do like this game and survival mode i just wish it was a tinsy bit easier so one could get further with a bit less luck and without the combine special bug. https://i.imgur.com/pvkWZ6C.png

Nick - 2025-03-07 23:13:16.049020

can someone give a detailed step by step exlenation on how to do the combine special bug exploit? ive read through the comments but maybe i need an explenation a 5 year old could understand because i don't get it. i have had it happen to me but i don't understand what conditions i created for it to happen

Aris - 2025-03-07 13:37:25.603324

man i love this game but its so frustrating. i only got over level 50 once and i got so very very lucky and had 2 perfect opals in a single drop to create the highest tier opal and it was even in a good location where it was able to buff a bunch of special gems and some other perfect gems...... i feel like my maze is pretty damn good so i have no idea what i could do better apart from just getting insanely lucky with drops and locations

s - 2025-02-07 1:32:38.616869

this is quite off normal topic but important for you to know my computer is currently hacked but will be fixed tommro afternoon until the do not trust any word I say also have a great day yall

WGW - 2025-01-30 15:29:33.216968

@brad, if you do a search on this page for the phrase "combine special bug", you'll find lots of comments discussing/explaining how it works. @s is correct that this bug applies to ANY tower you build, not just Golds. But what at first seems like a bug that only screws you over (e.g., by consuming two perfect gems when it shouldn't), once you understand how to properly exploit it, the bug actually makes the game SIGNIFICANTLY easier. If you exploit the bug properly, you can build towers off of a single perfect gem endlessly without ever consuming the perfect gem. Also. . . hi, @s! :)

brad - 2025-01-27 1:46:49.783332

your right i think

s - 2025-01-24 0:48:34.286550

@ brad that does tend to happen from time to time but it could be for any thing not just gold so you know

brad - 2025-01-23 5:14:41.027916

ive noticed when i make gold by selecting a perfect amethyst and upgrading it, if I happen to have a second perfect amethyst on the field it also gets consumed

s - 2025-01-22 21:53:12.751753

thanks you @peter I figured that something was up but I thought it was only on my part @wgw. And cheers to you as well

WGW - 2024-12-30 19:52:47.496311

Thanks so much, @Peter! I'd tried unsuccessfully to leave a comment recently, just checking in. I only play rarely these days-- that level 1301 run, I think, just completely killed off my interest cause I'm really never, ever going to do any better than that. Anyhow, I hope other folks are still playing. I still check the comments regardless of whether I'm actually playing. I hope everyone has a happy new year. Cheers! :)

Peter - 2024-12-27 6:00:39.202996

Comments should be working now.

Poske Ygo - 2024-11-23 1:01:44.874269

Id reccomend starcraft 2, gem tower defense version Has 5 gem fusions on top of 3 gem fusions and many game modes. On top of that it has a 9th core gem in Morganite. Warcraft version 7.9 is quite impossible when it comes to level 50, but it has slates (non towers) sort of like traps which make it super interesting. This online version needs bug fixes and updates to keeup up.

JELLY - 2024-11-04 4:42:51.132737

Hi! I love that this game still has such an awesome fanbase! That's all. Thanks for keeping it going!

216 - 2024-10-26 17:18:57.980680

time doesn't affect speed, each wawe has its own speed (same for every after 40). displayed "speed" is incorrect (wrong variable)

noobifiod - 2024-10-26 13:42:19.503624

Does the time or level influence the speed of enemies? It seems like if I take longer to finish a wave the next one is proportionally faster and stronger than usual.

WGW - 2024-10-19 4:55:24.478216

Well, I WOULD have been able to keep going until the board was filled without the enemy movement glitch after all, except that I somehow reset the game at level 930 when my wireless keyboard fell over. I honestly have NO idea how I managed it this time, since it wasn't due to closing the browser or hitting the "back" button. Maybe the F5 button was hit, triggering a refresh. In any event, I'm kinda pissed about it. At least I know that this wouldn't have been a particularly high scoring run anyway (around level 965 if I'd played it all the way out). I didn't remove the path-lengthening rocks in the middle of the maze until the very end, in order to minimize ground troop leaks (no leaks at all until level 875 or so, when I had no choice but to shorten the ground troop path due to lack of space). I also started building nothing but jades, because they take the fewest repicks to build (reducing tedium slightly), but mostly so that when ground troops started leaking, I'd have plenty of gold built up to buy my way out of it. So This confirms. . . (a) that if you avoid building paraibas and upgraded bloodstones, the memory leak is minimal (the game was using about 600MB of RAM, versus well over 2GB if there were tons of paraibas/bloodstones), and that the memory leak is definitely the cause of the enemy movement/game speed glitch, (b) that it is actually possible to fill in the whole map WITHOUT the movement/speed glitch (I didn't think so before this), and (c) that you can drastically reduce the time score by building tons of golds-- but only, of course, at the expense of maximum turns. All of which is highly vital, life-changing information that made this whole brain-deadening, weeklong endeavor that didn't even end in being able to post a high score CLEARLY worthwhile. . .

WGW - 2024-10-15 18:48:21.253200

Oh, and I should acknowledge that I took the idea of having a long unbroken row of enchanted emeralds near the bottom from @216's screenshots ages ago. I don't usually play this way, because I'm usually trying to minimize how many non-paraibas I build, but if you're not concerned with maximum turns/levels, that row of EEs is very effective!

WGW - 2024-10-15 18:43:48.374956

I'm somewhat pointlessly doing a run now where I'm testing whether the late game enemy movement glitch is really a direct result of the game's memory leak from frost and flame animations. I'm was already 99.99% sure, but I wanted to prove it definitely by doing a long run with minimal paraibas and bloodstones, which should mean minimal memory leakage, which should mean that the enemy movement never glitches out. And since I actually got two great opals before level 100, I figured I'd give it a go. . . I covered the ground path with just enough paraibas for armor reduction purposes (12), sprinkled around a handful of bloodstones for damage (8), and built enough enchanted emeralds to reliably kill at least 8, but usually 9 or 10, air troops (around 45 EEs!) I've been otherwise filling the map with nothing but egyptian golds. I'm at level 609 now and the game is still only using 300MB of RAM (as I recall, it would be using well over 1GB of RAM at this point in runs with lots of paraibas), with no sign of the late game slowdown/glitched movement. I won't know for sure until I hit around level 800, which is when I ordinarily see the glitch start, but I expect the memory usage to hold and no glitch to happen. I'll leave another comment when I get there. Notably, if there isn't any movement glitch, as I expect, I'm going to lose this run a lot earlier than losing by running out of space. Once I start to run out of room for new towers I'll be forced to modify (and greatly shorten) the maze, which will mean I'm going to start leaking probably as many as 5 ground enemies per level, and I'll run out of gold pretty quickly at that point. I doubt it's possible to play the game out till the whole maze is filled without the benefit of the late game movement glitch. Another boring screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/Dk3YrX4

WGW - 2024-10-15 18:43:40.068291

@Got Cheated, well, you've joined the unenviable club of folks who have lost long runs for infuriatingly stupid reasons. Um. . . "Welcome." I guess. ;)

Got Cheated - 2024-10-14 2:43:14.379548

Been playing this game for awhile and finally got to a point where i got past level 200. I got to level 233ish using a opera window and when i went to place my next gems the tab closed and i couldnt save it. going to stop playing for a bit.

216 - 2024-10-08 16:47:43.922798

5%, in flash version was 1% gold amount is game lvl/2 + 5

Poske - 2024-10-08 16:24:30.521480

1% chance to give gold on hit, gold is based on games wave level I think. Some lever there.

Simoncello - 2024-10-08 14:17:40.145234

can someone explain the exact effect of luckyasianjade concerning gold please

WGW - 2024-09-30 0:50:10.120066

Just finished a nice, relaxed level 1237 run. . . Quite a novelty allowing myself to build as many non-paraiba towers as I felt like! :) https://imgur.com/a/nuPcmFb

WGW - 2024-09-28 4:03:53.569609

Yes, the movement glitch is related to the number of paraibas you build, because the root cause is a still-existing memory leak caused by the frost animation-- but it's not just paraibas, it's also the flame animation for bloodstones (and previously, the numbers for critical hits from golds and such, which Peter H. removed from the game a while back for this reason. @216 figured out almost all of this.) But the root cause is the memory leak. If that's plugged, you'd be able to build all the paraibas and bloodstones you want without the movement glitch happening. I presume that if you avoided building paraibas and (upgraded) bloodstones, you might be able the glitched movement entirely. I've never tested it, though-- by level 800 I always have at least 150 paraibas. At least!

DR JM NIPOK - 2024-09-27 6:46:56.886681

@WGW / @SCGM , The movement vibration that stalls enemies to an almost standstill seems to be directly related to the number of Tourmalines since the further along you go, the more of your board that becomes covered with them. And I guess you both know (at least for me it seems) you can move focus off the window and as long as you keep the window active but not your primary open window the time will tick slower but the pieces begin to move so I think over the same span of time you can get them to areas where they take the most damage then bring focus to the window again so they freeze in place near the center where pieces take the most damage. Cheers.

WGW - 2024-09-26 11:45:03.682718

Thanks very much, @SCGmeister! The enemy movement glitch usually starts for me around level 800, and until then I do have to have a strong enough maze to actually kill most enemies normally (including ALL ground troops except on no-stun levels, and at least 7 of 10 air troops). But I did notice a long time ago that if I'm running processor-intensive software (e.g., a video encoder), the glitch can start happening much, much earlier. And I confirmed by playing a run on a much older PC that it's processor power that determines how early the movement starts glitching out (it's not due to RAM since the game only uses about 2.5GB even at level 1300). Back when I was still willing to play out runs without an early great opal, and before I really nailed down how to get in the most turns/levels, I would sometimes shorten the maze too early and end up leaking ground troops. Seemed to happen most often around level 300 and again around level 600, in runs that I thought were fully stabilized. So I did kinda take advantage of being able to trigger the enemy movement glitch early in a couple of those runs way back (we're talking over a year ago), because I really didn't want to tank an otherwise strong run that I'd been playing for so many hours. I rationalized this as "fair" because if I was simply playing on a slower PC, the movement glitch would have started earlier. The earlier the movement gets glitched, the earlier you can stop worrying about escaping enemies, meaning you can avoid building any towers other than paraibas without worry. PC processor speed, obviously, should not have any effect on gameplay, but it absolutely does with respect to this movement glitch. I didn't think it "fair" that the game should technically be harder the faster your PC is due to the movement glitch starting later in the game. Now I just simply don't even continue a run if I haven't gotten an early great opal. And with a great opal, you can pretty easily stabilize a run so that your gold is constantly going up without needing the glitched movement. By the very late levels, though (above 1000, let's say), when filling in maximum spaces unavoidably means massively shortening the ground troop path, I don't think it would be possible to prevent ground troop leaks without the glitched movement. The hitpoints just get too astronomically high-- over 5 million! So it may very well be that without this bug/glitch, it would not be possible to even get to level 1000 because so many ground enemies would be leaking. It's hard to know, because there's no way to test out these levels unglitched. In any event, good job getting so far without a great opal-- it's much, much harder. And a lot less fun! :) (I still haven't tried out the speed hack-- good to know that it doesn't seem to continue working forever. The ideal here, of course, would be if the memory leak that causes the movement glitch would be patched, and the game had a "fast forward" feature, pretty standard for tower defense games, which many folks have requested!)

SCGmeister - 2024-09-25 15:58:13.441453

update: even with the RequestAnimationFrame feature of the speed hack ticked, the enemies will eventually start vibrating in place, though at a much later level than it would have when not checked. For now, I'm going to slow down the speed slightly as mobs start to vibrate until the speed hack eventually stops working (if I'm remembering right), or it becomes apparent that I'm about to lose and I decide I'd rather finish filling up the board for the purpose of sharing a screenshot of this finished without worrying too much about what level I eventually finish at (which as mostly become pointless now due to the high number of obvious fake high scores). @WGW congrats at finally getting past level 1300. Regardless on how soon the mobs start vibrating in place, that is still impressive.

SCGmeister - 2024-09-25 4:01:57.998275

I'm back and messing around with this game again for a bit, and may as well share the maze I have going right now as I have now somehow managed to survive past level 300 despite the lack of a great opal. https://imgur.com/a/Vv4JSnM Also, I am using the universal speed hack with the requestanimationfram ticked on to ensure the units don't glitch out, as I'm curious to see how far I can take this maze when everything actually moves as intended. I do remember once before when I tried using it as a way to cheat past what would be normally possible, but it began having issues and eventually stopped working all together once the lag got up to a certain point, but we'll see how this run goes. (assuming I have patience enough to marathon my way through the rest of this run)

WGW - 2024-09-23 23:00:02.478715

@DR JM NIPOK, well, that really sucks, clicking on the "High Scores" link by accident. You can pretty much prevent that in the future, though, if you scroll the game window down so that the stats line is at the very top, which would make clicking anywhere safe (even the "Reset Game" button, since you have to confirm), except of course for the close window button. . . I've lost several runs thanks to my cat stepping on the mouse button when the cursor happened to be lined up with the close window button. More often, due to forced Windows Update reboots because I forget to turn it off, because I'm pretty much always doing a GTD run and I can't have it turned off permanently! I also keep 21 lives saved, just in case I space out and don't remember to replenish for a couple of levels. Cause I've lost tons of runs prematurely that way, too. . . Yeah, this game is more than a bit maddening.

DR JM NIPOK - 2024-09-21 3:17:39.230261

@WGW , Last comment towards your appreciated prior reply is that yes, I always try to keep lives at 21 once money reserves are less of an issue. Well before level 100 and for the remainder of the game until I need to start purposely loosing lives I try to start each level at 21 lives. The adage "fool me once" would apply if it wasn't for the ten or twenty times this fool wasn't paying attention ! Cheers

DR JM NIPOK - 2024-09-21 3:07:11.818117

@WGW, and you can only get one save position per GUID so to save your current state you need to overwrite your prior state so you can not keep multiple copies of the same game going. It does mean that some people could choose to focus a lot of time on each level trying to get specific gems and there could likely even be a simple function that can apply guid and level to preallocate the 5 gem choices to limit the number of reasons to restart the same level. Cheers !

DR JM NIPOK - 2024-09-21 2:38:40.953189

@WGW, When I went to bring focus to window I clicked HIGH SCORES !!! Instantaneously I knew I was f'ked. If you click back button or click play again the game was already gone. I would love to see a SAVE button and to avoid misuse, a unique GUID is issued when you click start and that guid is only allowed one high score so at some point when you finally think you have the best possible high score , you save. It would make the two weeks it takes to get close to level 1000 and then have some hiccup not hurt as bad. I don't know why this game is so addictive but a perfect example of wanting to be able to save a position and be able restart from there is tonight's starting position : https://thenaturalstateofnature.org/greatstart.jpg This start eventually ends up with a final open row at the top where we trade one rock to the top right goal and can then fill in the entire top row. I was worried the site was not coming back. It was down for about a month maybe and then just tried it again one day and it was working again and then after the events you replied to I had sworn off the game forever , but ....here we are again. Cheers, live long and prosper, may the force be with you, 42. #thenaturalstateofnature A save button with one save per start would not ruin this game but instead make it a million times more enjoyable !.

WGW - 2024-09-16 20:21:21.055298

@DR JM NIPOK, I fully agree. . . I'm curious, though, exactly what the ill-fated mouse click was? Cause losing window focus certainly won't end a run in itself. Not unless you have less than 11 lives (which, if that's the case, I suppose taught the painful lesson not to ever have under 11 lives until the very, very VERY end of the game!) In any event, I do, sincerely, feel your pain, considering how many times I've experienced it myself. I'm currently doing a run now which will get above level 1200, but I'm purposely not building only paraibas to see how much effect this has on how fast enemies get killed. Every tower you build other than a paraiba costs a turn (level), but I'm really not trying to do any better than the level 1301 score.

DR JM NIPOK - 2024-09-14 6:22:31.711687

This must be the most frustratingly addictive game of all time. Broke level 1100 and well on the way to 1300+ and one bad mouse click lost the game. When a game takes 2 weeks to finish it should be harder for the active window to loose focus...

MeatPaw - 2024-09-11 18:13:22.891411

After playing a lot this last month or so, I think it'd be great if there was some meta shifting in terms of gems. I'm a big proponent of game design philosophy "it's not that something is over powered, it's that not everything is over powered." OP gems include EE, EQ, Luckys - gems that are incredibly useful, do a lot of damage, or generate a ton of gold. Useful must builds include Rose, Black Opal, and GO / PO. A pariba or 2 might be decent depending on maze and obviously late game you farm for gem placements. Malachite / Silver are fine because they are stating so that leaves... That leaves how many 'useless' gems - Star Ruby, Uranium, Pinks, Stars. At least it's not more but I feel like it would be much better game experience if these gems were buffed to the point where at least building 1 would give you a lot of utility. I'm not sure what changes you could give these/what changes would be needed to the minions to make these more relevant, but I really dislike being 'forced' to build the good stuff to have a good run. Overall still having a good time :)

MeatPaw - 2024-09-11 18:06:54.991719

@Superrichdom yeah makes sense! Really been trying to focus on not duplicating those early flaweds so that I can abuse combine bug later. Just kind of depends on RNG / how often I want to restart.

Superrichdom - 2024-09-11 12:46:38.425631

This comment of is pretty much what I do WGW - 2024-09-08 14:23:59.383815 This is what I do and it is pretty hard not to reach lvl 100: - Malachite - Gem chance 20 --> focus on Jade or multiple Jades. (Red Chrystal, Paraiba, Dark Emerald, Black Opal, Blood Stone or Gold is OK, but do not duplicate gems) - Gem chance 50 --> To help bulding Jade faster - Gem chance 80 - Upgrade Malachite 25 gold (lvl 6-7) - Before lvl 12, Upgrade Jade 295 gold, if not able, Malachite 280 - Lvl 16-20, Upgrade other Jades if available, focus on Red Chrystal and place it in the middle of the map. Slowly upgrade gem chances. If you already have a LuckyAsianJade, upgrading would be faster. Make sure to save gold to upgrade for more LuckyAsianJade (295 gold) or for the Rose Quartz Crystal (200 gold). At the same time, make sure you build for you Black Opal, also in the middle. - Lvl 20-24, your upgrade gem chance should be maxed out. You aim for a Great Opal, but a Perfect Opal well placed in the middle is fine. After that, you need to exploit the Combine special bug (see below) to get Dark Emerald and Gold. Then, you should be good to go! If you leak ground, just start again. It is normal if you leak air starting at lvl 40, make sure that your maze doesn't leak ground.

216 - 2024-09-09 22:48:01.104905

I wouldn't say "brutal", its almost like 1 more EG (if all 90 on EGs..). You don't have to upgrade BS at all if good aoe place.

MeatPaw - 2024-09-09 21:29:53.204108

Yeah exactly wasting 90 kills on the GPD was brutal. ABS is the upgrade BS right? Not sure when to upgrade. I'll definitely be redefining my maze it's just been good to learn how the game works with an easy maze like this

216 - 2024-09-09 21:11:55.528503

I suggest more experimenting with mazes instead copying - that maze dont allow to build much towers in mid. besides EEs and EGs also cosider ABS - higher dps than EG on stunned target. But it tend to steal kill from EGs. GPD really sucks (even without x0.2, imagine with) , but getting it early may be just fun. This version is waaay too easy to lose becuase having GDP and wasted 90 kills :)

MeatPaw - 2024-09-09 20:32:25.088190

@WGW and @216 thanks for replying! you guys are legends. Here's my most recent lvl 100 run https://imgur.com/a/JRxwDs0 I copied a maze from some lvl100 speedruns I've seen in the comments and like this style as it fits within my workday (1 good run placing gems during breaks and whatnot). I'm not really trying for speed/score but maybe some time. My thoughts on strategy 1-50ish 1) Malachite placed in good early game but leaving center for other towers 2) I like the 110 upgrades into either upgrade malachite or a Jade depending on RNG. Then fully upgrading keeping the most decent gems. 3) I kept builds towards EG and EE but didn't want multiple so that I could eventually abuse the combine bug. I eventually farmed enough Jades for gold and around 38 started to repick to for towers and to clear gem space. - here I got lucky - I was rolling for EQ, EE, BS, and of course if I got it a GO. I got the GO first at level 40 then BS at level 41, stopped rolling after. 4) Earlier than my GO I got a free GPD - decided to combine but probably wont in the future unless its a speed run. 5) Important kill counts - GPD - 90, middle BS - 35, other bs - 22, malachite has 192, couple nice EGs in the 40's others in 20s others much lower. All my aura gems have 10 or under, one EE with 30 all others much lower. Concluding, would not build GPD if I can help it, wouldn't build two black opals, just one is fine after GO (keeping a PO until), and wondering what to build besides EE and EG. Maybe farm pariba's and jade's just so I don't have to repick as much? Any feedback appreciated. Having a good time now that I fully understand the combine exploit - it's more of a feature I think it's cool even if it makes it easier :)

Lesserleaf - 2024-09-09 15:34:22.397254

Phew, just got my first properly long run, had to open it up and end early because I needed to restart my computer, it really is a slog at those levels, I think this run would have got to around 1100 if I'd carried it on until the end of the space. Here's a mid round screenshot (sorry) https://imgur.com/a/aUnjgiB I'd already filled in the top which changed it from a 7-pass maze to a 5-pass to make extra space.

216 - 2024-09-09 14:52:51.466236

From 44 to ~200 is hard to kill all. But stuns from EEs+ burst from EG helps. Without a GO leaking 5 or even more in midgame is normal. Don't forget build RC

Simoncello - 2024-09-09 14:32:16.860146

Hey guys, Im having a hard time with air leaks, any tips for managing air pleeease

WGW - 2024-09-08 17:56:32.591802

@216, I might just be off by a level or two saying things like upgrading chances completely by level 15. I really don't keep track (it also depends on how lucky you get earning gold from the jade). Approximate numbers only (except for the order that I noted on how I spend gold, that's exact-- I upgrade chances through 110 gold then fully upgrade either the malachite or the jade)

216 - 2024-09-08 15:35:11.582650

1-100 strategy depends of what do you want achieve of run: a) highest lvl (like WGW) - optimize space run b) best time score - burst + aoe dmg run c) the least leaks - anti air run d) other goal But in general you shouldn't worry about kills by malachite - at start you even want it. Later it gains kills slowly. Also its often hard to "redirect" kills form malachite to tower u want. Yes, its better to have kills on BS or EG, so if u get early fD in place that u want combine EG later, its good when it "steal" kills from malachite. Mostly because i mostly focus on time, i upgrade malachite very early - just 2x gem chances and saving gold for malachite. It have some disadvantages, but no more problem with leaks in 12-20+ Used to spend gold on chances first and ugrading malachite late - hunting on early perfects. In my experience ussualy like 70 kills were already wasted (on gems that were going to dissapear) at lvl ~20. But i feel like malachite is a bit underestimated gem - its not best vs late flyers, but not useless. - - - - - - - - - - - - @WGW: (just noticed your 3 new comments) its not true that malachite lose attack power after ~40, just EG's gains a lot due to amethyst weakness *** quick reminder: only PINK damage has coded multipliers, rest is 1x vs all***, so you often clear lvl 41 faster than 39. BS lose at this point, due to greater distances between enemies. however, with wise maze, BS can cover places that dwarves returning form checkpoint meets those which are coming there - fueling BS dmg hard. One more thing: You said you can max gem chances in lvl 15 with early jade. i upgraded 0 kills jade at lvl 12 and kept most gems out to let jade hits more and still after 16 was missing a bit gold. Surely in 0.5.4 i got max chances in 15 easilly. Maybe will do more tries, but by lvl 15 you meant after 15 or whne starting 15?

WGW - 2024-09-08 14:35:03.123734

I really should have added, too, allowing your initial malachite to rack up all the early kills is, imo, a GOOD thing, something I actively want to happen, to the extent of purposely keeping all other gems as far away from the malachite in early levels as possible (except for one opal for the cooldown buff). Now, considering that you can get a viable run going without taking the first malachite at ALL, it isn't strictly necessary to have the malachite rack up early kills. And you're right that you don't want to starve other good towers from getting kills (like golds, bloodstones, etc). BUT. . . it makes the early levels much, much, much easier if you have a malachite growing in attack power early on. And in my experience, once you do finally build a really powerful tower (rare to get one before level 20), it's going to start getting kills regardless of how powerful you let the malachite become up to that point. Malachites are hugely powerful early on but it's true that their relevance (in attack power) drops off of a cliff by level 40ish. But if you're struggling with the early levels, then I think it's best to take advantage of how powerful malachites can be early on if you place them well and let them upgrade via kills.

WGW - 2024-09-08 14:23:59.383815

@MeatPaw, stuff not covered in that "tips" comment that you asked about specifically: Starting with a malachite and working towards a jade next as you're doing is a solid strategy. As for upgrades, I usually go in this order (no repicks): Gem chances 20, Malachite 25, then Gem chances up to 110. Then I save up to either fully upgrade the malachite for 280, or preferably the jade if I've managed to build one (for 295). The fully upgraded malachite makes killing all enemies trivial until at least level 16, where the fully upgraded jade means you'll be able to fully upgrade gem chances as early as level 15. You can't really force specific tower builds early on in this game because you can't afford to squander early gold on repicks. So your only resort in battling bad RNG is to restart. It took me a long, long time to accept that it's better to restart 20 times to get a viable run than bang your head against a wall with a run where the game throws bad gems at you early on! Anyhow, I hope this is at least somewhat helpful. Cheers! :)

WGW - 2024-09-08 14:04:12.575206

@MeatPaw, just in case you missed it (considering how many comments there are to wade through!), you might find useful my post below at "WGW - 2022-06-24 4:23:59.022491". :) I've been impressed at how many different approaches various folks have tried successfully. E.g., it was a revelation to me (I think thanks that @Jonathan A, iirc) that you don't even need to take the starting tower on the first turn and can still get a good survival run going. So don't take any of what I say as definitive or anything (@216 plays very different from me, too), just what works for me! If you'd like more specific suggestions, definitely post a screenshot. Nice to finally get that great opal, huh???

MeatPaw - 2024-09-08 7:44:43.705083

Long time listener first time caller. Been playing off an on for YEARS but much more committed to the game now haha. Got my first great opal following strategies of others I've found scouring the comments. Much love <3 Was wondering people's best strategies for levels 0-100. I start with malachite and start building towards Jade, EG's, EE and whatever other good towers I can but struggle to know when to repick or go for an important tower like a bloodstone or EG in the center to get kills. Also, still messing around with getting kills on towers - when should I be fully upgrading a malachite? I feel like too early and it takes away more kills from the more important towers. Thanks all!

Poske - 2024-09-07 3:07:21.994692

Anyone know of warcraft 3 gamemode which has more than 50 levels. I am playing Gem TD+ 1.6.14 and its lit, but level 50 is the last one. There are slates (traps they can walk over + they are often auras), you can reposition any 2 things you placed every 10 turns (costs 10 mana you gain 1 per turn) Its essentially this game but polished but I wish I had more levels XD.

WGW - 2024-09-05 20:54:01.944057

I never really disagreed with changing any of the gem/tower stats, to be clear, @216. What I kept pushing back on was all the comments suggesting a jade nerf and no other changes. I still fully believe that this would only make the game more luck dependent, which to me is a bad thing. But nerfing the jade ALONG WITH other changes could certainly work. But only as part of a set of changes that would either significantly rebalance or alter the game. It was making the game more luck-dependent that I disagreed with-- and still do!

216 - 2024-09-05 12:04:32.306004

There was a sanbox (just a lot gold at start), but no longer works. Anyway, no need sanbox to get gems u need. Jades generate quite much gold in late game, after lvl 41 hp grows lineary and noting else changes (speed, armor, weaknees same) - nothing challenging after lvl 200. In flash version you were instantly losing game if 1 leak after 195, here you can leak a lot. The limiting factor is having enough space to put 5 gems to start new lvl - WGW pretty much reached the limit (lvl 1301). Maybe possible to push very few lvls more. Btw @WGW, do you aggre now that jades needs little nerf? ( which won't solve problem of balance, need more changes, just always was felling its allowed to leak too much)

Randomguy - 2024-09-05 4:57:27.740908

Is there a sandbox mode where you can just place combined gems while making the maze? I think it would be interesting to see how far you can go with a maze already filled with the gems you needed.

WGW - 2024-09-03 5:10:19.877788

And. . . I see now that wasn't my only error. I mixed up flawless and normal throughout that whole comment. Sorry for the confusion.

WGW - 2024-09-03 5:07:42.470230

Correction, I wrote "flawed amethysts", I meant normal. Sigh.

WGW - 2024-09-03 2:44:58.465838

@216, yes, I kept restarting until I was able to build a jade at level 10 I think. Maybe a level or two higher or lower than that (the runs all blend together in my head). Certainly very, very lucky early gem picks (e.g., also getting two flawed opals or emeralds to combine into a flawless by level 4). Also needed really good luck to combine two flawed amaethysts into a flawless to handle air troops up to level 20 or so (I can't even take an early flawed amethyst cause I'm not going to be building any bloodstones!) And of course the good RNG of getting a very early great opal. So a lot of very lucky things have to line up perfectly to even have a chance. "Lucky" does eventually lose its meaning, though, if you're willing to restart endlessly! In the end I had only 6 dark emeralds (in two clusters of 3 near the center), 7 golds (!), and around 22 jades (!!!) I don't remember the exact numbers, didn't bother taking a screenshot-- but I know I had exactly one rose crystal, one black opal, and one great opal, and all the rest of the non-paraibas were jades, so whatever number that works out to, it was over 20. It would really have required a LOT fewer restarts if I'd built a malachite *after* the first turn as you suggested! I feel pretty dumb for not thinking of that. But long term it's better not to. Even more than the bloodstone, the malachite will really become totally useless in the upper levels, so you're better off building one of the more useful towers if you can get away with it. But a malachite sure would have made the early levels easy, and at a cost of only one turn rather than three.

Poske - 2024-09-02 23:08:19.365714

WGW I am very much aware that proving that you are not cheating is an incredibly mundane task of many hours but at the end of the day its neccessary for us to be really sure. I am playing warcraft original gem towerdefense, I cracked the newest version.. Its way better than this Green is good meta with nonsense bugs.. + Slates add extra depth.

216 - 2024-09-02 0:05:39.224578

Starting from fS.. little challenging to not lose lives in first lvls (did few attempts, still 2 leaks in 8). And getting no NO + NE untill lvl 12 is another reason to reset i guess? I had idea of starting form chipped aqua, and combining malachite later - 2 turns more (I don't say "saved turns" because you literally reversed meaning of it - i would say 1-hitting jade/other gem saves 2 turns to build it, while for you it means 2 lvl less to fill board, so you can never click "combine special" in that case) Realized much time ago that building 2nd RC is completly not nessesary. Intuition can suggest that is worth to cover all flying path with armor reduction, but in fact u need it only for burst zones. Covering c2-c3 and mid-c6 line+ some after c6 should be fine - just 1 RC near middle. I'm still curious of exac amount of EE/jades/EGs in that 1301 lvl run.

WGW - 2024-09-01 12:09:54.204102

Thanks for the congrats! :) @216, there's definitely a big jump in "difficulty" between getting to level 1280 and to level 1300, yes, just because you're SO constricted in how many non-paraiba towers you can build. I've been doing a few things differently to squeeze out those extra turns. E.g., I skip the initial malachite now and go straight away for a jade (I just restart until I draw two chipped sapphires on the first turn to combine them into a flawed). That saves 3 turns right there. I also no longer build a second rose crystal, and skip the bloodstone entirely. The cantrally located bloodstone I used to build ends up being completely useless for ground troops the last 400 levels, since they don't get anywhere the center of the maze by the point. So you end up racking up all these kills on a bloodstone that becomes almost totally useless. Since you can only afford to build about 35 non-paraiba towers TOTAL to get to level 1300, you really have to be stingy about what you build (my layout has the same number of max blocks as you wrote, @216. I'm not sure it's possible to squeeze in any more than this, especially if you haven't figured out a way to either!) But the biggest difference in my past few runs (aside from restarting if I don't get a great opal by level 50 now-- I used to wait till 150) is that I decided to go all in on gold production rather than really trying to maintain the ability to kill air enemies. I basically flipped around the ratio of dark emeralds to jades, so I end up with relatively weak stun power (but not none, since jades DO stun), but I'm earning so much gold it doesn't matter. Instead of having 22 or so dark emeralds with around 5 jades, I had over 20 jades and only a handful of dark emeralds. My time score is much lower than prior runs because I was leaking so many enemies. There's a lot of restarts required to get the right picks to even try this-- just managing to build an initial jade without the game throwing useless gem picks at you requires dozens of restarts (though they're fast), not to mention restarting any game where I don't get a very great opal. So that's a whole additional layer of "not fun at all", restarting over and over, in addition to the tedium of playing out the last, oh, THOUSAND levels. :) None of this approach is in keeping with how the game was really meant to be played!

superrichdom - 2024-08-29 12:38:25.787053

@WGW Congrats on your 1301! I reached level 1096 this week. I know I could do better, but it took me so much time that I didn't find it fun either. However, I don't know which version of the game I can play that would be both challenging and fun. Any idea?

216 - 2024-08-29 12:24:07.409155

1301 actually IS impressive. The max amount of gems possible is 341 (proof if im wrong), but making a paraiba require 8 empty spaces, last 7 spaces allow to make 1 other special gem and 2 last turns. So max possible lvl if only paraiba were build(so impossible) is 334 x 4 + 5 = 1341 Great opal reduce it by 3 lvls. Want start form malachite? (possible other starts) again -3 (1335). Every other special gem -1. So only 34 other gems are allowed to reach lvl 1301, let say: 1 BO, 1RC, 1 ABS, 3 EGs, 8 jades, 20 EEs. I'm curious what gems did u choose and how close i was (any screenshot?) the jump form 1280 to 1301 is REALLY big. run with 50+ other gems allowed don't sound any challenging to to, just need to make proper maze with rocks and remove them later. 34 (or 36 if no lvl 1 malachite) gems sound much more challenging. Did u start form lvl 1 malachite? Anyway i wish this game was about killing enemies instead end of space :)

WGW - 2024-08-29 6:52:12.967387

Thanks very much for defending me, @lesserleaf and @216. Believe me, I had no intention of engaging any further with this obvious troll. I mean, when someone says something like, you're cheating "until proven otherwise", there's no point in more discussion. Even a 200 hour long video with every level recorded isn't absolute proof, since-- news flash!-- videos can be manipulated, too. It's the classic logical conundrum of not being able to prove a negative. But dragging in autism as an "insult"? Well, as far as I'm concerned, that shows @Poske to be not only trolling, but just a garbage person generally. So I won't clutter the comments here by feeding this troll any further. They can believe whatever they want. I really only kept trying to get higher scores out of pure addiction, and a somewhat perverse sense of self-challenge. I don't expect anyone to care AT ALL, let alone be *IMPRESSED*, by my being obsessive enough to play a repetitive, tedious game for 200 hours, well beyond the point that it can even be considered a game anymore (I'm not making any meaningful decisions after level 200 or so, just building paraiba after paraiba endlessly). Meanwhile, I've finally gotten my long sought-after level 1300+ score (level 1301), in a run which I started a few days before being accused of cheating. . . I'm sure that if @Poske doesn't believe my earlier scores, they won't believe this one, either. And guess what? I don't give a crap! :) And though I've said this before when I got earlier high scores, I really, truly think this is just about the upper limit possible. There would theoretically be room on the board for more moves if I built fewer non-paraiba towers early on, but you absolutely need some of the other towers to survive until the really late levels. In any event, I'm never going to try for a higher level score again. It's really not fun at all!

216 - 2024-08-27 20:20:05.950366

Looks like Poske is just trolling...but he also posted a comment with interesting ideas about game before. So, a) he got bored and started trolling WGW b) he was doing something wrong that didn't allow him to stabilize run, so he got mad and started accusing every1 of cheating. I can see only 1 submitted score from him, lvl 100 with 17k time, so option b is possible. Time suggest he underestimated dmg of EGs on amethyst weakness (while it's true that jades and EEs are most important gems, EGs help a lot, espec before 100), maybe he forgot about RC? I could say more if i could see screenshot ofc, just in case he is not trolling :) Accusing WGW - GTD legend, activelly discussing with dev and others since 2013, (he didn't even hold top score for long in both flash and html5 version) is completly ridiculous ( Please don't feed the troll by trying to proof that more) In fact, the true is that videos starting form lvl 400 are pointless - all important happends in first ~200 lvls (first 100 more important), slowly filling map with paraibas is not interesting and no problem to imagine it. Good for me that Poske wasn't here in 2020...(defeaating 196 was much harder than getting 1200+ now)

Lesserleaf - 2024-08-27 15:25:15.189332

That seems a bit personal and rude Poske, why exactly are you so set on the fact that WGW is cheating, seems to me like they've provided plenty of evidence, added up to the fact that plenty have people have been able to get to 500 plus. The reason you would use a Paraiba early is so that you can afford to make your maze smaller and more concentrated right up to the limit of letting grounds get to the last waypoint but no further. Which makes even more sense if you're going late to the point where space is a limiting factor. Unless there is any evidence that WGW is cheating, then I think in this case it seems to me that assuming they are not cheating until proven otherwise is the more reasonable stance.

Poske - 2024-08-25 14:03:21.859815

WGW Share your instagram so that we can see how fun at parties you are :) , bet you look like an autist. Oh wait the only fullfillment you get in your life is by stroking your ego after cheating and self proclaiming yourself as some sort of Gem tower defense prodigy in a tower defense game which has 10 unique monthly players. You are exploiting the extension until proven otherwise

WGW - 2024-08-23 11:45:42.894446

You must be a lot of fun at parties.

Poske - 2024-08-23 11:24:19.349326

WGW sry but nothing you said is convincing. Starting at level 473 clown emoji... You could have HTML stun cheated enemies prior to that point and only stopped cheating once the field was filled with Green meta. The mazes are already filled up by level 140 let alone 473. Unless you have the entire gameplay from level 1 to 1300 its not ever gonna convince me or anyone with a fking functioning brain... * Giving tips to noobs isn't any sort of proof and the fact that you invest in Paraibas early on in super sus * Screenshots dont prove anything.. you can remove the extension from the view... Look there are bad cheaters who make it obvious and there are people who can make it look ambigious that they cheated and you are the latter.

WGW - 2024-08-22 1:08:37.937302

For full disclosure, conscience dictates that I acknowledge that I *DO* shamelessly exploit the "combine special" bug in every run I play (see prior discussions if you don't know what this is). I would have much less control over gem picks/tower placement if I wasn't exploiting this bug, but (a) it's not an absolute necessity, it just makes things "easier", and (b) I've not only been totally open in the comments here about exploiting this bug, I've tried to help other folks learn how to exploit it, too. But that's the only thing I do that could possibly be considered, by a wildly-stretched definition, to be "cheating"-- if you consider it cheating to exploit an in-game bug that absolutely everyone has equal ability to exploit in-game, with no external tools like CheatEngine or mucking around with HTML5 required. And now I'm going to shut up about this! :)

WGW - 2024-08-22 0:55:59.870951

Thanks for backing me up, @216! People can believe whatever they're going to believe, of course, so I'm not going to bother "defending" my high scores any further, except to note: (1) One of the runs I posted to YT has videos starting at level 473-- not level 800 (did you even look at the videos?)-- goes all the way to level 1150, and is close to 100 hours long, shortened only by virtue of my snipping out most of the dead time if waiting for enemies to get killed. If that's not convincing enough video "proof" for you, well. . . (2) I've posted lord knows how many screenshots of my runs over the years at varying stages of play. Those image links are all still here in the comment history. And then, of course, there's. . . (3) I've spent countless hours discussing the game and giving advice to newer players (and have enjoyed the discussions more than the game itself for ages now!) I think it's abundantly clear to anyone who has been following the comments page for any significant period of time that I know the game inside and out. And that I'm hopelessly addicted to playing it, constantly. But if you want to believe I faked high scores that actually took me hundreds of hours over weeks of my life to achieve, well, have at it. I confess, I cheated. I couldn't resist the glory.

216 - 2024-08-21 20:46:34.149489

Obviously there is many ways to cheat in html5 game ... but what is the point of cheating in such unpopular, single-player game? Well few ppl submited fake scores (really idk what satisfaction they had from it), but do you really think that someone which is active in comments for YEARS is cheating?? I don't have patience of going for lvl 1000+ (game needs rebalance), but no doubts that such GTD-addict as WGW have. Paraiba also reduce armor of grounds, which speed up lvls (but I wish their dmg was buffed). @Jonathan A: extreme speedruns are a completly different thing (mostly spam aoe gems near c1), looking at scores my best time was 876.. but "PANDABANANA" did 830, hard to beat it, need many attempts (or luck). Survival GO speedruns and GOless speed runs can be different things as well, difference may be less than you can expect, but still significant. Once i lost in 92 with 4,7k time (GOless)

POSKE - 2024-08-21 18:23:35.023883

WGW I have youtube channel as well I have seen some of your videos but the thing is unless that video is 10 days long maybe somewhat shorter if speed up (apolagies if it is) its not trustworthy.. The problem is I could hit level 1300 and make it seem like it was legit via youtube as well by showcasing idk level 800-830 part, none would ever know Cheating turns gem tower defense in occupy every spot on the level and just grind a lot once you cheat. You can farm up gold and bloodstone level by cheat freezing enemies, and its not hard to emulate a skilled High elo maze and fill it up with known best gems... The problem is I don't even trust anyone who uses Paraibas because that shit is a bait gem with only 1 purpose of: having more time to fill up the field. And when I see bunch of Paraibas I just dont believe a player lasted that long unless they were all summoned late game which would have to be checked by hovering and their levels. or a video footage... In any case gem tower defense needs an update... Green is good meta, bugs, cheating... Nice recent screenshots guys clearly htlm5 speed hack used. We can see the extension

superrichdom - 2024-08-20 20:36:45.307777

Reached lvl 1000 for the first time! https://imgur.com/a/0z7pLPZ

Jonathan A - 2024-08-20 1:07:04.378664

https://i.imgur.com/Qb5tfeq.png @216: My attempt... Utterly didn't stand a chance. +2000 Time. Maybe we ought to ban GO haha. 2 one shot pink diamond what can you do. Great idea, I'll keep trying between this and extreme time.

216 - 2024-08-17 20:52:09.512481

Managed to beat lvl 100 below 5k seconds: https://imgur.com/PCie962 GO in 41, several 1-turn gems (3x (!) jade, 1 EG 1 BS), bad time in 40( about 1300, lack of opals before 35), no leaks untill 56, 31 leaks in 56-100 (8 in 100). - - - - - - - - @Poske: agree with most things, sadly looks like Peter dont have time to fix anything any time soon. I inspected the code much time ago and know reasons of most bugs, some require to change just 1 variable to fix.. I wish that Great gems were great... GAq, GA and GT should be buffed but aren't as useless to call them a "bait" (GS,GR,GE and GD are) Really was suprised when noticed that GE was nerfed in copare to flash version( where was useless too). also GR got massive nerf( it was generally worse than BS anyway), it needs to have 2x more dmg to matter now. Some about uraniuim gem: main problem with it is caused by MINIMUM SPEED BUG, atm the min. speed in late lvls is about 95% of their max speed, while intended was about 70%. Also why uranium dmg do not ignore armor anymore... anyway it do a bit dmg, its not a good gem but not as useless. SYS: most bugged gem in the game. Copied stats form not upgraded version ( was supposed to have 180 base dmg ,800 cd, 121 range) and aura overrides. SYS aura never was stacking with BO, but its aoe slow was making this gem a bit usefull( in flash version) BO too OP?? compare to perfect/geat opal.. (just in case: PO is not 35% buff, its /0.65, so over 50% buff, GO is x2) Stun is op, but only in later game, so i had idea of (increasing) partial stun resistance in later lvls.

WGW - 2024-08-17 15:36:33.869616

I hope you're not including my scores in your blanket comment that you "don't believe any top score at all"-- I've posted videos to YouTube of some of my runs. I don't cheat. See my channel here: https://www.youtube.com/@garyw.2161 The scores from TTJ and PADOC *might* be legit, might not (I commented on this ages ago). But all the scores from "HELL YEAH", "monday" and "bob" are unquestionably faked-- you only need to look at the stats to know that they're impossible. Just for the record!

Poske Yugituber - 2024-08-17 1:12:59.172327

How to cheat: (I dont believe any top score at all) Download HTML5 universal speed hack extension 1. Set timeout + performance + 10x speed ll freeze enemies you have to click on extension sometimes to unfreeze.... but while they are "frozen" stunned you just kill them all If you use Request animation they wont freeze... if you want fair fast gameplay that is required.

Jonathan A - 2024-08-15 15:04:32.535130

Great ideas Poske

Poske - 2024-08-15 14:55:31.774473

Message to the DEVS Bugs: * 4 Identical stones don't combine an extra evolution. Rumor says 5 needed * Combine Special sometimes deletes wrong gems. It deletes duplicates of the special recipe, Some people are exploiting this to save the Perfect ones but its super annoying when you don't foresee it and it deletes a perfect gem. Boolean to confirm would fix. I emailed about this in detail. * Star yellow sapphire overrides Black opal. I got lucky and sacked SYS only for him to reduce the dmg of my towers by 35% (could be visual bug). Maybe its 45% who knows * Jade has so many effects we cant see the gold giving one. We cant scroll it. Balance improvement idea for Survival mode (Extreme mode should also have more levels btw) Great Gems outside of Opal are a bait. Great players avoid them. * Great Ruby missile should do piercing (line) dmg, also +28 range * Great Topaz atks (each) should chain to 1 nearby enemy (28 range) once each. * Great Emerald should do %Current hp dmg with its poison * Great Amethys should do 300% more dmg (lineary) the lower the targets HP * Great Aquamarine should ramp up in Atk speed and dps (slowly ramps down when not attacking, has a ramp up cap of like 7) * Great Diamond upgrade allows you to keep 2 gems (3 rocks) in next turns pick * Great Sapphire should stun for 0.5 seconds once its slow ends Some special recipes are also a bait in games survival mode. Great players avoid them We are currently in a GREEN IS GOOD META... Many green towers = optimal * Star ruby and its upgrades are a bait, it should increase chance effect of nearby towers by +1%, +2%, +3% as well as give player a new option: combine gems via combine buttom outside of place and pick phase. * Star Yellow Sapphire should increase attack range (non aura) of nearby towers by like 26 because as it stands its to similar to Opal and its just a bait to ever make it or choose gems which go into it * Fully upgraded Pink diamond should give 1 life for every 5 kills it gets * Uranium is strong in non survival mode but utterly pointless in survival mode. As such it should remove the slow ressist by large % of nearby enemies... This wouldn't effect non survival modes as slow immunity is more OP in survival OP towers: * Black Opals are OP their % buffs should be nerfed by 5% at each level * Great Emerald is OP stun duration lowered by 0.2 seconds. Note this was a carefully thought out suggestion. But maybe someone has even better ideas. Nonetheless if devs ever come back and need some inspiration I am sure this post is a good place. At level 800 you should be able to delete any GEM (Altho this QOL change affects like 10 people worldwide)

Poske - 2024-08-15 13:18:03.653772

test

WGW - 2024-08-15 13:12:05.274235

@Simoncello: There's only one tower that benefits from NOT upgrading, the bloodstone-- that's the ONLY one. And that's only for early levels. Once you have enough dark emeralds to reliably stunlock enemies, the upgraded bloodstone is more effective (usually I upgrade around bloodstones around level 80 or so). @LesserLeaf, looks like a good run. I would suggest, though, in future runs, not wasting the important center spaces of the layout with malachites. You only really need one (sometimes I build two if I'm forced to by bad picks), and I think it's better to put it in the middle of the upper left quadrant. Malachites are vital in early game, but end up being quite useless once you build a single bloodstone. And it's important to control, as much as possible, which towers get enemies kills so that you can upgrade their power. You don't want very weak towers like malachites leaching kills from powerful towers, like Egyptian golds, bloodstones, and paraibas. Interesting that you mentioned delaying enemy kills in early levels to give jades more time to earn gold-- I don't remember anyone ever talking about this before in the comments here, but I do this as well, and it really helps give you some more wiggle room for repicks early on! Oh, and not that anyone should care, but I lost my potential level 1300 run thanks to my cat jumping on the computer mouse when the pointer just happened to be hovering on the "Close Window" button. At level 730. The odds on losing a run in this particular way must be around the same odds of ever getting an uberstone. Somehow I still love him. ;)

LesserLeaf - 2024-08-13 21:52:30.484137

https://imgur.com/a/YEVH5j3 I think this is the run, @WGW right on two counts, the PT helped reduce the need for bloodstones and took all pressure off grounds being ever an issue, and the early great opal is the run that suddenly looked promising @Simoncello A couple of reasons, you might want to prioritise a damaging gem leveling up while you're not losing lives in the early game, or let grounds live longer to get more early jade gold, but I think the main example you see (as I found out a few days ago) is that un-upgraded bloodstone has way more aoe damage and therefore more total damage, so for the majority of the game is more effective

Simoncello - 2024-08-13 21:28:16.827801

Hi, I'm new here and I don't understand the logic of waiting to upgrade gems. Why isn't it better to upgrade them as soon as possible? Don't they get better earlier that way?

Superrichdom - 2024-08-12 15:19:26.514871

Lvl 746 and still going... I didn't remember how long the lvls are at this point... starting to get realllllly bored and next thing you know, my laptop will suddenly restart! https://imgur.com/QBDjtUO

LesserLeaf - 2024-08-11 17:02:04.087221

@Jonathan A I like that map, same kind of design philosophy as the diagonal style ones i'm using. The placing you've described is interesting, I tend to pile everything into the middle. Specifically golds I spread out everywhere since a lot of the value comes from the armor shred and that doesn't stack. I also tend to go for jades asap and upgrade them before I finish the lives because it's such an accelerant in the early game. Seems like you're investing a lot into placing to really level up your central damage. I'm struggling at the moment to consistently break 100, Usual strat it 2-4 bloodstones in the middle, wrapped in golds, dark emeralds and jades. One perfect Amethyst and one Opal with one red crystal for flyers. I usually reroll 2/3 times a turn to hunt for Emeralds. Anyone diverge from that significantly?

Jonathan A - 2024-08-09 23:47:47.746037

https://i.imgur.com/srUkUoc.png sample run ala jon, level 8 EG at wave 28. Common to lose some lives this way but I think it's acceptable. Still doing my one maze, it's scripted now so, makes it even more of a habit. Other noteworthy thing, placing jades only where golds cannot reach the center.

WGW - 2024-08-09 15:25:35.204106

Malachite, 100%. For a long time I didn't even think it was possible to get a good run going starting with a silver tower, but @Jonathan A has had good runs starting without EITHER a silver or a malachite, so I've been proven wrong! But there's no question that it's a lot easier to get a good run going with a starting malachite, especially if you allow it to get most of the kills for the first 30 or so levels. I can see now how not building paraibas would help with air levels, since they're only really effective against ground enemies and you have to spend four turns building them. It's always interesting to me when I see folks take a completely approach!

LesserLeaf - 2024-08-09 13:58:07.419233

Oh another question wanted to ask you guys, Malachite or silver to start?

LesserLeaf - 2024-08-09 13:53:17.560549

@WGW I tend not to have any problem with grounds, and if any are leaking then the run tends not to be strong enough to hold against the flyers leaking between 100 and 200 @Jonathan A I'm trying it out shortened again, so at early levels it looks like this https://imgur.com/a/cK5Vva7

Jonathan A - 2024-08-08 18:52:02.677384

I like the diagonal maze, especially with the bulge, I could see myself switching to it from my trusty spiral. WGW, glad to hear you took a look at it, let me know if you try it out further, I can explain everything if it's too complicated (I can agree it seems intimidating at first, take a while to learn the damage types, it's just starting to stick 100% in my head, and a few other mechanics).

WGW - 2024-08-08 15:56:24.082636

@LesserLeaf, do have something against paraibas??? I'm kinda amazed you got this far without building any!

LesserLeaf - 2024-08-05 15:38:29.425510

https://imgur.com/a/3xWNrHQ Ok took your advice Modified the diagonal maze to make it shorter, and added a central bulge to concentrate more towers on the middle crossroads, also mixed in some bloodstones, think I might be hosed here at level 200 and the stun proof flyers.

216 - 2024-08-05 11:18:15.900271

BS has insane aoe dmg. ABS(upgraded BS) deals top dps on long stunned target. Diagonal maze take much space for middle towers, which is bad for killing flyers/time score/lvl score at end of space Anyway, with enough jades you rather won't lose

LesserLeaf - 2024-08-04 22:38:29.045971

Wanted to share my maze and a question, https://imgur.com/gallery/gtd-maze-diagonal-rows-FAa3nvm This is the cleanest design i've figured so far, my question is, why are you all using bloodstone?

Alexander Harper - 2024-08-03 16:15:35.297931

I noticed this site was down for a while. I'm super excited its back up! I was wondering if you have a git repo for it? I'd like to spin up an instance, if I can.

WGW - 2024-08-02 16:46:53.171454

@Jonathan A, thanks for the pointer to Actiona, I'll check it out! I took a quick look at the WC3 game and my head just spun from how complicated it looks to learn. I haven't given a real try though, maybe I'll love it.

WGW - 2024-08-02 16:43:57.288713

@superrichdom, I think I'm the only one who ever complains about the fake high scores. :) Nice to see I'm not completely alone in being bugged by it!

superrichdom - 2024-08-01 12:25:49.707876

It is not the first time someone says this, but will the fake high scores be removed from the leaderboard one day?

Jonathan A - 2024-08-01 0:31:30.758442

Btw, yall might be interested in *drumroll* another TD from wc3: You TD https://youtd2.com/ Right now I'm playing both. Let me know if anyone can beat my record of level 125 (extreme total random). Maybe can save WGW from endless Gem TD despair. These two are definitely my all time favorite TDs, along with Eeve TD.

Jonathan A - 2024-07-30 19:09:43.000452

WGW, sure it's called Actiona, I'm on linux don't know if it exists on Windows/Mac but I'm sure there are many options out there. Here is a "demonstration" https://youtu.be/zo4Ha6wB8ng As you can see I can reroll the starting gem super fast which is the main benefit. Another benefit is upgrading changes automatically, so I won't forget. Once the maze is complete not much use of it as far as I can tell.

WGW - 2024-07-30 2:49:26.233052

#Jonathan A: Can you tell me what program you're using to automate the mouse clicks? I should check it out.

WGW - 2024-07-30 2:47:38.254707

Oh, I mess up runs all the time due to non-game factors (like hitting refresh accidentally)! Just today I lost a run which should have gotten me to level 1300 because Windows Update decided to reboot my PC while I was sleeping. It's incredibly frustrating. A few things that might help, if you're not doing them already: (1) Run GTD in a separate browser window (reduces accidental clicks), (2) Open the game via right-clicking and selecting "Open link in new tab" (prevents the browser's "back" button from being click-able, one less place to accidentally end a run), (3) Temporarily disable Windows Update (which, obviously, I forgot to do this time!!!) Sorry to hear about the accidental loss-- now imagine how frustrating it is when you let something like that happen on level 1043 or something after two weeks of playing. :)

DC - 2024-07-29 17:31:28.733246

Well true to form, I accidentally hit refresh and killed the run at level 275. I legitimately don't know how @WGW does this for like weeks without accidentally clicking a link or something lol.

Jonathan A - 2024-07-26 21:34:02.066736

Yeah I remember seeing this maze from a number of pros, and I kind of assumed it's the meta.

DC - 2024-07-26 20:02:49.897950

Just want to flag that I absolutely yoinked this maze design from SCGMeister, I claim no credit for quality haha. I think WGW kind of already said it, but basically every 7 loop map works. The problem is almost always creating kill/stun zones efficiently to kill flyer levels, which will drain way more lives way earlier than any melee level.

Jonathan A - 2024-07-26 19:35:39.255850

Btw, I am using a program that lets me automate mouse clicks, so I can really fast place the 5 starting gems and reset the game in one click, in case I don't get my beloved flawed diamond haha. Run it a few times and I'm good to go.

Jonathan A - 2024-07-26 18:05:25.567190

Thanks WGW! Seems like it's a bit more complicated then, they shape of the maze may have less importance than I thought.

WGW - 2024-07-26 16:43:29.736098

fwiw, I don't (really, I actually can't) maximize firepower in the center of the maze the way I play. In order to maximize the number of turns and fill as many spaces as possible-- while still leaving the ground troop path long enough to insure they're all killed-- I have to leave a lot of rocks in the center until very late game. But if you're *not* playing for maximum turns/level, it's probably better to centralize fire power. I don't think there's an "optimal" maze. The key thing is that you make a maze that requires 7 passes for the ground troops to get to the exit, and that the path winds along enough amidst the attack power to kill them all. I used to have to extend the maze path a LOT more when I was still figuring out how many of each tower (other than paraibas) I really need and where they should be placed. You really can't afford to leak ground enemies (except on the no-stun levels after level 50), so it's better to create a winding path until you get a feel for where and how many of each tower to build. I try to get at least one Egyptian Gold, (unupgraded) Bloodstone and paraiba, 2 Jades, and a centrally placed perfect opal and Mystic Black Opal by level 40, all near the center. Beyond that, I try to spread out fire power (in particular the armor reducing towers). By level 150, I want to have 6 or 7 EGs, covering the entire ground and air troop paths, 5 to 7 jades (spread apart, not clustered, so you're always potentially earning gold no matter where the enemies are on the map), as many Emeralds as possible (placed in clusters of 3 or 4 to create distinct stunlock zones). . . and of course, a great opal. That's my approach, anyway! @216 had a very different strategy. :)

Jonathan A - 2024-07-26 15:03:49.290707

Can anyone explain the motivation behind the optimal maze? I'm looking at this one now from DC: https://imgur.com/a/u2ItfeI Would this be considered the optimal way and if so why? My theory is you want to maximize amount of gems close to the crossing point, while minimizing ground unit path, although you need enough maze and range to deal with the ground units.

Nina - 2024-07-26 11:27:24.359661

OMG its back!!!! Thank you so much!!!

WGW - 2024-07-26 5:55:49.403896

Thanks, Peter! Sort of. ;) No, seriously, I remain immensely grateful that you created and have maintained this game for all these years. My inability to control whether I keep playing it is, well, my own personal demon to battle. Which I'm already losing to, since I of course have a run going as I type this. Good luck with that run, #DC-- definitely a solid start!

AVITONE - 2024-07-26 5:06:35.900977

I was such an addict I was still playing after the site went down using archived versions of the game. Even though I could not post high scores it was still fun. Frustratingly I had my best game during that time.

Jonathan A - 2024-07-26 0:34:37.993621

Peter, no worries! I can only appreciate all the work you've done, and probably does us all good to get a break lol, even though it has been missed. @Wgw, I know what you mean. Thankfully I'm content reaching level 250 something, just gonna play the early levels for fun from time to time.

Jonathan A - 2024-07-26 0:25:56.030532

WTF, lucker! @DC

DC - 2024-07-25 16:57:58.730938

https://imgur.com/a/u2ItfeI Big blessings in our first run back, let's gooooooooo.

DC - 2024-07-25 15:55:44.173291

Oh shit we're back! The site went down the day after my last run overheated my computer so I was legit wondering if I had somehow gotten IP banned from Gem TD or something haha. Gotta relearn everything, going dry for 4 months has made me rusty.

Peter Holko - 2024-07-25 15:48:18.888021

@wgw @Jonathan A Apologies my alerting wasn't working and I didn't notice the site was down.

WGW - 2024-07-24 0:55:11.457403

(Correction, sorry-- max number of turns is more than 1300, I don't remember the number. But it's definitely under 1400-- and besides, this would only be possible if you literally built no other tower than paraibas since your first turn, which is completely impossible.)

WGW - 2024-07-24 0:53:31.612010

Oh, and the new top high score by "monday" is an obvious fake, too. It's absolutely impossible to get to level 1420 (the absolute max of turns you can make before running out of space is less than 1300), let alone get to level 1400 within 14,842 seconds. Sometimes I swear people post these fake scores just to annoy me in particular, since no one else seems to give a crap about it. . . !

WGW - 2024-07-24 0:50:22.987375

@Jonathan, I've been checking every few days ever since the site went down-- it can't have been restored more than a couple of days ago. I don't know whether to be delighted or horrified, since this undoubtedly means I will once again be dedicating an insane number of hours of my life to playing this again. Endlessly! (Which is why I never tried to send Peter H. an email to ask what happened-- I did have his email address even though the site was down because we've exchanged a handful of messages over the years, but I figured it was probably better for my mental health that the site was down. ;) I note that the high score list is already spammed with several new quite obviously impossible, fake top scores by "HELL YEAH". But what else is new!

Jonathan A - 2024-07-21 20:18:31.630791

We're back boys!!! What happened? I'm surprised I'm the first one commenting. I suppose it got back up very recently.

DC - 2024-03-20 7:17:05.404335

Sad update. Got my run up to 597 when my CPU overheated and my computer automatically shut down - still not sure how it got so hot, i was just running Chrome, maybe need to switch to Edge. Had counted my remaining spaces, theoretically could've reached 1048 (or 1100ish blocking off a final passageway and relying on life buying), but obviously the difficulty is actually grinding it out so RIP. A bit demoralized right now - I have nothing to show for 3 days of work and also my previous best was 196 so I have no idea how rare a run that good will be. Maybe will take a day off and then try again.

216 - 2024-03-20 1:57:21.626561

There is no "normal" leak amount, i can build enough EEs in such places that will force 0 leaks (let say in 99% cases, need about 30 EEs in lvl ~200) - with worse time, so i wont do it anymore. In flash version stopping all was easier ( but needed) - there was ways to place 18 EEs (forgot how many EGs, jades) with 90% chance for 0 leaks in 196 ( simulated!) I kept 2 BS (despite they had less kill than i wanted, 100+ and 60) and I built many ABS.

Jonathan A - 2024-03-20 0:14:48.486769

Thanks for your insightful feedback. Didn't look at the BS late enough, I think they had 20-100 kills each. Yeah I feel reluctant to upgrade. Besides it seems I did really well only leaking 2 air on average. How many air is normal to leak? Yeah I considered making sure to take down the stunned ones up right to free up the emeralds. But now that I think about it, my idea was kind of to lock down 2-3 up there for however long, limiting how many pass through middle at once. After adding EEs at the very end I got 0 leaks several times.

216 - 2024-03-19 23:30:40.864086

600-1k, depends of maze. How many kills that 4 BS have?(you didnt decide to upgrade any this time) 0 in 250 then 1 leak in 302 - sound strange. I think that upper right part of map is key to understand why it could happen - there are stun zones with nearly 0 dmg, 1 enemy can take many EEs attention for very long time. in your burst zone you have few EEs so maybe they can stop and kill 1-2 every pass. With bad enoguh luck too many times enemy escape from stun zone near mid while all upper EEs were busy on 1-2 (killing 1 every pass is not enough). Idk if exacly that happened, but its how i imagine it Were upper EEs attacking sometihng when it leaked or you didnt look?

Jonathan A - 2024-03-19 22:33:45.795072

0 air leaks 296 (100% leak 300), 1 leak 302.

Jonathan A - 2024-03-19 22:09:53.833448

0 leaks at 250 and 0 leaks 252 :D I think I'll just "speed through", not repicking, just to get on the highscore. So is 800 when you get a full map if not building PT?

216 - 2024-03-19 21:52:54.343586

Well, if u want quit before 800, why spam PT :) You could prepare for lvl 250 (extra maze, more PT). I leaked 4 in 250, one with 4k hp :(

Jonathan A - 2024-03-19 20:38:54.459595

https://imgur.com/aAwokK9 New personal best 245. This seems to go on for ever again, considering to quit. Time to PT? Leaking 2.

DC - 2024-03-19 5:34:04.965042

Finally on a good run: https://imgur.com/a/mqSpFRM Got a super early Great Opal (like before Lvl30), started churning out EEs and EGs (centered EGs at first, tossed a few in outer stun zones at the end). At this point I'm in a pretty good spot - aside from X00 levels, flyer levels have been leaking 3 max - so thinking about starting to go full PTs. Just wanted to check with the experts for future reference - was this overkill? Should I have stopped like six emeralds ago? Also will I still need more jades to combat future life price increases? Thanks all for the advice - have learned a ton. Hoping to break into the leaderboards soon.

216 - 2024-03-19 2:00:41.340409

One thing may also suprise you on first survival run: lvls 50, 100 , 150,... have stun immunity.

216 - 2024-03-19 1:53:45.506569

I submited at least 1 easy run here, sadly time scores apparenty dont works well - lvl 50 scores arent sorted by time. But found my score, time was 668 ( 11 min ) Combine bug: "sometimes" when you combine special, 2 same gems are consumed. you can lose 2 pefects gems at once this way as well as save perfect gem. how to save PE: - first and most important build PE before any fT/FS is on the board - make fT and FS, but don't combine - make any part of EE and combine on it. initial PE will stay. Possible to make for example 2x FS, then fT and combine on 2nd FS - it also works. Generally combining on duplicates triggers bug, combining on first gem of any type don't. In facts EEs are less importnat than in flash version - you can leak after 196 and they do less dmg due to not implemented green dmg modifier (only pink dmg modifiers are implemented, so EGs works well) - - - - - - - - lvl 297 now, 24EE, still often leaking 2-3 (0 in 296). But with 8 jades it doesn't matter... Time is 29k, never before had time/lvl value below 100 for as long, soon will end run, have enoguh of hibernating PC again and again

mmkay - 2024-03-19 0:52:57.555919

@216 And yeah I dont know anything about this combine bug you mentioned. What's the story with that? thanks

mmkay - 2024-03-18 23:25:23.735994

Turns out there�s a gem tower defense category on speedrun.com with only 1 submitted run. It�s easy difficulty any% real-time. I decided to beat it and I submitted a 19:36 run. I�m certain any of you guys could beat that. The moderator was last online a year ago so I don�t think I will get verified any time soon though

216 - 2024-03-18 2:10:35.843343

True, PT is not needed early...but was leaks in 150? Also is true that killing grounds slower = more gold. But game is slow enough, why making it even slower... (i like getting better time scores) lvl 31 EG = 300 kills, right? Yes its high, at which lvl did you combine it? I started a survival run, first time since maybe 2022 and... PE in lvl 10 or 11, despite that leaked 1 flyer in lvl 12 (with 17 hp...) and 1 in lvl 20 (but didnt want to reset game), and GO in 44 :) Had about 12k time at 160 lvl 210 now, 18025 time. Had 3 jades untill 160, but added 2 more, because repicking quite much and intentionally have less EEs (17 now) to prevent ground untins being stucked long in low-dmg stunzone. but it causes to leak 1-4 air, life cost 16k = almost 130 total leaks (kepping 11 lives) Without early GO (very few leaks in 44, 48) i would have to build more EEs or jades

Jonathan A - 2024-03-17 23:41:20.575858

Jeez, got a GO but I placed the gems so fast it ended up in the bottom of the map. Always have to watch carefully what you're getting... Used the combine bug this time, I think I'm getting the hang of it...

Jonathan A - 2024-03-17 12:21:58.448868

Thanks. I avoided PT to focus on other gems, I think it isn't necessary, but maybe it is for higher levels. 19833s is much? If so then I think it's good because it means more gold generation :D Maybe gold isn't a problem once you get going on the higher levels though? Btw level 31 EG at level 160, is that exceptionally high or normal? My idea with EE at the right is to make them not stun the same target, but always target moving units.

216 - 2024-03-17 0:21:37.382096

Depends what means "enough" - you want to leak 0 every stunnable lvl, 0-1 or becasue crazy gold generation you dont care of 2-3 flying leaks. 20-25 is rather minimum, and its if correctly located. In fact, your stunpower of jades is over 3 EEs :) That rightmost EEs are strange and outside GO- you wanted stun on limited fragment i guess? but EG are placed exacly where they should be :) Build 1 PT for grounds, 19833s at 160...

Jonathan A - 2024-03-16 23:05:05.445786

https://imgur.com/MNsYt7K Ok I'm on a roll now. First time I get this far. I could use some advice. At this point, I started considering building paribas, is it too early? Should I repick as much as possible to get more golds? And what amount of emeralds is enough? I went crazy on the jades haha, less time repicking, gets me through faster and generates enough gold to buy lives.

216 - 2024-03-16 16:44:06.417195

@Jonathan A: i mean case where u get BS very early and it get like 200 kills. Because we build ABS mostly for flamestrikes ( flat dmg, not affect by kills or anything), i prefer to build new with 0 kills and save strong aoe gem. However, upgrading BS is NOT a mistake! I like aoe effect, which can do something on flyers as well (around 50 it can be really significant), but mostly speed up ground wawes. On single target ABS beats BS easilly just with shoot dmg(325 vs 136 base DPS), whille 200 kills one do as much as 70 kills EG and cast flamestrikes. How much that BS can do on flyers? sometimes 3 flyers get stunned in BS range for 2s (not rare case), let say distance 1st-3rd is over 57 range, so each attack cause 7 hits (middle flyer get most). assuming 4 armor on all ,GO, BO and 200 kills BS, each BS attack does 68 x 7 x 1.4 x 0.806 x 3 = 1611 dmg, so 8 attacks will do 12,9k total in just 2s ( middle flyer will get over 5k) and if other flyers are passing over them, they will take more. Similar 7-hit cases happen also if just one flyer is stunned and 2 are passing throught (but for short time). lvl 80 flyers have 75k hp so let say dmg done by such BS is not neglible. However single target dmg is more important, leaking 5 with 10% hp each hurts more than leaking 4 with 100% When we should upgrade BS - normlaly 100-160, but u can do it a bit eariel if you want or keep not upgraded if u like aoe. Keep in mind - 200 kills ABS will steal a lot of kills form EGs (ABS kills are not useless, but less effective than EG kills) - - - - - - - - EE positioning can be counterintuitive, but not in all aspects - placing EE in places that range 2 completly different path fragments is 100% correct way, let say first 15EEs should be in such places and very few single-role EE are worth after (also all should be covered by opal aura, but its rather obvious) I can't say that limiting coverage is the *only* way (but can say its the best way:)) - it solve some big problems with stun zones near middle.. could say more about it ... and probably will in future comments :)

Jonathan A - 2024-03-16 16:13:55.254622

Btw, maybe some people don't know this, the keyboard shortcut for removing a rock is R and if you press mouse button simultaneously you both place a gem and remove a rock with one click.

Jonathan A - 2024-03-16 12:22:57.338767

DC: Yeah I should really use the speedhack, I'm just too comfortable using Firefox as my main browser, and the delay also gives me time to do other things in the background. As has been discussed I concur spreading out the stunners so that they don't stun the same target, something I've been trying to do especially once reaching higher levels. However for the golds, I think they can go in the middle as much as possible, that way they get as much coverage as possible. They don't need to target the stunned units all over the map, what's important is that they get slowed down. I've been wondering when to upgrade the bloodstone. 216, are you saying to upgrade at level 400? Or at 400 kills? I upgraded mine around level 80 because their one target damage is significantly higher, and the air units are not so affected by aoe.

DC - 2024-03-16 3:43:33.002505

The Great Opal I got in like the final 10 rounds of my playthrough so I'd probably already leaked too much by lvl 100 for it to save me. Need to improve my 1-50 gameplay. @216 Your point on EE placement is blowing my mind. It feels so counterintuitive to choose placements with limited path coverage but that really is the only way to create enough unique stun zones, isn't it? I'm embarrassed that I didn't upgrade the black opal, please ignore :) I'm not good enough at this game yet to worry about not having enough space to make more Paraibas, but I am hoping to get there! Thank you for the advice!

216 - 2024-03-16 3:34:05.458092

1 more thing: i would never upgrade BS that have very high amount of kills ( maybe around 400 where it really no matter)

216 - 2024-03-16 3:28:33.678753

So many comments before i managed to response :) @WGW Nope, BS aoe always have been affected by armor! Flamestrike ignores armor. @DC: There are some thing that are little "wrong", but it don't looks bad enough to lose with GO - so history of that run may be more important (any leaks before 44?) Anyway most important things: -is that Black Opal really not upgraded? -too few EGs, i would add at least 3-4 just in middle. However, middle EG should be done much eariel and have good amount of kills! its really good to have 3-4 middle EGs with over 70 kills each (which doesnt mean you cant add more middle EGs later, never* enough middle EGs) -14 EEs is definitelly not too low amount for lvl 100, their locations are not very bad, but not optimal. Missing some in lower-right part of map (but your GO doesnt range here) some are too close to mid. that 3 upper-right are build too early (at 170 it would be ok, at 100 put max 1 here) also EGs there is useless (no need armor reduction there). look at your lowest placed EE (best placed one!) Becasue its lowest position that range c2-c3 path, so it range only limited fragment of middle path - placing more EEs at that "height" will easilly force them to stun different flyers first, then they will work together to stop escaping flyers near c6. -7 jades is good amount, but if u leak to0 much u can build few more to get that 1-2 more lives. Most important things in general: - concentrate DAMAGE gems(mainly EG, ABS, GAq if u get) in middle, it should be nuke zone (Whatever top players do, they intentionally limits important gems to build olny PT for more space) - force EEs to hits different targets, having too much in mid cause they all hit one *worth to save a bit middle space for ABS, also if u going to lvl like 1300 u need limit all non PT gems, so it actually can be "too much EG"

DC - 2024-03-16 2:26:53.512573

Appreciate the responses! Point taken on the value of running an absolutely tight ship - I've lost on Lvl 100 by just 1-2 lives multiple times this week. @WGW I have been reading many of your previous comments to try and learn, so I do know about the early bloodstone - this run in particular got one before level 30 and reached like Lvl11 by the time I converted it. As for the malachite, I had no idea how important it was for success - before reading comments I really thought it was just to shoot through like the first 10-15 levels. Is it worth promoting early to mighty to allow it to keep farming kills? @Jonathan I used to concentrate all my gems in the middle, but if you look at some of the screenshots from the higher-level players post, it seems like they don't group in the middle, because then you only focus fire one mob at a time. There are photos from like level 400 where there's still blank rocks in the middle. Also are you using the HTML5 speed-up add-on for Chrome? It helps me stay interested at higher levels because it makes the levels go by way faster. Just don't forget to turn it off for flyer levels haha.

WGW - 2024-03-16 1:52:17.075447

Upon a closer look, @DC, your malachite should definitely be one row further down. I don't think it reaches the middle horizontal path, which is probably leading to some early leaks.

WGW - 2024-03-16 1:48:24.443896

Yeah, I don't really see anything obviously "wrong" with your layout either, @DC. Ideally, you'd have the paraiba reducing armor more in range of the malachite for the early game, it looks pretty far down. I believe @216 has said in past comments that damage from the unupgraded bloodstone's AOE attack isn't affected by armor, so you wouldn't need the paraiba near the bloodstone as much as you do near the malachite (early game-- eventually you're going to want the entire ground enemy path covered by paraibas). Sometimes even small flaws like this can lead to extra enemy leaks early on, and given how fast the cost of lives spikes, you really can't afford it long term, even if that doesn't become apparent for another 50 levels. The great opal would ideally cover more of the map (i.e., placed nearer the center), but that shouldn't be causing a problem at this early a level. Since a screenshot doesn't show the history that led up to it, perhaps there's something sub-ideal in the *order* you're building the towers in, rather than which ones or their placement? E.g., you gain a major, major advantage if you're able to build a bloodstone unusually early because it will rack up a lot of kills. So I can see from the screenshot that you have 3 bloodstones at level 100, I can't tell when you built them. Are you leaking any ground enemies? Because it will cripple most runs if you leak any ground enemies before level 150. I'm usually still leaking half of the air enemies until well above level 200, and at the no-stun level 100, usually can't manage to kill even one.

Jonathan A - 2024-03-16 1:06:15.015134

Just did a smooth survival run, I'm copping out at level 86 though, I lose interest, I find the early game more exciting. https://imgur.com/hnylEHG I noticed that I kept relying on buying lives but had to change strategy to repick gems so I can combine all my perfect emeralds. Lives too expensive, repick cost was way behind. @DC: I'm not exactly qualified to help you but I've reached similar levels as you and looking at your maze, you might find it easier if you try what I do, see my screenshot. Also you might wanna build more golds. I find their damage excellent against air. And lastly, building most your gems right in the middle as that's where the air units pass two times. That being said I'm pretty sure my approach is too basic and it looks like your maze is more similar to the pros'. But I think it should do the job until level 150 or so. By the way I am not using malachite! I just find it fun to have a more challenging early game sometimes.

DC - 2024-03-15 23:13:03.190868

First note: THANK YOU to the commenter who explained what "Type gems here" meant, for the life of me I couldn't figure it out lol. Can anyone take a look at this screenshot (LINK: https://imgur.com/a/0N8BcwG) and let me know if I'm doing something obviously wrong? I came back to the game recently and have been trying to learn how to push higher levels in Survival but no matter what it feels like I'm treading water and slowly drowning at levels 80+. I've been trying some recommendations like spreading out distinct stun zones and having a narrow focus gem-wise but no matter what it feels like I can't possibly generate enough stun power, gold or damage to remain on pace (let alone getting ahead), even with the Great Opal this time.

WGW - 2024-03-15 11:48:46.520014

It's a real bummer, because the code change required to fix the "4 gem combine" bug is such an easy fix, as you've pointed out before @216. I somehow lost my level 1289 run around level 1050 while I was asleep due to a PC reboot, I think caused by Windows Update, which really ticks me off. I guess it's my fault for not remembering to turn it off when I have long run going like I learned to do long ago, but I haven't played a run in a while. Sheesh. This sort of thing is another good reason for not playing out ultra long runs. So many things can go wrong to end your game that aren't even part *of* the game, like automatic reboots, crashes, accidentally closing the browser, accidentally hitting the "back" or "refresh" button, etc, etc, etc. All of these things are completely avoidable (except for game crashes, but those are very rare now), but I know from other folks' comments that they've been stung by these things, too. Not to mention the lingering possibility that, if you manage to get to the "end", you still might end up with a high score with blank text. All in all, it's pretty irrational to play 100+ hour long runs under these conditions. Cheers, @216-- and thanks for all the info you've provided over the years!

216 - 2024-03-15 3:10:34.619377

Well, what more to say about 4-combine bug... simply need 5. Just code logic that count number of identical gems ingores the selected gem. Condition to "double upgrade" is 4 or more.. but 4 same other that selected gem means 5. So clicking "combine" on a gem while u have 4 same gems (count is 3) do regular combine. Chance of uber with bug - 8/80^5 (1:409 600 000, if you do a lvl 200 run (assuming over 300 repicks used) every day, you will get 5 same perfects once every ~2000 years :) good luck) Chance if getting 4 is about 400x higher. This bug is one of reason that disencourage me form play, it would be sad getting 4 same perfects now, while i always wanted to get uber. In flash version i had few times 3 same perfects before all gems were placed. In last comment I meant combine SPECIAL bug may require more explaination.

AVITONE - 2024-03-15 2:29:33.331677

@216 Yes please explain the 4 gem combination bug. I get excited when I get 3 perfect gems of the same color.... its happened to me a few times. I guess there is no chance of getting 5 though.

216 - 2024-03-13 22:28:20.304268

There is bug with 4-combine mechanic, which cause its needed to have 5 same gems instead 4, so getting uber without cheating is unreal. If you look for challenge in the game, you can try "one jade challenge", which may be harder than defeating 196 was ( requies early GO and abusing combine special bug, because with very limited repicks no way to get enoguh PEs) I guess u didnt realized that bug yet, want explaination?

mmkay - 2024-03-13 15:39:19.843302

hey guys it's been a while. I haven't really played ever since the lives system got overhauled and lvl 196 became no longer a challenge. I was one of the few people along with 216 to beat level 196. Has there been any amazing events in the game since then? Has anyone gotten an Uber stone?

216 - 2024-03-13 0:24:33.890663

The only gem that beats ABS dmg on stunlocked target is Uber Stone (unreal to get with bug), if we assume 0 kills towers. Sadly flamestike don't benefit from kills in any way. Assuming 0 kills, GO, BO, 4 armor (.806) and 2.5 flamestrike average active (in practice is a bit less due to mana and initial seconds) ABS does 910 x 0.806 + 1250 = 1983 DPS while EG does: 873. x 0.806 x 1.75 = 1232 ( quick reminder: color dmg modifiers were inplemented only to pink dmg so far..) GAq: 2240 x 0.806 = 1805 however, 20 kills GAq outdamage 20 kills ABS. 160 kills EG > 160 kills ABS So one of reasons to delay upgrade can be preventing stealing kills by ABS from EG ( or other towers like GAq, which u should never take for maximize space... i hate such gameplay, one of reason of not trying to get top score) if u had statistic for total dmg done in lvl by specyfic gem, you could be suprised how long BS wins( if it has good amount of kills and still keep maze around it). So keeping one BS not upgraded even at lvl 300+ is not bad idea maybe Have to agree with WGW that using combine bug makes game a bit more comfortable (less clicks), but i did't fell it AS much.. then i realized how many PAq you need in late game... Really idk how many months ago i did my last survival run (idk if any in 2023, maybe did few extreme speedruns). But i still remember almost every number from the game (had to check armor table in code, but I hope I remeber GAq stats well, 280 dmg , 0.35s base CD, right?) Also i'm still checking the comment page regurally, its very nice seeing it's active :) Hopefully one day game will be updated...

WGW - 2024-03-12 22:46:53.729903

Best of luck, @G. It's so painful that your current high score has blank text! Funny how @216 pointing out that you've, in fact, already got a top ten score had no effect whatsoever on your continuing one of these insanely long runs. Why am I not surprised. :) I haven't seen that blank high score text bug in ages. I ***really*** hope it doesn't happen to you (or anyone else) again.

G - 2024-03-12 21:48:39.026393

@WGW: I should qualify my previous statement on bloodstones. I will definitely upgrade it earlier, sometimes even before level 200, if I get a great opal. I'm working on another late game run now. Currently on level 537 with no great opal. I'm wondering what my final time will look like if I never get that GO!

WGW - 2024-03-12 21:12:58.130440

I usually upgrade the bloodstone (usually I only build one, near the center) around level 100 to 120, but it depends on a bunch of factors (e.g., how much stun power you've built up, how many bloodstones you've built, how early you've built them and how many kills they rack up, etc). Basically, though, I upgrade when I start to see that the 2 to 4 ground enemies that don't get stunlocked until the end of the level are not getting significantly damaged. If the last few ground enemies still have 95% of their hitpoints at the end of the level, then the area of effect attack of the unupgraded bloodstone is doing nothing significant anymore, and it's time to upgrade it, because as @216, the upgraded bloodstone's attack on a single stunlocked enemy is much, much more powerful, possibly the most hitpoint damage of any tower in the game. Nice to see a discussion going on again-- things had been very quiet for quite a while. :)

G - 2024-03-12 20:22:34.325633

@216: Yes, my level 1224 run sits at #10, but not for much longer I'm sure! As for bloodstone, I prefer to get a single bloodstone placed close to the crossroads and upgrade it once I get past the lower 300s. I shoot for 6-8 EgyptianGold, loosely aligned to the 6 waypoints and the crossroads area.

WGW - 2024-03-12 20:22:25.649418

@superrichdom: I can't really farm for great opals due to not having enough gold in early levels. A couple of times I farmed for one (past level 300) due to having a huge amount of gold at that point, due to having had to build tons of jades to make up for. . . not having gotten a great opal! I just decided a while back not to continue any run where I haven't gotten a great opal by level 150. Feels like a waste of time to me, since you've only invested a few hours into the run. Might as well toss it and try again for an early great opal. Sometimes this can take weeks, but playing a survival run without a great opal is, for me an exercise in major frustration. I'm constantly on the cusp of losing until well after level 200, sometimes much longer, and you can't make effective progress on your offense because you're forced to build so many jades for gold production. To each his own, but I can't stand it, so I just restart runs until I get a great opal. You've proven, and a couple others have, that it IS possible to do well in a survival run starting with a silver tower, so I don't want to dissuade you from a strategy that works for you. :) But yes, I do think getting a foothold in early levels is much, much easier with an initial malachite that you allow to get most of the early kills. Best of luck-- and cheers! I'm currently at level 915 in a run that should get me to level 1289. In another 60 hours or so. . .

superrichdom - 2024-03-12 14:02:59.776631

@WGW Are you farming for a Great Opal or you take it as it comes? And thanks for the tip, I was always starting with a Silver Tower because I thought it was better. I will now start with a Malachite.

WGW - 2024-03-11 0:22:59.843038

It's true that you don't *need* to exploit the "combine special bug". . . you also don't *need* to get a great opal. But building a sustainable survival mode run is much, much harder, more tedious, and (imo) a lot less fun and a lot more frustrating. The "combine special bug" is really not at all complicated to use-- plenty of comments here from myself and others explaining how to do it. You don't win any extra points for making your runs harder than necessary!

Jonathan A - 2024-03-10 14:18:31.607488

216: Thanks. I don't remember, long time I didn't play survival. Oh, I see. That's good to know because I prefer not to use it (it hurts my brain, can never figure out which gems will be consumed haha). Good to know about the BS.

216 - 2024-03-10 3:13:07.277863

You didn't mention one important gem: Jade. I think most ppl that have problems around lvl 100 don't know that they generate gold or use not enough of them. How many jades did you use? Abusing combine bug is not needed to get past any lvl... unless really bad RNG About bloodstones: they aren't so important around 50-100, unless ground units leaks. Don't underestimate upgraded version - top dmg on long time stunned target. But it start to become usefull around 100-160. @G: not counting obviously fake scores, your blank score is already 10th, right?

Jonathan A - 2024-03-09 21:43:10.180412

YES! Finally I got under 1000 seconds on Extreme. https://imgur.com/3A7JzWO Accidentally destroyed the maze on the last level but still under 1000... Got really early BS and two malachites. EZ

Jonathan A - 2024-03-09 16:58:27.350246

@Alex: I'm glad to be able to help here. Myself I can't get past somewhere around level 100, similar to Nina. But then I haven't really mastered abusing the gem combination bug. However in your case, just getting past level 50 you don't need to use that bug. All you need to do, assuming you are using the 3 golden checkpoints, is focus on the right gems, which are Gold, Dark Emerald, and Bloodstone, mainly. Do not upgrade the bloodstone! And make sure your damage zone in the center. Let me know how that goes!

WGW - 2024-03-08 20:48:15.742369

Strike that- reverse it. I meant that the malachite on the *right* is well-placed, not the one on the left. Sorry for any confusion!

WGW - 2024-03-08 19:46:55.611368

I'd just add that if we're talking only about the first 10 moves or so, you want (a) to build an initial malachite and not a silver tower, (b) build it in the upper left quadrant so that it reaches the initial downward enemy path AND the center of the maze (you can look at my screenshot below for a good placement-- the malachite on the left; the one on the right I didn't really want to build), and (b) along the lines of what @Avitone said, try to make sure that the initial malachite gets nearly all the kills. You can't really make it get ALL kills, if only because you also need an opal close enough to it to boost its attack speed. But you can get the malachite to make 90% of the kills pretty easily, and leveling it up quickly is pretty key to the early game.

Avitone - 2024-03-08 14:50:04.992154

@Natrl - There are several strategies depending on what luck gives you for gems. The most important thing in early game is to make sure your ingredient gems do not get kills. Only your base gems should collect the kill experience. Your base gem being the gem you select to build you combo tower once the other 2 ingredient gems are available.

Natrl - 2024-03-08 0:54:21.867419

What is the strategy for the first 10 or so turns to get an optimal setup for survival?

WGW - 2024-03-08 0:02:31.120452

I typed "dark emeralds"-- I meant "enchanted emeralds"!

WGW - 2024-03-08 0:01:19.128102

Well, I'm back it, don't ask me why. This run, in theory-- in *theory*-- could get past level 1300: https://imgur.com/a/d48yMha I got a fairly early great opal, so despite being forced to waste 3 early turns on a second malachite, I was able to decide to play for maximum turns early enough that this is otherwise a pretty optimal run. The problem with getting to level 1300 isn't space/turns, it's that i don't have nearly enough jades or dark emeralds for the long haul, and each one you build (instead of a paraiba) costs a turn. So while I have enough board space to get to level 1304 (or thereabouts), there's no way to have enough gold (with too few jades) to overcome all the leaks to come (with too few dark emeralds). I'm going to have to build more of them or the run will peter out. But I think I can strike a balance to at least get higher than level 1283, the only current top score that isn't an undeniable fake. We'll see. These weaknesses tend to lead to big problems around level 300, and again around level 600. Once you get past that point and the enemy movement starts glitching out (around level 800 for me), you can't really lose no matter how weak your maze has become (relative to the ever increasing, sky-high enemy hit points). I don't want to muck around with the speed hacks described here on a close to ideal run and risk messing something up, so it's going to take about two more weeks to play it out. Ugh!

WGW - 2024-03-07 8:13:28.346518

@G, any high score from *you* I know is fully legit. :) I'm sure you understand what to do perfectly well enough for a level 1200+ run, so it's just a matter of time. . . lots and lots of time. . . It looks like, from comments below, it's possible to speed the game up considerably. I haven't tested it personally. (I haven't played a run for months now, shockingly!) Anyhow, good luck on getting a top 10 score-- I'm 100% sure you'll get one if you persist!

G - 2024-03-07 0:53:40.276295

@WGW: I just ignore the obviously fake scores. I'm still going for a place in the top 10.

WGW - 2024-03-05 6:12:30.464200

Just a quick check in to note how "interesting" it is that after I posted a comment explaining how to post fake high scores, there are now 3 new fake high scores, the current top 3 spots, all of which have stats that are literally, and quite obviously, impossible. In case anyone thinks I'm obsessed with this (was "Vanity of Vanities" supposed to be addressed to me?), please take into account that I'm making here one additional comment on this weeks after my last one. I just feel it's worth at least leaving a record on the comments page about it, for folks who don't know the game well enough to spot obviously impossible stats. Just look at the time stats, that's enough. It is what it is. I'm happy knowing I was in the top spot, legitimately, for quite a while. Cheers to whoever posts fake high scores that they get whatever the hell they intended to get out of such pointless behavior! Pride? Actual, sincere cheers to everyone else who's been playing this game without cheating. :)

Superrichdom - 2024-02-28 20:44:59.811074

Me again, just saw an earlier post... so just have to find a way to start leaking before I got stuck

Superrichdom - 2024-02-28 20:21:09.087778

Well... I think I will find out. At level 806, I will switch my maze to be able to add more gems, but I don't even think that I can reach level 1000... https://imgur.com/a/WStRy2L

Superrichdom - 2024-02-27 20:29:59.946394

What would happen if there were no more space left? I'm currently lvl 717 and pretty much thing I will last until I cannot place anymore gems

Hoh - 2024-02-16 13:59:38.008352

It is all about getting a great opal. After that the game is easily solvable

kristos - 2024-02-08 19:43:36.090624

I confirm "html5 universal speed hack" works magic on microsoft edge as an extension from google source, no sign of vibration with request animation frame option on

ElasticMonastic - 2024-02-03 5:03:18.651599

Vanity of Vanities.

WGW - 2024-01-29 23:04:05.440548

Well, at least no one has jumped in (after a week) to call me a sore loser with no basis for my doubts on the scores that beat me! That of course does not mean that anything I wrote is actually correct. I just want to re-emphasize that I understand that I may totally, completely wrong in my belief that the high scores that beat me are fake, that none of this actually matters, and that if I was legit beaten in the high scores, I doff my cap. I won't be trying to do any better regardless!

WGW - 2024-01-23 22:03:07.923871

Slight addendum to correct a mistake in my last comment-- I see now that @PADOC *did* in fact leave one short comment here. Fwiw, even before realizing this, based on other factors not worth explaining, I hadn't much doubted @PADOC's high scores. I was trying to be "diplomatic" in not directly naming who I think is posting fake scores in my last comment, and in doing so, may have left the impression that I think @PADOC's scores are faked, which I actually I tend to believe are real scores for real runs. It's the scores by @TTJ (and @bob) which I believe are faked. And even there, I'm not 100% sure about @TTJ-- @bob's score is absolutely, beyond question, a fake, however. Truly no disrespect intended to @TTJ or @PADOC if my suspicions are wrong, and if so please bear in mind that I've been more invested in this game than any sane person should be. But stuff like, e.g., not posting screenshots or videos of your runs makes it hard for me to accept that I've been legit beaten, even if I have. ;) @bob's high score, though, is quite obviously completely fake!

WGW - 2024-01-23 21:38:58.833673

Been a while since I last checked in. . . I've not playing GTD. The short explanation is that I figured out how people have managed to spam the high score list with fake runs-- largely based on my suspicion that the score which topped my last high score run was faked (very shortly after I reclaimed the top score slot-- maybe a week or so?). The stats for what I suspected to be a fake high score run were not as gobsmackingly obviously faked as prior spammed high scores were, but I had my doubts. Which led me to spend more time than I would ever have wanted to in order to figure out how people have posted faked high scores over the years. Basically, it boils down to using Cheat Engine to modify certain game stats, which would enable anyone to post a top score on a run that they purposely lost as early as level ONE. In the past, these types of faked scores were posted by folks who either didn't understand or didn't care that they hadn't modified variables other than total score to make the overall stats at least APPEAR plausible-- e.g., a high score run by "bob" which had a total score of 12823921 at level ONE (!) with a total game time of 49 seconds (!!!!) This is quite obviously impossible without cheating. Well, it's actually quite easy, I now realize, once you've got Cheat Engine set up with a current browser instance of GTD. You can easily change any of the relevant high score game stats, and once you've done so, purposely tank your game, and then GTD lets you post a high score based on all these stats that Cheat Engine lets you modify *relatively* easily. Once I realized this, the wind went out of the sails of my GTD interest COMPLETELY. Suddenly I understood how a coupld of folks (or maybe just one folk) were constantly beating my hard-earned new top scores, which took me weeks of failed runs and then weeks of playing out the ultra-lucky runs to get the high scores I got. Almost invariably, my tops scores were surpassed within days-- which proves nothing, but sure feels suspicious after it happens 4 or 5 times in a row. Now, please understand a couple of things here. (1) This is all quite trivial and I'm not trying to make a big stink about any of it; (2) I may well be completely WRONG. GTD *DOES* have a long history of faked, spam high scores, but that doesn't mean I'm 100% confident that every high score above my own has been a fake. What I can say is: (1) Past spam high scores included stats that made them OBVIOUSLY, UNDENIABLY fake, (2) If you take the time and care to use the method (Cheat Engine) that I described above and modify ALL stats, not just the total score, you can leave a perfectly plausible high score that's still FAKE, and (3) past attempts by folks to spam the high score were by folks who did not even bother to try to make the stats look reasonable-- but that doesn't mean that just because a high score's stats LOOK reasonable that it is in fact a real (non-faked) high score. But I really have no way of knowing. I could postulate more on the basis of number of spaces available for towers and such, but no one wants to read any of this kind of analysis, no one should possibly care except (maybe?) me, since I'm the one who lost the magnificent honor of being the top scoring player in GTD recently. And if I'm wrong, I hope the current higher-scorers than me won't be overly offended. But I'm dubious. And I could very easily post a perfectly plausible-looking high score beating the current top score (by TTJ) using Cheat Engine if I wanted to. I don't want to. My last top score, at level 1279, is as far as I want to go in this game. Maybe that run has been legit beaten (twice?!?), maybe not so legit. I don't know for sure, but I have my doubts, and it's truly-- deeply-- not worth the tedium to even try to reclaim the top spot knowing that (1) The scores that beat me may (MAY) very well not be real, and (2) I could post a score beating them in a heartbeat using Cheat Engine if I wanted to, which I don't. ;) My apologies-- and deepest respect-- to @TTJ and @PADOC-- if I'm off base in my interpretation. But I kinda doubt I am. And the fact that neither of these folks has ever particiapted in any fashion, ever, here on the comments page, combined with how difficult it is to get a GTD run to this high level, only confirms my strong suspicion that the top scores by these folks are garbage, Cheat Engine-enabled fake runs. But again, I know that I may be completely wrong in my beliefs here and apologize if I am. I'm not, though. ;)

Nina - 2024-01-23 9:10:44.000424

@Alex the highest I ever got was 107... I dont get how they do it

Alex - 2024-01-19 14:31:23.583669

Alright friends, i been playin this game for years and cant get past like level 50 on survival. What is the secret? Any advice would be fantastic or maze strats.

G - 2024-01-16 17:13:39.402279

Just finished my longest run yet: level 1224 For whatever reason the high scores recorded it with no name

Nina - 2024-01-04 14:58:12.829080

http://45.55.255.26:10001/ doesnt work

Nina - 2024-01-04 12:57:28.080014

How do I find the sandbox mode? I played more than 50 level on survival and still havnt found it

G - 2024-01-03 20:33:22.526530

After many failed attempts, I'm on track for another late game attempt. It took 322 levels, but I finally received a great opal. I had to make many more jades than I'd like, so we'll see how far I can actually get with this one. Fingers crossed that my computer doesn't crash again lol

G - 2023-12-06 1:20:53.020374

@scgmeister: thanks for the tip! Fixing that glitch will definitely alleviate some of the annoyance of the late game.

216 - 2023-11-29 15:30:45.043040

It works, but minimal speed of enemies is very close to their normal speed, cause one bug. Don't even look at displayed speed values (another bug).

ana - 2023-11-28 21:30:15.067203

how come it seems like slow and poison stop working around level 30 or so

AVITONE - 2023-11-23 15:59:47.076627

Happy Thanksgiving everyone! And happy mazing :)

Jonathan A - 2023-11-20 14:49:39.049411

It's me I'm back! Did another extreme speedrun. https://i.imgur.com/snZ8hQll.png Not my best attempt. Not even my best maze, didn't remember how I did it. How's everybody doin?

scgmeister - 2023-11-19 6:44:23.660487

correction: "html5 universal speed hack" is the chrome extension I'm using right now, and I just realized that turning the "requestAnimationFrame" option on within that extension seems to fix the glitch where the mobs vibrate in place in that happens in higher levels.

scgmeister - 2023-11-19 6:34:59.993081

Hmm, now that's interesting. Turns out there's an otpion in the speed hack chrome extension called "requestAnimationFrame" that effectively fixes the glitch causing the mobs to vibrate in place.

scgmeister - 2023-11-06 19:21:08.185725

Turns out, for the chrome extension, all you have to do is open up chrome and do a search for "HTML5 universal speed hack", and look for the chrome extension with that name to add to chrome. That extension works just as well as cheat engine (no setup required), even to the point that it only works when the game window has to remain as the primary focus on your computer, otherwise it will default to the normal speed until you click on the game window again. On that note, if you use either of these speed hacks, it is possible to cause the enemies to vibrate in place at really low levels, even as low as level 4 if you set it high enough, you can also cause the game to effictevely freeze if you set the speed too high until you slow it back down, or click away from the screen. It's for that reason, using the speed hack in that way at lower levels instead of simply using it to speed up the game is effictevely cheating, at least until you get to a high enough level to where the enemies will vibrate in place anyway regardless of any speed hack. Anyway, with legit scores nearing the limits of whats possible, and the shear ammount of grind that's required to reach a high score, I'm now curious how long it'll be untill someone does surpass level 1300.

scgmeister - 2023-11-06 18:45:13.412799

Cheat engine does work with this game, but it has a drawback in that it only works when the browser window that is running the game is the main focus on your computer. I also discovered that there exists an unofficial html5 speed hack addon for chrome which also works to speed up this game. Unfortunately, I don't remember what website I found it on, but you should be able to find it through a google search. As for how to set up cheat engine to work with the game, here's how to do it: Step 1: when you start a new game, open up the browser specific task manager (found by clicking on the 3 dots/lines depending on browser, then mousing over "more tools"), then highlight the task that is showing to be running the game, taking note of the process ID number on the right, as that is what you will need to reference to get cheat engine to work with this game. step 2: open up cheat engine and click the computer monitor icon that lets you select which process to open. step 3: make sure the processes tab is up, right click anywhere on that screen, and click on the convert PID to decimal option to change the number shown next to each processes that you see on the list. step 4: on that list of processes, look for the process number that matches the process ID of the gem tower defense task that shows up in the browser task manager. If you have done those steps correctly, you should now be able to use cheat engine to speed up the game so long as you keep the game window as the main focus on your computer.

WGW - 2023-11-01 4:17:52.119410

@scgmeister, for what it's worth, I've never considered speeding the game up to be cheating in any way. One of the best players of the prior Flash version of GTD, a/aznist, used to use Cheat Engine to speed the game up and ended up being one of only three people to get past level 196 (I wasn't one of them), and I always thought was perfectly legit since the RNG needed to get past level 196 was so brutal and required so many long runs. I even tried myself, finally, to figure out Cheat Engine to speed up these 2 week long level 1200 runs, but either I'm doing something wrong, or the speed hack that used to work in the Flash version of GTD doesn't work anymore in the Javascript version. I don't know of any other way to speed the game up than using Cheat Engine, so if it doesn't work anymore, I think we're out of options. Bottom line, the game is no easier, in any way, by speeding it up. It's just less. . . slow. So if you can get the game running faster, I say go for it. But if you do manage it, do us all a favor and explain how you got it working, cause as I said, Cheat Engine doesn't seem to do it anymore!

WGW - 2023-11-01 4:12:18.597932

@Bill, yes, if two different gems have an effect, they stack, e.g., armor reduction from an egyptian gold + a paraiba on ground troops. But adding additional gems of the same type, e.g., multiple egyptian golds, will not stack their effects, ever, in this game. I guess you could sort of say, sort of, that stun gems do stack in their effect since the more stun gems are attacking the longer an enemy will get stunned, but that's not really the same thing as, say, getting additional armor reduction or more slowdown effects from multiple placements of the same gem types.

Bill - 2023-10-31 13:47:29.868130

@WGW do the effects of different gems stack? i.e. egyptian gold and rose quartz crystal both giving anti-armor.

scgmeister - 2023-10-31 11:58:51.518537

So I decided to end my run early at 986 due to having to restart my computer for an update, seeing that a score of 1250 will no longer be a top 5 (legit) score, having to use my computer other business for a few days and also realizing that I think I'll be able to. surpass the potential of my last run using a spiral maze design which I think will look really cool once I fill everything in. On a sid note, I'm also somewhat tempted to gompletely glitch out the game with a speed hack for the purpose of getting past level 1300, though if I decide to do that in the next mmonth or so, and decide to post the score, I'll make it pretty clear it was achieved through a speed hack.

WGW - 2023-10-31 2:05:12.502697

@Bill, no, in fact no gem effects stack in this game.

Bill - 2023-10-30 16:31:00.801812

Does anti-armor from rose quartz crystals stack?

WGW - 2023-10-28 23:37:09.172492

@G, I feel your pain.

G - 2023-10-28 20:25:31.076548

I spoke too soon. My computer restarted on me "because there was a problem." I was on level 1135. What a waste of two weeks.

G - 2023-10-24 19:46:07.698632

Daaaaaamn PADOC! Congrats!!! I've finally surpassed level 1000 but there's no way I can beat 1280 with my current run. Oh well, I'll just be happy to be in the 4-digit club!

PADOC - 2023-10-24 13:51:06.972835

Keep trying @WGW!! ;)

scgmeister - 2023-10-21 18:11:47.474846

@wgw, I succame a while ago, back when you were aiming to reach 1200 for the first time and I managed to get to 1100. I took a break, and now I'm back at it again, seeing the increase in popularity. Anyway, if I did my math right, it looks like I should be able to get just past 1250 on this run. https://i.imgur.com/pWOoAsx.jpg I don't know if you can see it, but there's one more spot where I might have been able to place another gem had I set up my original maze slightly differently. After which, I don't see anywhere else possible to optimize any more space for this game.

WGW - 2023-10-21 14:57:06.871144

@scgmester, I'm afraid you, too, are succumbing to the great GTD abyss. It's good not to be alone in here. . . ;)

scgmeister - 2023-10-20 14:30:13.651704

hmm, come to think of it maybe I can do 2 of the 3 potential extra spots I noticed, albeit ot would be at the cost of having to essentially double the length of the final maze, so actually using those 2 additional potential spots will depend on whether it's still possible to purposly lose when the need arises.

scgmeister - 2023-10-20 1:49:45.605104

So I gust realized after looking at this maze setup one more optimization I could have made which would give me another 12 potential levels had I done the setup slightly differently. Guess this means I'll have to do another run once this current one completes.

scgmeister - 2023-10-19 15:38:28.496499

Here's a pic of my current run I have going which it is at a point where I can pretty much focus on building paraibas with minimal danger of running out of lives. https://i.imgur.com/IFqchWH.jpg Eventually, I'll plan on taking another screenshot of this run once I start running into the vibrating glitch and it becomes safe to significantly shorten the mazeI have going for the purpose of optimizing space to give myself a better idea of what level I can potentially get with this run. @WGW, congrats on reclaiming the top spot in this game.

WGW - 2023-10-17 19:53:27.243609

Well, I did it (mostly). I got the top high score spot back-- sorry, @TTJ, whoever you are. . . ;) I lost at level 1279 with room for four more turns, but I got a phone call mid-level and wasn't paying attention, so I leaked enemies without having enough lives bought up (you need to keep lives low at the end to make sure you can end the game). A bit painful to lose 4 levels after 100 hours, but oh well. At least it happened *after* beating @TTJ's score! No screenshot, but this time not cause I'm a jerk, but cause I was planning on taking one at the last level and then lost the game. I'd like to say I'm never going to do this again, but that would be transparently untrue, since (a) I *KNOW* that it's possible to squeeze in at least 10 more levels (to think I once doubted whether I could pass level 1000!), and (b) It's pretty clear by now that I'll be playing this game till either it or I die.

WGW - 2023-10-15 22:32:33.029945

Here's a very partial screenshot of where I'm at now on the road to level 1283. Just the upper left corner, cause as previously stated, I'm a jerk. https://imgur.com/a/ND2ERp4 You would not believe how slow the levels go now. Last I clocked it, it was around 15 minutes for ground levels, and that's only with a lot of fiddling around with window focus during level to "control" the movement glitch, clicking on and off it at the just the right times. If I just let the level run on its own it takes around 23-24 minutes.

WGW - 2023-10-15 22:29:42.393657

I remember, @G, you advising me to start playing on a laptop because of all the power failures I was having. Now you're wishing you played your run on a desktop! lol Just goes to show, There's just so many ways things can go astray and no way to eliminate all of them. I'm frankly amazed there are a at least a few more people trying for one of these insanely long runs. There's something about this game.

G - 2023-10-15 21:22:06.414043

@scgmeister: thanks for sharing your layout! @WGW: I appreciate the heads up about the placement bug. I have noticed it being laggy, so I'll definitely be more careful here on out. I had to scrap my previous run (exited at level 506) due to my work laptop forcing a restart but I've since started another one on my personal laptop. Up to level 614 now, so hopefully I can break 1000 finally!

scgmeister - 2023-10-15 17:47:25.191844

Welp, I somehow managed to survive without a great opal until level 180 using my curent maze setup, which really makes me curious to see what it will be capable of once I do get lucky with one. https://i.imgur.com/On81bR0.jpg @wgw thanks for the tip regarding the cause of the frozen rock I knew it could happen, but didn't know the cause. I wonder if that may be related to a glitch I also recently had where I inadvertantly clicked 'r' to remove a rock, and clicked my mouse button to place a rock at roughly the same time which resulted in every time I would click a rock, with my mouse button, the rock would get removed as if 'r' was continuously being pressed, followed by the game wouldn't let me upgrade that gem I just place 'erasing' the rock that was just there even though I had the rest of the ingredients until a later turn when I placed that same gem in an empty area. There were a number of other weird glitches that happened that run until I scrapped that run for a different one. (happened really early in the game at level 32 I believe)

WGW - 2023-10-14 21:16:47.126955

@scgmeister and @G: I also should remind/warn you (and anyone else making a go at a "maximum turns" run) to be VERY careful not to click too fast when picking gems in very late levels, or you might end up a frozen (non-removable) rock as used to happen to me. I wrote all about this below, but there's a lot of comments and I (obviously) tend to ramble. . . But you really don't want a frozen rock in a max turns run. Every turn you sacrifice by doing anything but building paraibas is important. A frozen rock will lose you a minimum of 4 turns-- and as much as 16 if it's REALLY badly placed! To have that happen when you're past level 800 is brutal. To avoid it, just make sure that late game, when it gets increasingly sluggish, don't click to pick another gem until you actually see the last one you placed *show up on the screen*.

WGW - 2023-10-14 21:04:58.307808

@scfmeister: I think that layout will allow for the same maximum number of blocks as mine (if filled in correctly). The drawback I see, though (not that you asked!) is that you'll need to reserve a lot more spaces in the center as rocks that you can't replace with permanent towers until very, very late game. A big part of my early game maze layout is meant to serve two purposes, to allow for not wasting any space, but also to minimize how much of the center I won't be able to build towers on until late game. But there's also a big advantage, in terms of preventing ground leaks, to a much windy-er path than what I use, so as long as you find you have enough attack power, it looks good to me. In my case, after stabilizing a run (usually between level 150 and 200), I find that attack power vs the increased enemy HP often starts to crater around level 300, and again around 600, at which point I sometimes have to build non-paraibas in order to save the run. So even runs that seem to be entirely sustainable for building only paraibas till the end of the game, can end up not being sustainable after all (at least, not without building a bunch other, more useful towers than paraibas).

scgmeister - 2023-10-14 7:13:06.446801

Despite that this run isn't likely to last much longer largely due to the lack of a great opal, I may as well share it anyway due to it's potential for being able to maximize space for a high score and due to the fact it is a very easy/straight forward maze to make. https://i.imgur.com/AQXuIK6.jpg

scgmeister - 2023-10-13 16:13:00.318065

Between my pc wanting me to restart it and the fact that there are a number of optimizations I think I can make with my maze design that should get my max level potentilal to over 1200, I decided to finish optimizing the space of my current run, take a screenshot of it to reference, then cancel this run. https://i.imgur.com/WrcbLWe.jpg

scgmeister - 2023-10-13 11:38:55.352470

I suppose I may as well share the current maze I'm on (haven't played this game in a while, but it's still fun to come back and mess around now and then): https://i.imgur.com/tvKDTCq.jpg I'm not yet sure if I'll attempt to fill upt the board, and I have yet to calculate what the potential level I'll be able to reach with it though. note: in the pics I believer there are still an additional 37 rock loacations over what's already there that I'll be able to use once I get to the point of removing certain key unupgraded rocks for the purpose of shortening up the maze length and freeing up more spare where addition rocks are able to fit.

WGW - 2023-10-11 2:24:19.213786

@G: Also, one more thing, in case you don't have a way to calculate this yourself (I have to use a pain in butt spreadsheet). You can get to level 1248 if you build nothing but paraibas from here on and don't make any more layout mistakes-- which would be currently 3rd highest (legit) score. . . so, well done if you're willing and able to play it all the way out!

G - 2023-10-11 2:22:24.461610

@WGW: Thank you for the tip! And yes I've been using your layout in the games I've played this past month lol thanks for sharing that as well. Those dry spells are tough, but I'm glad I pushed through! Even though I put that EE under the top-middle waypoint, the real mistake I made with this run was starting the game on my work laptop. The real challenge now will be finishing it and recording my high score before my it decides it needs to restart and gives me 5 minutes notice. It's likely I'll end this one early and start the next one my personal laptop like I should have done from the start.

WGW - 2023-10-11 2:00:51.127142

@G: A bit more helpfully, I should probably add that there's a spot you filled in which will end up costing a few spaces/moves (I used to fill in this spot, too). This of course only matters if you're really trying to fill in every possible space. See this screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/1zDcNb5 This game can be unbelievably frustrating in the streaks where you don't ever get a great opal. Then you get runs like this one I'm playing now (at level 1043), where I got a great opal at level 30, and have gotten-- no joke-- at least FIVE more since. None of which I could take because it would have cost me 3 turns. It's all just RNG, but streaks are definitely a thing!

WGW - 2023-10-11 1:51:47.161535

@G: That layout looks VERY familiar. . . ;)

G - 2023-10-11 1:08:19.117871

I finally got a Great Opal for the first time since I picked this game back up about a month ago. I literally cannot get to level 200 without that GO, so this has rekindled my spirit quite a bit! Currently approaching level 400. We'll see how far if I can finish this game before my computer decides to randomly force restart on me again lol Anyway, here's my current map for those curious: https://i.imgur.com/gdCQeJu.png

WGW - 2023-10-10 13:35:29.473481

@AVITONE: I'm getting there-- just passed level 1000. It's already taking more than 10 minutes a level at this point, though, so it's still gonna be a while. I'm going to defer on the screen shot for the time being, just cause I don't want to give away what I'm doing differently to squeeze out these extra few levels. I know it's kinda stupid and probably more than a bit jerky of me, but hey, whoever this TTJ guy who beat me, I don't want to have my score beaten again two weeks after I finally post this score. Just to vaguely explain, there is something SO obvious in my layout that could enable anyone to make a very small change and get 6 levels further than this run will take me. And I *really* don't have to play out another run like this, at least not for a pretty long while. And I'm just a jerk. ;)

AVITONE - 2023-10-09 0:29:44.802280

@WGW - How is your run going? can you share a screenshot?

WGW - 2023-10-06 11:08:29.820422

@AVITONE More! Always more! lol I'm at level 621, with no possibility of losing the run outside of externalities like crashes and such. But that still means another 100 hours or so of playing this out. Yay! Fun!

AVITONE - 2023-10-03 4:14:09.995049

@WGW "I have a run going now that is almost definitely going to get me to level 1283" wow man good luck..... not sure if this makes me want to stop playing or play more haha.

AVITONE - 2023-10-03 4:12:20.317573

@WGW "I assume you were able to stop this by loading the game again?" - yes I just rage quit haha. once I reloaded page it worked fine. I had just placed those rocks as part of my select gem process.

WGW - 2023-10-01 6:42:07.567837

I said I wasn't going to even try doing this, but I'm just a big liar. I have a run going now that is almost definitely going to get me to level 1283. There's one key thing I had to change in playing style to make it possible. We'll see whether I get back the top score slot soon. . . if you can consider "a week from now, minimum" to be "soon"!

WGW - 2023-10-01 6:39:03.211025

@AVITONE: That is the most bizarre bug I've ever seen in this game. I've never seen ground troops go through walls, ever. And all of the other really weird bugs (glitched enemy movement, frozen rocks, etc) only happen at very late levels. Very rarely the game will start off behaving very strangely in some way, e.g., I've seen games start with all enemies moving at a snail's pace (with the game not otherwise slowed down). But this happens maybe 1 in a thousand times and is always apparent from the first run you try upon loading the game. Refreshing the page always fixes whatever was going wrong. I'm assuming that this glitch you're seeing didn't start from level 1, which is. . . really weird. I doubt this is really technically a "bug", in the sense that it's almost definitely not caused by a flaw in the game's programming code. Sometimes the platform itself (in this case javascript) is to blame for ultra weird and rare behavior like this that can't be explained by a flaw in the program itself. I assume you were able to stop this by loading the game again?

AVITONE - 2023-09-30 15:34:09.405707

MAJOR BUG.... only happened once to me. anyone else have this? https://imgur.com/INC4xyN

ckrack - 2023-09-20 9:18:43.033529

I did another try and now it worked... So I used the newer one of the low level gem and finally it worked

ckrack - 2023-09-20 8:58:53.147690

@WGW thanks for all that input. Could you please explain that bug one again (maybe with an example). When I try I always loose one gem more and often the higher graded... I think I'm doing something wrong. For example I'm building the perfect emerald, after this flawless saphire and than flawed topaz. When I use saphire for the dark emerald all three are gone (so everything normal). When I build a second topaz and use this for the dark emerald all 4 are gone

WGW - 2023-09-17 16:23:20.152681

Oh, and of course, your perfect opal isn't ideally placed. . . probably because you used to have one right in the middle which you turned into a black opal. That's something to keep in mind when you make the black opal, that ideally you've already planned for replacing the perfect opal you use to make the black opal. (Or, you exploit the combine special bug so that you don't consume the perfect opal at all when making the black opal!)

WGW - 2023-09-17 16:21:07.879257

@ccz: I took a quick look at your screenshot, and can offer some general suggestions (some may be very obvious already): (1) I would shift the attack power so that it's concentrated more in the upper LEFT quadrant. Most is concentrated on the right half, and some in the lower right quadrant. By having attack power concentrated more in the upper left, you'll kill more air troops, since they're not getting any real damage until they hit the center of your layout. The first turn malachite especially shouldn't be in the middle of the maze, but should be placed in the upper left so that it's doing damage to all enemies as soon as possible after the enter. (2) Don't upgrade the bloodstone until later in the run, I'd say after level 100. The earlier you can place an unupgraded bloodstone, the better, ideally before level 35. (3) The rose quartz should definitely be more in the center of the map. It should cover the entire upper half of the air enemy path, with an optional second rose quartz to cover the very bottom of the air enemy path. (very optional) You're doing well, though! I hope this is at least somewhat helpful. :)

WGW - 2023-09-16 22:00:37.964689

@ccz: I set up a disposable email a while back, so you can shoot me an email at wgwzxz-gtd@yahoo. It may take me a while to respond, lots of life-stuff happening, but I'll keep an eye out. @mikis, I wouldn't count on another update just because it's been so long, but you never know. Fwiw, I've been rolling an idea around in my head for a GTD variant (a major variant, not a remake or tweak) that I might try to work out in the coming months. I've wanted to learn modern game programming and this might be a good starter project. But we'll see. . . self-discipline has never been my forte! Good to see you still around too, @G!

ccz - 2023-09-13 15:45:00.633156

aahhh made it to 80, heres a screenshot of my losing round.. :( https://i.imgur.com/L5NN3D1.png

mikis - 2023-09-13 11:08:57.081361

Do you guys think we can count on another update anytime soon? What would you like to see in such an update? Maybe a possibility to remove the gems?

ccz - 2023-09-12 12:01:57.429136

hey wgw, been reading your comments attentively and they have been very helpful. any way to contact you directly for questions and chat to improve my understanding? hooked on this game at the moment. i am struggling around lvl50+. i made a 7 pass maze and not many wasted gems (3 rose quartz and 1 great sapphire, but the rest is EE, jade, EG, Par and 2 bloods). But i think it looks solid at least to get like 100lvl or smth small. But I am literally leaking 8-10 air units every air round and ground units are coming through as well now. screenshot - would love advice from you or anyone else that has any. the maze layout i took from someone in these comments after i found the part where it said that i should not copy wgw :D https://i.imgur.com/RY3SFVJ.png

G - 2023-09-06 17:31:26.973230

Checking back in here for the first time in a while. @WGW: glad to see you're still carrying the torch for this community! Honestly astounded that anyone was able to top you on the high scores Speaking of--Congrats to TTJ, whoever you are! @Bill: welcome to the late game challenge. Once you reach a certain point, the game becomes about maximizing the number of gems you can place on the board and still being able to leak mobs when you want to end the game. Good luck!

Bill - 2023-09-05 22:43:04.539684

I ran out of space to place gems and can�t end my own game to submit my score� help!!

Ckrack - 2023-09-04 11:06:30.597036

@Kristos thanks, looking good @Irina, this really looks special, how do you start? @WGW oh, I think you need to beat that record D

kristos - 2023-09-01 13:56:33.252395

@Irina Holy frack :D Your labirynt looks faboulus!

Irina - 2023-08-30 21:08:33.514881

Thanks, I got to 718, I could have gone 2 more rounds, but not worth the time at that point lol

WGW - 2023-08-27 4:12:31.677942

@Irina, don't be so hard on yourself. :) A few months ago you were struggling to get past level 100-- as most new players do unless they get a really, really lucky run before they even know what a really lucky run looks like. I've said a lot of times, I think GTD is a hard game to learn, in terms of playing survival mode and trying get a stable run going. To play for maximum turns is way harder, in the sense that even players who have figured out the game are going to have to work pretty hard to get a run past level 1000, 1100, certainly 1200! You need good RNG, for one thing, but you also have to turn upside-down some very basic strategies, from the very start of the game. Just one e.g., if you're playing for max turns/space, you should never take a one-turn tower except on the first move, and to build a great opal. Because you lose three potential turns every time you build a one-term tower. So congrats on getting so far. Playing for max turns is deadly dull, takes longer than the elapsed game time shows in the high scores due to slowdown issues, requires a fairly up to date PC, and I doubt anyone is ever going to be able to legitimately beat TTJ's high score. I'm not even going to TRY! ;)

Irina - 2023-08-27 2:01:44.003306

https://imgur.com/a/gK2GyF8 I'm at level 618 and quickly running out of room. I don't know what to do and I hate that I won't make it to higher levels purely because my space planning was bad.

WGW - 2023-08-19 19:11:50.454612

Congrats to TTJ, whoever you are! TTJ has recently posted a level ***1276*** score. Consider my mind completely blown. I had a run going last week that I thought could get to level 1269, but it petered out on me around level 300. Now I'm glad it did, because even if I'd gotten to level 1269, TTJ would have already had a better score anyway. :) If TTJ ever reads the comments, I'd really like to see what your final layout looked like, e.g., whether you've managed to squeeze in a few more gem/towers than I can in my best attempted layout (mine has a max of 334 filled spaces). I am truly impressed. And I don't think I could ever beat this score. But for the sake of my sanity, I'm not going to try!

WGW - 2023-08-19 19:06:10.927838

I always try to warn people not to try to directly copy how I play. I do a lot of things-- a LOT-- early on that make no sense from the perspective of most players who are struggling trying to get past the first 200 levels. The most obvious example is that no one, but no one, should be building nothing but paraibas from around level 200 on, unless you're trying to get past, like, level 1100. But there are other things, too-- you might not want to bother with switching the direction of ground troops around level 30 like I do. You should probably make your maze much longer to guarantee no ground troop leaks, even if you use the same basic layout. You'd probably benefit from building more bloodstones than I do (I rarely build more than one now). Lots of stuff I do is really only for the very, very long term, when I'm trying to really push the limits of how many turns I can make. Most players should focus on attack power and stun power and a safer (longer) maze.

kristos - 2023-08-18 15:47:31.530323

@ckrack I dont try to copy him, because it dont work for me at the begining xD but im trying my design which i will be later making more thick with less paths. https://ibb.co/kyRD0VH

Ckrack - 2023-08-18 9:22:29.464146

@kristos Wow I've been blind. Always trying to copy WGW but not with that much success :D

kristos - 2023-08-16 10:27:19.629465

@crack i started with the multiply turret in the middle, the ones on the left down that feels like they dont belong are there because of my mistakes (kept wrong jewel, by mistake downgraded jewel).

Bongo - 2023-08-14 7:56:16.460699

- Do you use the special bug trick when playing or ? - why make GA when EG is equaly strong and provide armor reduction ? - I made a SYS which removed the BO +40%, when I then made a new BO it didnt take over the SYS, but when I made a 2nd BO i changed !!!! -

fluff - 2023-08-09 19:15:49.619269

I haven't been reading or commenting for a while, but I wanted to have an advance funeral of the best run I will probably ever have. I just got through level 44 with zero leaks. https://ibb.co/nBMPvRH Why a funeral then? I know I'm going to have to restart this computer before the end of the week. T_T

Ckrack - 2023-08-08 10:57:07.567807

@Kristos I was looking at your maze https://ibb.co/wsS1mY2 How did you manage the start? I see Silver Knight in the low left corner but this probably wouldn't help at the beginning.

kristos - 2023-08-03 14:30:34.345641

It's a little too much to address xD But i understand your point of view very well. I play this game for i think 10 years, but up until now only from time to time mostly on hard mode, to just have some fun during other things. It is sad that the game dont change at all (but at the same time its something good too), because we could use some little correction to like you said, not being placing paraibas non stop for days. Happy playing :D

WGW - 2023-08-01 14:54:56.949607

Oh, I completely agree with you, I really do. Why else would I have been playing GTD almost non stop for so many years. But bear in mind GTD would be a lot more boring to me at this point than to a new player, because: (1) The runs I'm playing take over 2 weeks to complete (2) 90% of those two weeks are spent doing nothing but building paraibas, over and over and over again, with levels taking 10 minutes each for the last 200 or so. (3) I already locked in my maze layout as of about a year ago, which is just a slightly modified version of the maze I'd been using for the Flash GTD for 10 years. . . so the fun part of figuring out a good layout was over for me a long, long, LOVE time ago also, I've been playing this game-- which has only barely changed-- for almost 15 years now. Not many games stay interesting when you play them non stop for 15 years. :) But it's still a perfect game for me to play while I'm watching videos, because there's so much downtime. It just gets really, really boring for me after the first 200 levels or so. . . which leaves another approximately one THOUSAND increasingly slow levels to go! Oh, also, a correction to the comment where I said my run would get to level 2569 (how did I even type that?!?) I'm only going to potentially get to level 1269 (and there are still things that could go wrong at this point. I'm leaking too many air enemies sometimes, and I can't afford to build any more dark emeralds or jades.) Level 2569 isn't even theoretically possible. There aren't enough spaces on the board. By my calculations, the absolute theoretical maximum level is 1336, but that's not even remotely possible to actually achieve. It would require building literally only paraibas, nothing else, for the whole game, from level 1, which is pretty much impossible. So the *achievable* maximum level lies somewhere between level 1266 (since TTJ already got that far) and level 1336 (the purely theoretical upper limit). Not that anyone asked. . .

kristos - 2023-08-01 8:57:35.492860

To be honest thats why this game is so appealing - it is """"easy"""", repeatable, and i can play this in my work, while both i have nothing to do and while im busy. And i can do the same one game for eternity xD TBH it shows on the map, via lacking of other towers, how much work and thinking you put on placing the rocks and towers. Also im not sure if i would call it boring game, more like something to fill up the spaces - not boring and not intresting. Like when you move a rock in your hand while you going somewhere or smth.

WGW - 2023-08-01 4:13:43.159745

I meant to add a screenshot, not that it's much different from any of run screenshots I've posted for the past year now: https://imgur.com/a/g3PwI2m The only difference in this run from other recent high scoring ones isn't actually visible on the board, it's all a matter of rejecting any single-turn towers (except the initial malachite and the great opal), and building nothing but paraibas as early in the run as can afford to. At which point the game becomes an interminable, deadly boring slog for the next 80 hours, all for the dubious "glory" of securing a top score in a 15 year old game that probably only a dozen people still play. But so far, this is my only true claim to gaming immortality. ;)

WGW - 2023-08-01 4:05:13.393718

lol, kristos! No shame called for! :) Building nothing but paraibas is not something you'd ever even think about doing until you've played GTD for long enough to be thinking about preserving space/maximizing turns. I doubt anyone has ever thought about maximizing turns unless they've already (a) spent lord knows how many hours learning how to even get past level 150 (this is not an easy game to learn), (b) has almost endless time on their hands (to play out runs for 100 hours), and (c) has at least one screw loose (or who'd want to play this game for 100 hours?!?) Naturally, I'm writing this while I have yet another run going which should get me the top score slot back. I should be able to level 2569. . . in TWO WEEKS or so. I don't know why I'm doing this, except that I got a great opal very early, so I'm taking a shot. It's not fun at all building nothing but paraibas for two weeks. . . I wasn't sure i could really beat the level 1266 score from TTJ at all, even with really good RNG. But this run should do it!

kristos - 2023-07-31 15:13:13.568519

@WGW im ashamed that just now i realised why you use shell tower so much xD

kristos - 2023-07-30 10:12:40.873220

@WGW Thank you for the answer and for the congratulations (means a lot from a top player of this game)! But still it's realy sad i can put myself on the highscore board :( I need to totaly change my strategy now xD https://ibb.co/wsS1mY2

WGW - 2023-07-30 6:06:27.359557

@kristos: You can't, sadly. If you don't have enough spaces open, the game is soft-locked. You have to plan for the ability to purposely end the game before running out of room, or you don't get to post a high score (which is very unfair, but also understandable in the sense the game designer never intended for anyone to be able to fill the entire board!) Congrats, in any event, for getting so far! I know you've been working at it for quite a while. :) I'm still not playing GTD at this point, aside from trying a run or two every now and then when I'm super bored.

kristos - 2023-07-29 12:33:33.159594

HELP Im at the point i cant put all 5 blocks at 673 level. How can i end the game other than reset (which wont save my highscore i think)?

WGW - 2023-07-21 1:51:58.820643

@s: I haven't seen that particular bug myself. I actually haven't been playing for quite a while now. When the new Zelda game out I was completely lost in it for weeks, then I saw someone actually beat my top score (TTJ) and I just had no interest in even trying to top it at this point. :) Congrats to TTJ, whoever that is. I just check in on the comments and high score list every now and then. I see today that we have the first completely fake spam high score posted since the Flash version of GTD. Some a*hole with the name "bob" posted a high score that's obviously fake, considering that it shows a score of 12823921 at level ONE and in 49 seconds. Why even bother posting a fake high score if it's going to be THAT obvious that it's fake?!? Oh well. . . it would bother me a lot more if someone else hadn't already beaten my top score for real. Cheers!

kristos - 2023-07-19 10:41:28.014866

@s i was writing kristos in the nickname and in the email label my email, i tought it was supposed to be that wat. Thank you for the correction, i will just put my nickname there without my email then.

s - 2023-07-16 3:45:24.248122

@ kristos i forgot to say just put your regular name kristos and nothing else so it would be easy to find for you

s - 2023-07-16 1:24:22.098775

@ kristos yes that is exactly what i mean. Also @ wgw yesterday i experianced a game glitch ? it is hard to explain but any ways the glitch was that the game was off center and above the title of the game but every thing else was in corect order. so I just restarted my game to fix the game screen just so you are aware of it.

kristos - 2023-07-14 17:41:35.128690

@s You mean i should not add my email, just put a nickname?

s - 2023-07-13 17:58:16.577029

@ kristos you do not need your email for the high scores. you can look for my high scores and i never used my email you just need your (in game name ) I am preaty sure this is where you have gone wrong .

kristos - 2023-07-12 6:56:48.475846

@S Everytime i went past 50 on survival i was putting my nickname at the end and my email also in the box. I do not recive any emails and i cant find my nickname on the list too. Thats why im wondering if its something wront. i even tried different emails

s - 2023-07-12 3:32:52.839598

@ Kristos yes you just have to look for it . The lower level you are the lower you are for the high score page but you have to put you name it the box when you are defeated if you don't or regularly back out that run will not count at all .

kristos - 2023-07-07 12:55:41.536761

does the highscores works? I had a few 70-90 scores in survival mode, and it does not show. Right now im on a 400+ streak and i would love it to be there xd

kristos - 2023-06-02 11:16:36.595493

@S i never knew what that is, thank you!

s - 2023-06-01 18:29:30.952500

@ kristoes i have not played in a few weeks but if you look above the lucky Aisan Jades you will see a yellow number above it .But it has to be fully upgraded in order to work otherwise it will not work. and it is better to have it by wave 16 or earlier. And have it by freezing towers and overlapping areas for more effect .

kristos - 2023-06-01 8:32:46.113652

@s LuckyAsianJade gives money? In 1-10 wave i dont lose lifes yet, its starts after 20+level Blood stones are towers from the perfect ruby?

s - 2023-06-01 0:40:19.583550

@ kristos #1 the purpale jems that you get by chance will help minimilize loss of live for waves 1- 10 very well but further yo go the less its power will affect. # 2 It is always better to constantly be making more gems as soon as you can also use blood stones the do good damage to some prefer it not upgraded that is your choice to do and . And i always have two lucky jades fully upgraded so i will always have a good amount of money for waves 1-50 .

kristos - 2023-05-29 8:59:02.958666

@s i use only 1 mightmalachite, luckyasianjade, enchantedemeral, 3x rosequartzcrystal, yellow one with amethyst damage, opal tower and opal gem (for +damage and +speed attack) and the shell one for ground units. Nothing else. But i seem to cant stop loosing lifes at the begining too fast.

s - 2023-05-29 3:33:34.507531

@ wgw i do aggree that a daily chalange would be nice for most players that are able to compete in it . and @kristos there are gems , that will help minimize the loss of game lives but no matter what you try eventually you will lose lives you just have to do the best you can do.

kristos - 2023-05-14 18:17:28.792392

what the frack do you all use to counter the flying pigeons xD For now i have absolutly no problem handling the ground type units, but from the 24/28 lvl i loose life to flying guys, and from 40lvl i loose like 5-8 lifes on flying.

ckrack - 2023-05-12 6:17:52.529330

Okay, understand, thought it would have happened more often. Okay, I will try next time. Yes, some kind of missclick. I just put all in that left corner and got EE with my 5 picks... So I thought better to have this there as loosing 2 gems ;)

216 - 2023-05-11 19:57:50.337551

Every 50 lvls enemies have stun immunity, so in lvl 50, 150, .., grounds wont get stopped. Dont ingore lower right part of map, there is a lot good places for EE (that range also mid-c3 path). You dont have anytihng that hit flyers past c6. That EE near border.. missclick i guess?

Ckrack - 2023-05-11 14:32:11.823323

216 thank you! I guess this one's a little better. I have to end now, but I guess it would end soon. Sometimes ground enemies will not get stopped by EE, is this something special or a bug? So they never get stunned in some rounds. https://imgur.com/a/VAvCNdD

kristos - 2023-05-10 17:06:24.727623

also question, does the high scores works?

kristos - 2023-05-10 15:41:15.897235

87 lvl, but i just cant handle the flying creeps :(

WGW - 2023-05-08 15:43:28.048830

Is anyone else but 216 and me interested in RNG-seeded GTD Daily Challenge? Anyone? :) On thinking it over for a few days, I think maybe a *weekly* challenge with time-limited runs-- 2 hrs? 5 hrs?-- would make the most sense and be the most fair to all players. @216, I do have reasons for wanting to communicate outside this comments page-- mainly (but not only) I was hoping we might coordinate an effort to get Peter H's attention, because implementing this really will require so little time/changes/testing but would open the game up so much. My sense is that Peter hasn't been reading comments for many months. But again, I want to repeat that I don't take it personally at all if you only want to communicate via comments here.

216 - 2023-05-05 22:16:26.931530

Many things to improve. 5:2:2 jade:EG:EE ratio at lvl 50? notice that gold gain form jades is low before lvl 50, becuse enemies die too fast, in addition to lvl scaling of jade gold procs. I was trying to have around 3 EEs + 3 EGs at lvl 44. At this point 1 jade is enough (can have 2-3). Try to reduce leaks in 44 as much as possible, jades can wait untill ~50. - avoid junk gems, like flawed ruby. Once you have one paraiba, black opal(put it more close to mid) and RC, dont take parts for them. You may want 2nd paraiba for lvl 150 (stun immunity ground wawe). Maximize EGs, EEs (or at least jades) at this phase of game. Dont greed gold for repicks. -good EGs position (worth add 1 near that BO) -not good EEs position. I could say much about positioning them, but for now spread them in places that range multiple ways instead spaming them on mid. Try to make few stun zones. Mid zone is important, but adding many EEs here cause all hit same target, while EEs around mid(within 100 range) ussually do job anyway. But spamming dmg gems (mostly EGs, later worth also ABS) here works well. Consider modifing maze to allow more gems in good positions.

ckrack - 2023-05-05 13:42:41.371022

A little Update. Still loosing about 7 each fly round. No ground enemies. Added some EE... Need to stop now (I only play on my job :D) https://imgur.com/a/8yxZELA

Ckrack - 2023-05-05 11:32:34.726808

Thank you for the fast feedback. I began a new game this morning. Started loosing lives at 44 :D you must be kidding I guess I would need more EE? Any furhter ideas? No ground enemy running through but 8 flies https://imgur.com/a/I2jnoJF

216 - 2023-05-05 1:45:28.421208

It's nearly impossible to stop all air leaks at ~120 (it happens near 200, with 25-30 EEs). Leaking 5-6 is normmal at this point (maybe 3-5 with GO), but jades should give enough gold for lives. Quick question: are you getting leaks before lvl 44? Losing lives early may cause lose later even if you doing well. Would be easier to say anything with screenshot. Building jades, EGs, EEs is right way in general, but positions matter a lot too. @WGW: I think comments are right place for such disccusion, aren't they? (maybe someone else will get good idea as well). The idea of time limit with seeded RNG seems great, everyone will get GO (which is crucial for reducing times) at nearly same lvl (more repicks = faster), so it will really fair.

Ckrack - 2023-05-04 13:34:56.809841

Addtional: Of course also using black opal and great (or perfect, if I don't get) opal.

Ckrack - 2023-05-04 12:19:36.354525

Hi at all, I'm playing this game for some months now. I think my highest score was something about 120. I'm using a maze similar to WGW. There is no ground enemy stealing lives. But there are always a lot of flying enemies which kill me. I'm using the red crystal (usually one in the middle) and a lot of jades, emeralds and golden ones. I don't get that trick to stop flies...

WGW - 2023-05-03 9:00:07.816454

@216: Shoot me an email at wgwzxz-gtd@yahoo? You know me by now, I'm not engaging in some elaborate phishing scam, and besides, you can always just use a junk email address. Totally your call (and I won't take it personally if you don't contact me), but I'd really like to discuss/explore the possibilities of this new idea for a RNG-seeded "Daily Challenge" GTD. The more I think about it, the more I like it. I'm kinda jazzed up about it. GTD is the PERFECT game for RNG-seeded daily challenges, especially (upon reflection) if the runs are further time-limited. (10k seconds of in-game timer, maybe? i.e., less than three hours) This would be an entirely refreshing new game mode, with entirely different (and more interesting) strategies required, and it would address so many of folks' complaints while not costing a lot of a Peter H's time. With truly minimal code revision, GTD could be transformed overnight into an engaging and competitive game. "Daily Challenge GTD" would be more about fine tuning your choices to maximize your layout's efficiency so that you can get to a higher level before time runs out. A whole new, much more interesting way to play the same basic game. One shouldn't have to live like an invalid with obsessive compulsive disorder to get a top score in GTD. Hope to hear from you, but regardless, cheers!

WGW - 2023-05-03 8:54:56.166279

@kristos: Happy to help! This game-- as I'm sure you've already discovered-- is very oddly addictive.

kristos - 2023-05-03 7:13:39.313798

@WGW - Thank you for the answer! And for the tip :D

WGW - 2023-05-03 2:58:28.282104

Oh, and I should add, setting up this seeded daily challenge would also indirectly address the issue of "Peter never intended runs past level 500"-- cause 24 hours isn't enough time to get past level 500! Maybe if you never restart and never sleep, but that's about the upper limit. I think it would probably be better if there was a shorter time limit on the runs than 24 hours anyhow. If runs were set to end after, e.g., 5 hours of in-game timer (18k seconds), then it would add more incentive for efficient layouts that kill enemies more quickly. (Cause I think as it works now, your level is much more important to your final score than your time score is-- but I don't know the formula.) And this would also give everyone a chance to do a few restarts. . . and, you know, eat and sleep and such. . . You wouldn't want the winner every day to be the one lunatic who plays GTD nonstop for the most hours. We all know who'd win THAT contest.

WGW - 2023-05-03 2:49:14.656296

Even if stun RNG works out differently depending on divergent choices by the player (e.g., even doing a repick and then choosing a gem you already could have picked before, ending up with the same layout, would change the RNG rolls), but I think that's okay. I get your point completely in that this would lead to a variance in further RNG rolls that a player can't possibly PREDICT, but still, two players making the exact same choices would still have the exact same game outcome. So, repicks, yes, would change the sequence of future gem picks, stun effects, etc., but that altered sequence would be the same for anyone *else* doing a run with the same repick at the same point. The fact that GTD gameplay is 100% a series of discreet, finite choices (unlike, e.g., in an action game) makes an RNG seed fit much more easily than it does a game like Spelunky, but they've had seeded dily challenges for over 10 years. I'm guessing there are probably much more sophisticated ways of handling these RNG effects for games like Spelunky, but I think since in a 100% RNG seeded GTD the same exact player choices would lead to the same exact outcome, since runs could always be identically duplicated by any player making the same moves as someone else, then the seed is fair. . . Otherwise, you know I'm all in favor of bug fixes and potential changes to the game's design. But what might be very appealing about this from Peter's perspective is that on a coding level, it requires very, very minimal change to the actual game, and therefore very little testing. He would have to make a new framework for "daily challenges", of course, like setting up a daily seed, new leader board, etc, but these are really trivial compared to really tinkering with the game design. If we had this daily challenge mode, there would be an ongoing reason for people who got bored with GTD ages ago to actually play again. And I'd no longer hold a top position on the score board just cause I'm home all the time and am willing to play a run out for 3 weeks!

216 - 2023-05-03 1:48:11.964033

I like the idea, but first the game must be finished. I remeber Peter said we aren't supposed to get over lvl 500 scores ( and i fully aggre with it), so survival needs to be reworked, not even mentioning bugs that are really needed to be fixed. Version number also suggest something, but last update was 18 months ago - so if Peter dont have time to finish game, no reason to ask him for extra things. I still hope one day we will see v1.0 with balanced survival( gradually increasing difficulty after 200, so every run will end eventually) Btw, i dont think its possible to eliminate RNG at ALL, for example stun RNG, even with seeded RNG - different amount of gems, shoots, also different positions (optimal stun moments are different) so it still be a "random" aspect ( if someone thinks its not significant - same gems may cause sometiems 0, sometimes even 5 air leaks, just due to stun in more/less efficient positions. Ussually its 1-2 leaks difference) But i guess you mean mostly gem RNG, which could works well with seed, assuming no one use repick before max chances, there will be same gmes to choose ( sooner or later, depends of repicks)

WGW - 2023-05-03 0:10:08.423827

I just had a brainstorm on how to turn GTD into a competitive game without requiring really any overhaul at ALL. Two words: Seeded runs. "Daily challenges" based on RNG seeds are so commonplace, have been for years now. The only revision to the guts of the game code that would be necessary would be make sure every RNG element of the game is determined by the seed. Pretty easy to do. Otherwise, the game doesn't need to be changed in any way. There have been plenty of ideas thrown around here in the discussions for potential changes to GTD, by myself and others, but I don't recall anyone ever suggesting an RNG-seeded "daily challenge" mode, where everyone would have 24 hours to post their best score. It would be very easy to implement, and enhance the community aspect of the game 1000 fold. And I know I'm not alone in feeling that the community aspect of this game is a lot of what's kept interest up. If there are folks who would be interested in this, please chime in, because assuming Peter Holko has time to spend on this game again in the future, I think it would encourage him to entertain this notion if there was an indication of support for it in the comments. Let's start a petition! (No, I'm only joking.) But seriously, weigh in if you'd be interested in this. I mean, am I crazy that this is a great idea? It would eliminate the whole problem of survival mode runs potentially taking several WEEKS to play out. The longest any run could possibly be would be 24 hours. And it would provide a completely fair skill based competition factor in a single player game. Hell, I'd love to be able to square off against @216 in an RNG-neutral competition! (I suspect I would lose, tbh.) Thoughts?

WGW - 2023-05-02 21:10:53.167736

@kristos: You have to select "Survival" mode. All the other game modes end at level 50. Also, since you'll be new to survival mode, I might as well point out-- since there's no mention of it in the instructions-- that every 50 levels, all stun effects are disabled entirely (level 50, 100, 150, etc.) The first time you see it, most people (myself included) think it's just a weird bug, but it's not, it's part of the game. (It forces lots of enemies to leak at least occasionally, which artificially makes the game harder.)

kristos - 2023-05-02 8:36:44.901525

how do you pass lvl 50? at 50 it says "you won"

WGW - 2023-05-02 1:45:07.409277

@216, ah, my mistake re: Cheat Engine, sorry about that! To be clear, I never, ever thought of speeding the game up as cheating in any way, despite the name of the software. But I do remember now that it was a/aznist using Cheat Engine, not you. >> since there is no milestone around this lvl, it fell pointeless too eh, the whole game is pointless after you've basically figured it out, isn't it? In my case, as I keep saying, I find it much easier to keep my attention focused when, e.g., watching a TV show if I've got a GTD run going on the side. For most people that would probably be a distraction, but I seem to have become unable to focus on a video or whatever for more than a few minutes without a GTD run to tend to every few minutes. So I'm not really playing it as a game anymore, it's almost purely a "digital fidget spinner" for me. If it doesn't serve that purpose for you, I'd imagine it feels endlessly tedious and boring to play at this point. Really good to see a new comment from you!

216 - 2023-05-01 12:11:53.198759

@WGW: I was playing in normal speed, a/aznist was using Cheat engine. I'm still checking comments here, but i haven't done survival run since months. I dont like current version of the game - besides some bugs, getting to run out of space at lvl 1200+ isn't what i like - especially its not AS hard (I agree that game may be hard for new players, but it requires nowhere close experience in compare to defeating 196 in flash) -takes a lot of time (looking at WGW's lvl 1200+ scores it take ~15x longer than 196 without taking account of massive slowing bug in late game mentioned by him many times). My best flash lvl 196 times was about 21k seconds (there was some lags that caused time to be inacuratte and depends of system specs, here i got about 19k, while enemies have 4 more armor). -i think on my PC crash is possible at lvl 1200+ (its over 2GB leak?) This game badly need "speed up" button, but, at least it was possible to do 196+ run in 1 day if really wasnted to (but often was hibernating PC and spitting run in 2 days) Defeating 196 was challenging and satisfacting, now only lvl 150 is interesting (i cleared 150 with 0 leaks few times without even GO - needed ~15 EGs, 3-5 (not upgraded) BS and extra longered maze especcialy for 150. But it requies more optimal play since start - since you leak more, you need more jades, so less other gems, which cause even more leaks and more jades needed) Maybe i will try to get better lvl 200 time, but it requies really early GO, and since there is no milestone around this lvl, it fell pointeless too. Optimizing leaks and time was goals that i liked, not optimizing space for gems (which was interesing a bit as theoretical aspect, i predicted lvl ~1200 is possible in 2020, but server wasnt even accepting lvl 512+ scores then)

WGW - 2023-05-01 6:26:40.301291

Um. . . "discuss the fame" should be "discuss the game". Always with the damned TYPOS!

WGW - 2023-05-01 6:25:31.676892

@Waffles, Indeed, I agree 100%-- if not for this comments page and the fact that folks still discuss the fame actively (well, usually), I think I'd have stopped playing years ago. Or maybe not, cause there's clearly something deeply wrong with my brain. ;) But I honestly do enjoy the discussions here more than I do the actual game, and that's been the case for a few years now. :)

Waffles - 2023-05-01 0:53:53.306495

Finally gave in. Realized that my run could very easily get to levels way over 500 and that would take up most of the next week so I decided to get to 350 and then deconstruct as much as I could to just get the high score on the board and quit until another day. Ended up making it to 357 before it finally happened. Will upload an album with pictures and thoughts when I have more time, but so excited to have finally gotten to the upper echelon of GTD after many many years! I appreciate that this game still manages to keep a thriving, if small, community of players :)

WGW - 2023-05-01 0:41:49.845896

@Avitone: with respect to how I have so much time to play, I do have a huge "advantage" in having gone on long-term disability around 2010. So, being home all day most days, spending most of my waking hours in from of the PC (because I watch all media through the PC, too), I've had a GTD run going for probably 8 to 10 hours a day for more than a dozen years. . . with all too few exceptions, because it's a game that demands very, very little active attention after the first 50 or so levels. So much of one's success in this game is due to RNG factors, I have a huge advantage over most people in playing so many more runs than a normal (or, frankly a sane) person would be able to. E.g., I really don't even try to get past level 150 anymore without having gotten a great opal. It's possible to do it, but it's much tougher, and much slower, and much, much more frustrating. It's not a big deal for me to toss a run 4 hours in and just try again for a run with a great opal. It might take 2 weeks, even a month, before it happens, but it will happen eventually if you keep starting run after run after run. You also have to understand the game and know what you're doing, of course. . . but I'm happy to admit that I have an automatic advantage with RNG due to how many runs I can make. (@216 used to enjoy a similar advantage in the prior Flash version of GTD, because back then he was able to use Cheat Engine to speed the game up, which also enabled many more runs than normal. . . but I've never understood Cheat Engine and have never used it, so all my runs are in real time.) @Waffles: Congrats on getting past the hump! Level 150 is a serious run killer. If you get past level 152 and keep building jades, you're almost always safe from losing. But you may have to build a truly unreasonable number of jades.

Waffles - 2023-04-30 15:19:54.319856

Currently having my best run ever by *far*. Not sure why but I've just broken through whatever ceiling I had, which used to be around levels 75-96 (with 2 runs to levels 100 and 104 as my best), currently at 254 with no sign of slowing down. A little heartbroken that I screwed up somewhere in the 230s and replaced a gem in the wrong place leading to a way less efficient top-right quadrant of the grid (circled in yellow here: https://imgur.com/a/f4y8Qh2) but thus far still nowhere close to ground leaks, and losing 2-3 on flying levels. Not sure where this run could top out, I think if I hadn't screwed up that one placement I could cruise to 500+ just adding emeralds and facets, but now probably looking closer to 350-400 range. Might quit after 300 just because this mistake was so costly and the game has taken up so much time now. But still excited to share that I've finally reached the next level of GTD where levels are measured in hundreds rather than tens!

AVITONE - 2023-04-30 12:34:55.753480

The second pic was a fun run with 2 Great Topaz's. Did not have enough Jades soon enough to make it work.

AVITONE - 2023-04-30 12:30:44.168129

Wow how do you have so much time to play!!! I recently had a good run going but got bored and quit before level 600 https://imgur.com/a/CYOq2Xe

WGW - 2023-04-29 2:06:42.368843

Oh, and I also wanted to mention: I now understand how the "frozen rock", "6 gem pick turn", and "placing a gem on top of an existing gem" happen (see below comments if you don't know what I'm talking about). For the few who bother to play GTD to the point where enemy gets glitched (when that happens depends on your system specs, and how many paraibas/bloodstones you build-- for me, it starts to happen reliably by level 800): What's happening is that the more the game bogs down to to its still existing memory leak (which doesn't crash the game anymore, but does still slow it down considerably in late levels), the more there is a delay between your clicking to place a gem and the gem actually showing up on screen. In very late levels, this delay gets to be longer than a full second. If, after clicking to place your fifth gem, you click a sixth time BEFORE the game has had a chance to actually display the fifth gem on screen, your sixth click will actually place an additional sixth gem on that turn. This is what leads to very strange, seemingly random, behvaior in behavior such as the frozen (non-removable) rocks, or being able to place a gem on top of an already existing one. It will only even possibly happen when you've played the game out to a high enough level that it's starting to choke (which again depends on system specs and on the number of paraiba and bloodstone towers you build, because these two towers' animated attacks [frost and flame] are the ones that cause the memory leak), and will only happen if you're clicking too quickly for the (choking) game to keep up in very, very late levels. fwiw!

WGW - 2023-04-29 1:57:50.142188

Hi, Avitone! Is this a new (lamentable) record, that a full month passed without a new comment posted here? I was going to post a comment a few weeks ago to note that I'd posted a new best-ever score (level 1241), but I didn't really have that much to say about it and feared it would just come off as empty gloating. I prefer any gloating I might do to have some actual potential informational value. ;) I have video of the last 20 levels (though edited down because they were truly ungodly slow, taking around 9 to 10 minutes per ground level), but who wants to watch it? What is there to be learned? I thought that was it-- even knowing that a couple of my own mistakes cost me five additional levels-- and I'd finally accept that there was no more for me to get out of playing this game, but again found that I'm now totally unable to just, say, watch a video with completely focused attention without getting very bored or very antsy very quickly. So I started new GTD runs. Today I lost a run at level 152 where I got a great opal at level ***32***. Painful, but it saved me literally two more weeks of completely boring gameplay to beat the level 1241 high score. So, I'm still going to be at it, for no good reason at all other than compulsion and the need to split my attention when I'm watching video in order to stay engaged. I am very curious where @216 has gone to, no comments here for a while now.

AVITONE - 2023-04-29 1:07:42.755988

Hi

VXA - 2023-03-29 23:17:42.770920

I would so love to play this game again.. Back in flash days I used to play a lot with the speedhack, trying to get to lvl 195 (often dying around lvl 150 when flyers stuck together :D ), but now without the speedhack it is sooo slow to play... I dont have that much free time now. If you could just implement some speed up buttons (eg. 1x, 3x, 10x, 25x in the bottom right corner), it would be super awesome. I was actually also playing with the idea of reprogramming the game myself lol :D I totally get WGW's attitude towards it.

Mikis - 2023-03-27 10:43:30.358853

so I've gotten to 300+ levels again and as usual, I got really bored. Usually, I just close the window at this point, but I decided I will just stop buying new lives and see how far will I get with the 50/100 levels leaks. this is my maze right now: https://imgur.com/a/WFM7LPq

WGW - 2023-03-21 14:01:25.598476

I've been playing on a Dell gaming PC I got last year, which was relatively high end at the time I got it but not super-powered or anything (not that a game like this should require anything but the most basic system). By now my PC would probably be considered pretty average for a new purchase. I still use Windows 10, playing GTD in MS Edge. None of this should affect a game like this, of course, but I still believe it does. If nothing else, if you're playing GTD on a PC with low RAM (under 8GB), the browser is probably going to crash on you by level 700 or so due to the game's memory leak. I was being a bit facetious in saying "the thrill is gone". . . I mean, who would I be kidding, even pretending I'm not going to play this anymore??? I've already got another run going, for god's sake. I'm HOPELESS! But I'm definitely not going to even try to do level 1100+ runs anymore. This current run I drew two great opals by level 60(!), and I'm still not even vaguely trying to maximize space/turns. I'll be happy with a level 1000 score-- it's a lot easier, and I just don't want to play single runs out for 2+ weeks anymore where I can't even put the PC in suspend mode, because sometimes I've lost all progress that way. I'll be much happier playing shorter runs, and my poor overworked PC will finally get a rest! Thanks much for the congrats on this truly spectacularly trivial achievement. ;)

AVITONE - 2023-03-21 1:51:21.623017

Good Job WGW!! I'm curious. What kind of system do you play on?

Waffles - 2023-03-20 15:51:14.218139

So cool to get a shoutout from the GTD king @WGW! So sad about that run ending at 1226 and that the excitement is gone :( Maybe a break from the game would help rediscover the magic? That's what I've found with other games. That said, love that other people are still playing and commenting on GTD so many years after it was published

WGW - 2023-03-20 13:10:53.833986

. . . and. . . I wasn't paying attention, so I just inadvertently lost prematurely at level 1226. Oh well. At least I've got the top high score again, and now I don't have to play for another 4 hours. Somehow I feel. . . empty. ;)

WGW - 2023-03-20 12:59:45.997665

Congrats, @Waffles! It's a red letter GTD day, then, because in matter of a couple (or three) more hours, I'll be posting a new high score which is really as high as I can feasibly get to, somewhere around level 1240 or so, not sure exactly at what point I'll quit. I could go above level 1250, but it's SO SLOW now (taking more than 10 minutes per level), and the fact that my last run this good crashed Windows entirely is making me too nervous. And it's still possible the high score text could end blank (though I haven't seen that happen for quite a while). I'm recording a video of the last couple of dozen levels as proof of the run, just in case something goes blooey and I don't get to post the high score. But assuming I do get to post it later today, seriously, if anyone beats this run, they're welcome to keep the top score slot, cause I think I'm finally done. The thrill is gone. ;) Screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/3F3c2w6

Waffles - 2023-03-20 5:03:36.110764

Finally made it to level 100!!! My goal for months has been to make it to 100 but had never really come close until today! I'm sure my maze could be much, much improved but here's what got me there: https://imgur.com/a/AzJk1fl

hello - 2023-03-19 11:02:40.518698

testing </textarea> this thing

WGW - 2023-03-06 20:48:18.077366

Bummer, @Irina! I think if you'd had good enough RNG luck to get a great opal on that run, you would have made it past level 150 easily. You're definitely making progress!

Irina - 2023-03-06 16:51:15.633396

https://imgur.com/a/o4Yc8SP It had potential, but I lost at 150 :( Couldn't get the fastest one to save my life. Used like 200k in repicks and never got it.

s - 2023-03-04 3:23:34.606230

@ wgw you are correct except for point b I am not losing because there is a temporary cap for me . and my towers are not being frozen ?

WGW - 2023-03-03 1:19:48.272273

@s, I asked if anyone "who has a run going above level 600 or so check their browser's memory usage so we can see if the memory leak is fixed for everyone and not just me"; I wasn't asking about the enemy movement glitch. I'm not being confrontational here. . . if you are experiencing the movement glitch as early as level 50, well, okay. But (a) that was not what I asked about, and (b) you said the movement glitch is causing you to lose, and that's just not how this glitch operates. It won't cause you to lose-- it actually causes the game to be unloseable (but very slow), cause enemies become frozen in place and just get hit by your towers till they die. Slowly. Really, I'm not trying to start a fight. :)

s - 2023-03-03 0:29:26.409816

@ wgw I am not sure why you even asked the question for example you said and i quote ( others here have said they see the problem at 500). it dose not mean any other people can experiance the same thing earlier then most other people. also not trying to be rude I have already stated the same thing at least 3 or 4 time already.

WGW - 2023-03-02 7:39:53.534585

@s, not sure what you're experiencing, but the movement glitch doesn't start until around level 700-800 for me, though others here have said they see the problem starting as early as level 500. There shouldn't be any enemy movement glitch at level 50. Also, the enemy movement glitch actually makes the game *easier*, in that no enemies will ever escape (because they get frozen in place when the GTD browser window has active focus), unless you choose to free up their movement by clicking off the GTD window and letting it lose focus. Once you get to the point (late game) that this enemy movement glitch starts to happen, the game is actually unlosable (though INCREDIBLY slow) until you run out of room for more turns. As far as the memory leak, I don't know what happened, that suddenly for the first time since the javascript version of GTD came out the game wasn't using tons of memory at very late levels. It was patched by Peter H. to the extent that the leak no longer crashed the game, but the leak still existed. My last run, which was absolutely going to make it past level 1250, caused a total Windows crash at level 1050 or so, and so it all went down the toilet. You should have seen my face. My sneaking suspicion is that the very fact that the game was oddly not using tons of memory is what caused the crash, because this is really the first time the javascript GTD has ever crashed on me since that initial patch by Peter I mentioned above. I think something weird was happening that I may never be able to nail down, but it was very, very, very strange for GTD to go from using 2GB of RAM (normally) at level 1000, for this one and only one run, it was using under 100MB. Or it could be totally unrelated to RAM usage, but that was the only variable that I can identify that was different from the dozens, hundreds of runs I've played since the patch. I'm beyond frustrated and angry. More than 70 hours of playing down the drain. And recreating the good RNG in another run (e.g., getting a great opal by level 60) will mean doing a ton more failed runs until everything clicks into proper place, with no assurance that even when that happens again, the game won't once again crash before I finish. Or that the text of any high score I post won't end up blank (though I haven't seen that bug happen for a while, but again, I don't think that's because the game has been updated in any way, so it may be that I've just been lucky in not seeing the bug again and that it will still happen seemingly at random. Really, I'm beyond frustrated. I should have been able to reclaim the top score position and I didn't only because the damned computer crashed. It's going to be quite a while, I think, before I'm over it enough to try again! :( :( :(

s - 2023-03-02 0:12:40.238673

@ wgw I can say that the movement is not fixed for me that is why I can not get past level 50 .

WGW - 2023-03-01 8:20:02.037451

Has the memory leak actually been fixed?!? See this screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/4dHuqv9 I'm currently past level 1000, and before today, GTD runs going that high would be using over 2GB of RAM. It's now using 65MB?!? That can't just "happen", right? But I'm not aware of any updates. What's also interesting is that the game is still suffering from the exact same movement glitch we've discussed before, and it's just as bad as ever. I previously suspected that this was a side effect of the memory leak, but if the game is only using 65MB now at level 1000 and still completely enemy is still just as glitched out/slow as ever, then clearly it's not the memory usage that causes it (and I'm using the same browser, to be clear.) Can anyone else who has a run going above level 600 or so check their browser's memory usage so we can see if the memory leak is fixed for everyone and not just me? Very interesting. . . and surprising!

WGW - 2023-03-01 8:13:55.577629

@micky: Yes, as @s said, if you could post a screenshot that would help me offer some specific tips. But in case you missed it, see the comment below, WGW - 2022-06-24 4:23:59.022491, which is my attempt to give an overview of stuff that otherwise takes a long time for new players to figure out on their own. One thing I would caution you about, though, is that following my maze might be making things *harder* for you, because a lot of the elements of my stategy now is geared towards maximizing space so I can push the limits of how high a level you can get to, and requires a lot of RNG things to fall in line to actually work. e.g., I know that it's possible to get a run going without a great opal that can sustain itself forever (well, until you run out room, or patience to keep playing). But the way I play now, if I don't get a great opal by level 100, I will almost always lose somewhere between level 100 and 150. To make the earlier levels easier-- in terms of keeping ground enemies from ever escaping before level 150-- your maze layout should be as long as you can make it, so a 7-pass maze with as long as you can make each pass, which will REALLY help you not leak any ground enemies on level 50. Leaking any ground enemies on level 50 is basically a game over, even if it takes another 50 levels to finally implode. You just can't afford to leak ground enemies before level 150, imo. Basically, you can copy the structure of my layout and do well, but it'll be a lot easier for ground enemy levels if you make it more zig-zaggy and extend it. Also, in terms of tower placement, following my screenshots is going to lead you very astray, because I have to avoid building towers in much of the center of the board for ultra-late game reasons. So if you're not going for, like, level 1000, you definitely will want to fill the center with towers ASAP. As I keep saying, this is a HARD game! And RNG can really screw you even in what starts out as a very solid run. If you keep at it, and look at some of the tips I posted, I'm sure you can get further. :)

s - 2023-02-28 22:43:17.359431

@ mickey i would sugest that the next time you play take a picture on it and put it on imigure so wgw can help you .

Mickey - 2023-02-28 4:06:37.095017

30, US, playing since high school. Anybody have any tips on getting farther than the double digits in survival? My pr is 55 or so, but generally I fail somewhere in the 30s. Real talk lately I've mostly been copying WGW's maze they've been recently posting XD

WGW - 2023-02-24 23:42:24.878018

@fluff, fwiw, I've been using MS Edge to play GTD for about a year now and it's never crashed on me (nor done whatever it is that you're describing!) I'm currently at level 715, in a run that should go to at least level 1260, but this is the point at which the game starts to really get slow. So it'll probably take at least 4 or 5 more days (started the run over 4 days ago): https://imgur.com/a/fPDchRl

fluff - 2023-02-24 16:43:30.787614

34, US, WI Played the flash version. Eventually remembered it and wanted to play again, leading to finding this site. But man... now my browser is doing something where stops keeping track of tabs and just refreshes them at some point. I don't think there's another explanation I can come up with for why I just lost the run I was doing.

s - 2023-02-24 3:14:41.077628

16 in piedmont missiouri started playing 2 or 3 years ago .

WGW - 2023-02-21 2:41:39.947077

Progress towards what should be a level 1250+ run, provided Windows doesn't reboot itself while I (occasionally) sleep: https://imgur.com/a/HkIyjGN

WGW - 2023-02-19 5:27:14.608077

Looking forward to more folks leaving comments saying who they are and how they started playing this game. :) In the mean time, I've got by far my best run ever going now, after a couple of weeks of pure frustration where the game kept refusing to give me at least one of the perfect gems that you absolutely need in order to get past level 50 without losing lives (you generally need at least one perfect opal, amethyst, aquamarine and ruby, so if you don't get them, you're just screwed by RNG). It's close to the my absolute ideal, aside from having more than one malachite and one rose quartz crystal. But it's very, very hard to get by early game without losing lives or repicking unless you accept building these very sub-ideal additional towers along the way. But otherwise, this run will completely conform to my "maximum space" late game layout, which allows for 335 gems/towers to be placed. There are no misplaced towers, there's a Great Opal right where it should be (and if I can score a second one near the bottom it will speed up the very slow late game), and I went from leaking 7 air enemies before the Great Opal to now leaking 2 or 3. Screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/63fiLvR Even though it's the most boring thing in the world to watch, I decided to start recording this run to video for posterity. Or at least as evidence that I was on my way to a score above level 1250 before something dumb happened like a Windows Update. . . I'll post it to the same YouTube channel where I put the other videos, when I (eventually) (hopefully) finish the run. But please don't let my blathering stop anyone else from "introducing" themselves. I haven't seen @216 comment in a while now, but I remember s/he made reference to living in Poland, proving that GTD is an international game. ;)

Irina - 2023-02-19 4:47:58.561061

34 in Kansas

AVITONE - 2023-02-18 20:51:45.939434

I'm 51 living in Wisconsin. I first enjoyed playing this game in the Starcraft 2 map years ago. It was always fun/frustrating to play weather in multiplayer matches or solo runs late into the night.

Uncle Tony - 2023-02-18 14:02:01.965997

I'm 29 in Delaware. Played this game a long time ago and remembered it recently. Still trying to hit lvl 150, just made it to 128 which is my farthest yet but I still have some learning to do apparently

WGW - 2023-02-18 4:58:56.301430

I'm 50, recently moved back to my roots in NY. And very frustrated that GTD has been refusing to give me the gems I need for the past ~50 runs I've played. ;) I don't remember exactly when I started playing this, but it was 2011 at the latest. Insane that I'm still at it after more than a dozen years.

AVITONE - 2023-02-18 2:15:15.766894

Just curious..... would anyone like to share their age and general location? I think it would be interesting to see the age range that's playing this insanely simple and addicting game. I'll go first if anyone wants to join this.

WGW - 2023-02-13 0:20:27.761024

Someone beat my top score?!? Congrats to @PADOC, whoever you are, sincerely! But rest assured, I'm now truly and fully committed to recapturing the top score. Just a matter of time. . . ;)

WGW - 2023-02-02 20:30:39.571312

So. . . earlier today I lost my latest record-breaking run, and I can't even blame it on a power failure, or a browser crash, or Windows Update rebooting the PC. I just flipped the wrong damned light switch, which controls the outlet the PC is plugged into rather than the ceiling light I MEANT to turn off. So I basically unplugged my PC at level 1050. 90 hours of GTD down the drain and it's MY FAULT!!! So, so, SO stupid. I gotta put tape on that light switch one of these days so I never do that again. . . Meanwhile, perhaps of more general interest than my whining about how stupid I am. . . A strange thing happened in level 1007 when I was placing gems very fast while repicking: the game actually let me place SIX gems instead of five. I've never seen THAT before! Here's a screenshot of it: https://imgur.com/a/jR9Ka44 I have a feeling now that what causes these weird glitches with rock/gem placement late game is specifically trying to place the rocks too quickly. Frozen rocks, getting to place an extra gem, or the game allowing you to place a gem on TOP of an existing gem (per @slawter's comments below, which also noted placing gems very fast at the time), I think they're all caused by this same thing. Once the game is starting to choke in late levels with the enemy movement glitch, you should watch out to not place rocks/gems too fast or you might get deeply screwed over. There's an increasing delay in late game from when you click a spot to place a gem to when you see it actually appear on the screen, more than a full second really late-game, which is another reason I suspect that placing gems too fast causes this glitchy behavior. Fwiw. Meanwhile, I'm going to continue to lick my wounds over power-failuring myself out of a level 1236 run. I sure don't have it in me to start another run just at the moment. ;)

WGW - 2023-02-02 20:24:39.064301

Yes, it's definitely better (if counter-intuitive) to leave bloodstones unupgraded because the upgraded ancient bloodstone loses the area of effect attack (attacking ALL enemies in range) for the flame attack, which is only helpful after you've built a lot of stun power. I usually only upgrade them around level 80 now (it depends on your build). If you can post a screenshot, @waffles, I might be able to offer some more specific suggestions, but that's of course up to you. :)

s - 2023-02-02 4:00:42.456916

@ waffles it is recomended not to upgrade blood stones if i rember correctly @wgw mentioned that regular blood stones do more damage than upgraded blood stones in past commits or somthing similar.

Waffles - 2023-02-01 20:54:12.652458

@Fluff Thank you for the advice! I did not realize the importance of the amethyst weakness after level 39, or that blood stone is so crucial. I had been reluctant because the armor downgrade only applies to targets attacked, and it started to seem like over level ~32 hp gets so high that only lots of jade/emerald to stun enemies was working. Why not upgraded for blood stone? Again appreciate your input!!!

fluff - 2023-02-01 16:05:29.050189

@Waffles Blood stone, not upgraded, is important to get past level 50. The general recommendation is to get it no later than level 35. Also, I'm not sure why you're reluctant to get egyptian gold. In addition to the armor reduction, they do amethyst damage, the weakness of every wave after 39. Otherwise maze length and luck are mostly what you need. I keep losing games due to computer restarts or similar. It's frustrating.

Waffles - 2023-01-30 23:55:27.409316

@WGW I've seen your comments about the importance of getting a great opal, but the percent chance of that happening on any given turn at max odds is only 0.15%. My experience (granted my mazes could probably be improved) is that getting past level ~50 without excellent early game luck is very difficult. I'm not sure if I should be abandoning ~99.8% of my rounds or if there's some secret I'm just not understanding! I only build a few types of special (reluctantly gold, otherwise rosequartzcrystal, perfect black opal, tourmaline facet, luckyasianjade, and the emerald stun one) and use the combine special bug to improve my frequencies for the key ones. What am I missing here?

WGW - 2023-01-30 14:07:38.674917

@Irina: Happy to (I hope!) help, and let me know how you progress. :) Myself, I'm very bummed out because I thought I had a run that could get past level 1250, but that's no longer the case because (a) I made a very stupid mistake in gem placement which cost me four turns, and (b) I just got a dreaded frozen rock (i.e., a rock which for reasons unknown can't be clicked on and can't be removed) in a spot which will cost me an additional 8 turns. So now the best I can do is level 1236, which is still a lot higher than my last high score, but knowing that I could/should have easily gotten at least another dozen levels out of this run is probably gonna make me want to try again. Like an idiot. fwiw, here's the screenshot, with the frozen rock highlighted: https://imgur.com/a/YpyqoIt

Irina - 2023-01-27 0:19:26.534353

Thank you for your super detailed feedback and I definitely will take it to heart! I never build the rose quartz so that's something I can definitely implement immediately. I just thought it didn't really help but it clearly does so that's noted for sure. Yes, I did get the star in one turn, but I understand about wasted turns. It really doesn't help anything anyway, so it's truly not necessary. I'm going to start a new run now, please pray for a great opal for me :)

WGW - 2023-01-26 23:52:26.717416

@833_57: Unfortunately no. I don't think was an intentional thing-- the old Flash version of GTD would run *slower* if the browser tab was hidden or minimized, but it didn't stop running altogether. It's pretty annoying, but I think it's a platform issue (Flash behaving differently than Javascript) rather than anything specific to the programming code that could be changed.

833_57 - 2023-01-26 13:36:02.644250

Is there a way to keep game running in the background? It pauses when i go to a new tab in my browser.

WGW - 2023-01-26 8:01:12.125140

@Irina: My apologies, your maze is already 7-pass. I swear, I looked at it a dozen times to make sure I wasn't misreading it, but I was. So obviously, disregard everything I said about that. Sigh.

WGW - 2023-01-26 7:48:56.590225

Fwiw, I'm currently on (yes, I've said this before, but) a run that really should be just about the best I'll ever be able to do, which should get to level 1245 barring a crash/power failure. I did make a couple of minor mistakes so I'll always know I could've pushed this one a BIT further, but we're talking about maybe 10 more levels. I'm using a layout now that, as far as I can figure, completely maximizes for space (at the enormous expense of a sub-ideal layout for any other purpose), and I only built 75 towers that aren't paraibas. The whole rest of the map is going to be completely filled with paraibas by the end. So. . . will this finally do it? Will I finally get the GTD monkey off my back knowing I can't realistically do any better? Or will I just keep playing forever regardless? Or will Windows just decide to reboot itself while I'm asleep and cause me to lose the entire run? Tune in tomorrow for the next exciting episode of "WGW: Hopeless GTD Addict". . .

WGW - 2023-01-26 7:43:13.259308

@Irina: Glad you posted a screenshot-- you're doing pretty well, considering you didn't get a great opal! But I can offer a few suggestions I think will help. First thing: you don't have a rose quartz built, so I'm actually a bit surprised you've gotten as far as you have. Without the armor reduction, you're probably losing an extra 20 lives minimum in the air levels in the 36 to 44 range just by not having a rose quartz, and probably at least one or two more avoidable air leaks for every air wave later on. I generally build two rose quartzes, so I can cover the entire air enemy path, but it's not strictly necessary (I do think it saves at least few escaped air enemies early on if you have two, but you don't really need more than one.) Even though leaking feels very inconsequential in the early game, the cost starts to skyrocket so fast, you really can't afford to allow any preventable leaks (most of all, no ground enemy leaks except on no-stun levels from 150 up). So that's my first suggestion, which is real, easy, to build at least one rose quartz in the center by level 36. Second: Your maze is pretty good, but it's only a six-pass maze when it's possible to make seven-pass mazes. The problem is with the very end, where enemies reaching the last waypoint then have a straight path to the exit. Now, if you're not leaking ground enemies (which I don't know), then this isn't really a problem, at least at this stage. But I'm guessing that you're leaking at least leaking some ground enemies on the no-stun level 50, and you probably wouldn't be if you had a 7-pass rather than a 6-pass maze. Even if you're doing okay with ground levels so far and only leaking air enemies, I think you're going to find that until you have lots and lots of stun power (dark emeralds), you're going to start leaking ground enemies even on NORMAL levels (not the no-stun levels) later on in the game as their hitpoints start to get maddeningly high. So I'd suggest tweaking your maze layout at least to make it 7-pass. It looks pretty good to me otherwise. I also notice a pesky little star ruby at the bottom, which I'm sure you only placed because you got all three gems for it on a single turn. Because star rubies are just never worth building at all, ever, even if you get them on a single turn. They're just far too weak. Every wasted turn in GTD (e.g., building too many weak towers before you max out gem chances) ends up putting strain on long term survival. If you draw that star ruby on level 5, you think, "Eh, I'll just take it, it won't do any harm", but what you're really doing is depriving yourself of doing anything useful for that turn (or possibly for three turns if you don't get all the gems in one pick!) It seems harmless early on, but you need all the attack power you can build early on to keep a lid on the air levels. If I get really useless gems before level 12 or so, I usually just restart. But really, the biggest problem you're having, as I've said before, is playing runs where you don't get a great opal. It is absolutely not necessary to get a great opal in order to build a stable GTD survival run, but it's about 10 times harder, and a lot more ends up dependent on how the pure RNG factor of how well air enemies get stunlocked from level 48 on. With a great opal, stunlocks are at least reliable enough that you're not going to be leaking EIGHT air enemies even with plenty of dark emeralds built, which, without a great opal, just happens ALL THE TIME. I've had a handful of runs where I managed to squeak by to a sustainable run without a great opal, but they were just brutally hard, I was on always on the edge of losing until level 300 or so, and I had to build a completely ungoldly number of jades to earn gold to do it (more than 20!) I'm at a point now where I only play runs up to level 150 or so before giving up unless I get a great opal, because the great opal-less runs are no fun to play out. You absolutely should be able to get past level 100 without a great opal, though. Long term survival becomes a slog without one. But if you try out the suggestions above, I think you'll at least get a lot further, even without a great opal. And meanwhile, curse the game for not giving you a great opal, because it would make your runs 10 times easier and more forgiving if you just got one early on. Hope this helps and wasn't too long to read. :)

Irina - 2023-01-26 1:47:10.078851

Hello, this is my map https://imgur.com/a/8lfv4P9 I'm obviously not a pro at this game, but this is the level I lost at. I'd appreciate any advice or feedback. :)

s - 2023-01-20 3:57:43.388472

very funny @ wgw but i did not know browsers could crash so thanks ?

WGW - 2023-01-19 3:31:54.744307

Well, at least your browser was sad about it, @fluff. . . I haven't gotten a browser crash in GTD for a very long time, fwiw.

fluff - 2023-01-18 17:12:54.793359

Not sure if this was particular to something I was doing, but the game just died on me about an hour ago. Was in the middle of a level, and suddenly the rectangle where the game was supposed to be was blank with a tiny unhappy face at the top left. Wasn't all that far in though.

fluff - 2023-01-17 14:50:51.476899

Haha, I see we're discussing an autosave feature. I could have used that yesterday. I was on probably the best run I've ever had, and due to nonsense related to a password reset, IT must have restarted my laptop.

cyberleon - 2023-01-14 19:45:58.626091

Funny to see it again after having played it millenia ago in Warcraft 3 - nice :D

WGW - 2023-01-11 21:35:03.465606

@S, I think we're thinking along the same lines-- maybe it could work after all!

s - 2023-01-11 3:09:06.126264

@ wgw just to add a though to your (piggy backed idea) if it would be possiable I would try to have the save per level more spreaded out and once you restart you would a certain time limit before the save deleats just to preveny from blackouts . outher wise i think it would be a good start.

WGW - 2023-01-09 22:59:31.091889

Actually, if the game autosaved at the end of every level, it would be better if the RNG factor stayed as is, and NOT be changed to be based on a seed, because the advantage of save spamming once per level plummets WITHOUT a seed which would guarantee you'd get the same exact gem picks! This could actually work decently well-- restoring once per level isn't all that great an advantage if you don't know what gems you're getting upon a restore. And piggy-backing on @s's idea, the game could also limit your ability to do a game restore, e.g., to once every 100 levels, meaning that it will autosave every level and you can restore from the level you were at before a crash at any time, but once you do a restore, you're locked out from doing another restore for, say, 50 levels. Again, an imperfect solution, but it might be a lot better than having no save feature at all, and I don't THINK it would ruin the game.

WGW - 2023-01-09 22:49:18.346769

Okay, here's a thought: Maybe the game could autosave at the end of each level, with the save game being deleted the first time it's restored. So let's say, you've just completed level 90, the game autosaves, and you make your turn for level 91. If you get a crash for any reason, you can go back and restore your level 90 game, but then that save game is deleted. You won't have any save game to restore until you get past the next level, level 91. Then after you pass level 91, the game autosaves again. Now, technically, this would still allow you to save spam ONCE per level, which is not great, so I don't consider this a "solution", but being able to save spam only once would not be all that be an advantage, I think, especially if this were COMBINED with all RNG being based on a seed. Anyhow, that's my over-complicated take on all this, but it's kinda moot unless the developer has the time and inclination to make changes, which might never happen. There haven't been any updates in quite a while.

WGW - 2023-01-09 22:39:52.897132

Just adding one more angle on why save games would ruin the RNG factor-- sometimes games can address this by using a RNG seed, so that you can keep restoring but you'll get exactly the same RNG gameplay each time. But the more I thought about it, even that won't work in GTD. Even with a seed, so that every time you restored a game you'd get exactly the same gem picks in the same order, you'd still be able to, e.g., deplete all your gold doing as many repicks as possible on every turn in the hopes of getting a great opal. If you don't get one, you just restore your save. If you do, you won't care if you spent all your gold to get it. And this is just one example. So even using a seed for the RNG elements would pretty much ruin GTD. It's not so much a computer/programming problem as a game design/conceptual problem, which I really don't think is solvable, sadly. :(

WGW - 2023-01-09 22:18:53.617606

@s: You make an interesting suggestion, but having thought about the problem a lot, I just don't see an answer here. The nature of this game basically requires that there's no saving allowed, or the entire RNG/luck element is lost. I can see implementing a "one time restore" save so that, e.g., you can turn off your PC/close the browser window when you're not playing-- that would be GREAT. But unless the save game is deleted once you resume the game, I don't see any way to prevent save spamming. I'll spare everyone a longer explanation of why I don't think this can be solved, but suffice it to say, I have put a good deal of thought into it. It's a bummer. :( It would be a lot less of a big deal if getting a top scoring run didn't require playing for 100+ hours!

WGW - 2023-01-09 22:12:11.710793

It's more "love/hate" with me. . . I hope that's the case for you, too, as I wouldn't envy being addicted to playing a game you purely loathe. :) As frustrated as I get with all the "non-gameplay" ways that runs can end (I just lost another potential record breaker due to a complete OS crash), I personally tend to get much angrier (pointlessly) at runs of terrible RNG. Sometimes I can go a month without having a run that will get past level 150-- maybe because I should end a lot more runs early on than I do and waste a lot of time playing out unpromising starts. When the game, e.g., just refuses to give me a perfect opal-- not a GREAT opal, mind you, just a perfect-- for a week straight, I get very, very pissed off. Somehow, much more pissed off than I get at losing runs at level 800 due a power failure or some such. It's also terribly unfair that as things stand now, depending on your system specs, the game may start choking much earlier and become basically unplayable at ultra late levels (per the comments from @Slawler below). It's all quite frustrating, to say the least. And yet, we keep playing. . .

DRJMN - 2023-01-09 1:49:49.050860

I hate this game with a passion. Its so simple yet so friggin addictive and the fact it takes literally weeks to complete a game makes those instances where we lose what would have been a great game is tripley frustrating.

s - 2023-01-08 16:37:11.964996

@ wgw I do agree that a save feature would defeat the purpose of this game if people could spam the save button . but i do see a way it could be included in the game like every 400 - 500 waves a person had to pass before he could save again or have it to were it would show up on a set wave like as a check point or something ? it is the only way i think it could be solved . but I am no computer expert .

WGW - 2023-01-03 23:21:06.601096

I feel your pain, @DR JM NIPOK. I just had a run which would have gotten to level 1238, which I lost because Windows decided to reboot itself without any warning while I was out of the apartment for an HOUR. I was already past level 800. :( The problem with introducing a save feature is that, as incredibly frustrating as it is to lose long runs for stupid non-gameplay reasons, if there were a save feature, it would utterly and completely ruin the game by allowing you to restore your game until you get good gem picks ("save spamming"). There's no way around this that I can think of except for saved games to only be restore-able ONCE, and i you can only restore any saved game once, then saving won't prevent you from losing runs due to a browser crash or a system reboot. I don't think it's a solvable problem. :(

DR JM NIPOK - 2022-12-29 13:14:57.339362

so frustrating to get past level 750 and still have so many free blocks left and have the browser freeze then the pc lockup. Wish there was a save function that could somehow save progress. Having to take focus off the window to get movement but then run 6 or 7 times slower is a killer. Hope that glitch can get fixed someday...

DR JM NIPOK - 2022-12-24 2:46:03.066407

On a good run, at 575 , lots of gold, and lots of spaces to fill up. Figured out a trick. Starting a new session in private window or incognito window even with multiple open and other regular browser windows open will still save the name with the score. Gets around the blank name issue.Also lets you start 4 or 5 at once and as they fizzle out restart and if no great opal and handful of luckyasian by level 35-40 restart it. If you don't have great opal and at least 4 or 5 luckyasianjade by level forty the odds of getting a decent score diminishes every level. Then shift focus to enchanted emeralds. If you don't have enough enchanted emeralds by level 90 to hold off at least half the flyers its going to go down quick. Try to group 3 or 4 around different spots to stop em. I also get glitchy when too many Tourmalines an you need to take focus off the window so pieces move at slow speed but atleast they move. That bug is the worst because the later levels already take so long to drain the buggers that having to run in slow speed in the background sucks!. Good luck folks, have a festive festivus.

Slawter - 2022-12-22 23:37:32.680294

@WGW: Yeah the glitched movement stopped even with window focus but it's unbearably slow. I did find a temporary fix which lasted another six levels but that's stopped working too, which is a shame as I think this run could've got to level 1232. https://i.imgur.com/gLbXeUr.png

WGW - 2022-12-21 20:30:59.244769

@G: I just noticed your new high score at level 953, and wanted to say (a) congrats, and (b) you KNOW you wanna break 1000 ;)

WGW - 2022-12-21 20:14:32.453160

@Slawter: I've never seen this myself-- that really sucks. Is the enemy movement also no longer glitched even with window focus? Meaning, the game is a in permanent state of running properly but super slow, with or without window focus? It may be that if I played to a high enough level (which could possibly beyond the current theoretical limit on my PC), I'd start to see the same thing. I have commented before that I think this enemy movement/game slowdown bug seems to start earlier (at lower levels) on lower end PCs, for reasons I won't bore you with. So the best suggestion I can think of (which you've probably already tried) would be to free up as much processor time and RAM as possible. IF you're running some kind of processor/RAM intensive program, it's probably making the glitch worse. I know if I try to run a video encoder while playing GTD, the glitched movement/game slowdown bug starts happening as early as level 200. If I even just pause the encoder-- not shut down the program, just pause it-- GTD goes back to normal immediately. Of course, by level 800 for me, the game is glitched even when I'm running nothing else of consequence. That's a real bummer. It will make progressing an interminable uber-slog for you if you can't get the game to ever play at normal speed. :( I hope you can figure something out. Myself, I had a run that could have gotten to level 1226, but I had to end it way earlier when I finally was able to move into my new apartment and had to disconnect the PC!!!

Slawter - 2022-12-21 19:48:07.943712

I'm at level 900 and for the last 20 levels or so clicking on the game to make it the 'active' window hasn't returned the game to full speed. It's approximately 1/10 normal speed, does anyone have a solution to this?

WGW - 2022-12-08 22:12:10.267159

@833_57: There really isn't one, unfortunately. The problem is even worse than just the pop-up info boxes no longer being in this version-- there's also key info missing from the gem description in-game, most notably that there's no mention of jades earning gold. You can't really play this game without knowing that. You can check out this wiki that a regular player set up a while back (I think it was @lement, who hasn't been around for quite a while). But bear in mind that this was a work-in-progress, and that it was actually written for the prior javascript version of GTD, so probably certain stats are going to be out of date. But it's worth checking out for newer players. https://gemtowerdefense.fandom.com/wiki/Gem_Tower_Defense_Wiki

833_57 - 2022-12-08 2:10:44.220722

whats the best info graphic for the gems details? i liked in previous version you could hover over the gems legend and the details popped up.

WGW - 2022-12-02 21:47:49.059323

@Mike: Yes, sandbox mode is now at http://45.55.255.26:10001/

Mike - 2022-12-02 21:30:06.679083

Is the sandbox mode still available?

WGW - 2022-12-02 18:50:00.723316

@Irina: Honestly, a LOT comes down to whether you get a great opal or not. I've been playing this game for over 12 years, know it inside and out, but still I lose most of my runs without a great opal by around level 150. It's POSSIBLE to go on indefinitely without getting a great opal, but it's much, much harder (and slower!) If you're losing runs WITH a great opal, then you're probably doing something less than ideal in your strategy, but losing without a great opal? That's just the game, unfortunately! At least you have a good 100 or more levels to draw a great opal before you lose, and once you get one, the game becomes pretty easy afterwards. If you're struggling even with a great opal, then the best I can offer to take a look if you post a screenshot. I've said many times-- disagreeing with plenty of people in the comments here-- that I think this is a difficult game. The people who think it's too easy either (a) got lucky for a run or two and think the game always gives you the gems you need (which it doesn't!), or (b) have already invested a huge amount of time into learning the game's mechanics and don't appreciate how hard it is for a new player to grok-- especially considering that so much critical information is not documented in the official instructions.

Irina - 2022-12-02 6:55:38.207405

Could you please make a walkthrough of getting to high levels? I'm so embarrassed to say that I've been playing for weeks and never get past 100, actually 90-something is where I usually top out. I try to take advice here of things to build and I use the gem bug advice as well so I have perfects to easier build the good stuff. Anyway, I am super jealous that I can't just figure it out lol.

WGW - 2022-11-28 22:20:59.886654

@G: Sadly, yes, of course I do. ;)

G - 2022-11-28 16:57:15.598034

@WGW: You know you wanna get those extra 10 levels lol

WGW - 2022-11-28 3:48:33.412962

Just beat my prior high score, getting to level 1216 before running out room. I don't think I can do much better than this-- though certainly getting another 10 levels shouldn't be out of the realm of possibility. It's mostly a matter of limiting how many non-paraiba towers you allow yourself to build in the first 200 levels. And, as I've said before, it's really no fun at all. Especially once the enemy movement starts to glitch out. I keep at it only because I'm "addicted", but wish I could get myself to just be satisfied with shorter runs, like to level 500 or so. That takes long enough, but getting to level 1200, for the last 400 levels it takes around 8 minutes per level for all the enemies to get killed. And all the while, you're just hoping that Windows doesn't reboot itself, or the power doesn't go out. It's torture. But I did it. . . again. Now maybe I won't ever try to do it again? Maybe? Nah.

WGW - 2022-11-28 3:41:57.628534

@Slawter: You can try asking him directly. He has a contact email address on the main page.

Slawter - 2022-11-23 15:11:56.717598

Does anyone know if there are any plans to open source the code? I'm interested in making some modifications to see if it's more fun to play.

WGW - 2022-11-21 19:07:00.724643

@Avitone: I see what you mean now. No, I've definitely never seen this happen before. Strange. I'm wondering if it might be related in some way to the rare "frozen rock" I've experienced (but no one else has reported yet.)

216 - 2022-11-20 14:52:01.329119

This bug exist since 2021 ( JS version), in flash version you could combine only on last part of special.

833_57 - 2022-11-20 13:20:56.485358

@216 thank you. This bug has eluded me for 10 years. Here's to another 10 years with this bug that has revolutionised my GTD experience! I have never been able to ask this Comments section because i never figured out how to get past the "Type gems here" box. Literally have to type "gems". I thought it was a secret gem i had to figure out...

Avitone - 2022-11-20 5:59:43.570943

Both instances happened when I was rapidly clicking to lay down gems. I would be interested to see if someone could repeat the glitch.

Avitone - 2022-11-20 5:57:28.695712

@WGW, if you look closely you can see a normal gem behind the flawless. Here is a screen shot a few levels before that with a perfect behind a normal and it would not let me select the perfect :( https://imgur.com/a/aM2HS9A Thanks, I'm still working on my layout.

WGW - 2022-11-20 3:43:34.335930

@Avitone, could you explain more what I should be seeing in the screenshot? It looks like you have only four gems placed, with the "repick" button available, so does "stacked gems" means you were allowed to put one of your five gems on top of an existing gem? Or on top of one of the other four gems you picked for the turn? I think that's what you're saying, and no, I certainly have never seen this happen, but then, I probably nearly never would even accidentally end up putting one of the five gems on top of an existing gem. . . so I'd never have had much opportunity to see it happen. I'm very curious to hear more about this, new to me. Great run, by the way-- you're almost at level 500 without having ever gotten a great opal! Without a great opal, I lose most of my runs by level 150 or so. Well done.

Avitone - 2022-11-19 21:52:10.519837

https://imgur.com/a/YFUjPzc Anyone else getting stacked gems? Its happened twice in one game?

scgmeister - 2022-11-19 16:53:48.793581

step1: build a perfect gem making sure there are no other gems on the board that would be required for that recipe you're going for. step2: build the other gems required for that recipe step 3: build one additional gem required for the recipe at the location where you want to build the special gem step 4: use combine special on the additional gem you just built resulting in having the special gem at a location where you want it while preserving the perfect gem that you tuilt first.

Avitone - 2022-11-19 15:24:41.683940

I'm having an issue with ingredient gems stacking on top of one another. Is anyone else experiencing this?

216 - 2022-11-19 13:29:11.488637

Need to combine on duplicate of (no-perferct ofc) part of special. Need to have 2+ same gems, but combining on earliest of them does NOT cause bug.

833_57 - 2022-11-19 10:23:56.275755

Is the combined special bug still working? I don't understand the process to get it. I kget the FIRST must be Perfect gem, but when combining the special, which gem do i choose to combine the special?

Avitone - 2022-11-19 6:20:44.649659

What is the best browser for playing Gem Tower Defense?

scgmeister - 2022-11-18 16:17:28.936756

Alright, I've got another stable run going, but now with my pc wanting me to restart to install an update, again it'll be a bit of a race against time if I want to try to take this run as far as it'll go. https://imgur.com/JGhj341

WGW - 2022-11-16 20:43:30.105304

That's a bummer, scgmeister! Myself, after more than a month of playing run after run and not getting a great opal, I finally got one this run-- which could theoretically go higher than my previous high score-- but there's some sort of weird Windows glitch happening that's not worth describing and probably will only fix itself when I reboot. . . which will mean sacrificing a run at level 803 already. So I'm just going to try to put up with it till I finish the run-- which means things are scrolling on their own without any mouse or keyboard input. It's pretty annoying. But not as annoying as playing GTD for a month+ without getting a great opal.

scgmeister - 2022-11-13 11:56:38.727716

I ended up losing all progress on that game at around level 330 as I had to updage my graphics card to fix some issue with it which resulted in my losing all progress :( My most recent run ended at 152.

s - 2022-11-08 22:44:00.610535

@ scgmeinster even though i can not see the mae you are talking about but this is not your falt anyways i hope you continue 'maze tests?' i hope that you reach you goal whatever that might be.

scgmeister - 2022-11-06 7:28:36.458676

It's been a while since I've messed around with this game but I'm back for now, and I suppose I may as well post my newest maze which is looking to be really strong. This current maze was showing really strong for the first 75 levels, then made even stronger when I happened to pull a great opal on level 92. Anyway, right now I just survived passed 152 without too much difficulty after managing to not leak any enemies on level 150 (one almost got through but died right before leaving the range of most of my towers towards the exit) Not sure if I'll try to optimize this maze yet for late game to see how far I can push it though. https://imgur.com/0EIQTza

WGW - 2022-11-04 2:13:04.470590

@fluff: Good luck! I haven't gotten a great opal for about a month now, though to be fair I'm not playing nearly as many as hours as I used to. I find runs without great opals pretty frustrating to play, usually on the brink of losing until well over level 200, and only by building an ungodly number of jades (more than 20).

fluff - 2022-11-02 21:04:46.843538

@WGW: Thanks as always for the input! I do recall great aqua being useful, and it makes enough sense that topaz would as well. It seems to me that at any level of basic gem, these are the strongest types. Unrelated, I'm in a pretty good run (for me) right now. I accidentally broke a part of my maze right before level 50, but they still all died, and it wasn't even that close! This might be the best early game I've had. Now, if I can get a GO, it will be a *really* good run.

WGW - 2022-10-29 2:32:38.238624

@fluff: Just my take, but if I were NOT worrying about maximizing space, I'd happily build any great gem early in the game. The least useful, imo, longer term are: - great sapphires (huge range but very weak attack power, and their slowdown effect for enemy movement becomes completely irrelevant by level 40) - great diamonds (because they don't attack air enemies) - great amethysts (because they ONLY attack air enemies, and become pretty ineffective by, say level 100) - great rubies (low damage, and splash damage doesn't seem to do anything especially useful) - great emeralds (low damage, and poison damage becomes totally useless pretty quickly) Any great gem, built early enough, is going to rack up enough kills to remain useful long term. But beyond level 100 or so, and if not worrying about preserving space, I'd only build great aquamarines, topazes, and opals (you don't really need more than one great opal, but you also can't completely cover the whole board with just one, so I'm happy to build two-- but no more than two. They're no good for damage, just for the cooldown buff.) Just my take-- @216 would likely differ on some of these points!

fluff - 2022-10-27 20:24:59.741132

Haven't posted here in a while, but have been more or less playing during that time. I'm curious whether any other great gems are worth building at least for killing the creeps; though of course they're not best for space maximization.

will geralds - 2022-10-25 21:25:44.888488

i tapped at 605: https://imgur.com/a/UgPZlgW @WGW: very well played. it's much more difficult than it first seems. and that's probably why i keep coming back to it. thank you both for all your help / guidance / wisdom.

WGW - 2022-10-25 20:30:12.940156

@will geralds: I really appreciate the note of appreciation for the challenge involved in getting past level 1000-- I've said a bunch of times, there's more involved than just being patient enough (and nutty enough) to play out a run for 100 hours. You have to be planning for maximizing space from the very start of the game, and you have to be able to build basically nothing but paraibas for hundreds and hundreds of levels. It's harder than it may seem to be! Good job getting to level 600!

will geralds - 2022-10-25 15:46:28.267602

@216 thanks for the info. yet another twist for this game! i've opened up my map to allow some to get through and dwindle my life count. ill end it on purpose around 600. i have even more respect for the folks who get to the 1000 level given that new wrinkle. thank you for your guidance again.

216 - 2022-10-25 11:04:06.666901

no, unfortunatelly you have to lose to sumbit score :( Need to optimize space to get extreme high lvls. Your maze is very long, which allow to have less gems. Also, keep in mind that buiding paraibas slower fill map ( 4 turns instead 3 per gem)

will geralds - 2022-10-25 0:10:18.971286

update: https://imgur.com/a/O5GgUdS I'm going to run out of places to put a gem around turn around 640-650ish...does the game let you keep playing or does it end since you can't place a gem any longer?

will geralds - 2022-10-23 16:28:45.296218

level 366 and going with 50 million gems. anyone know what happens if you can't put a gem anywhere?

216 - 2022-10-21 19:44:13.998332

stun immunity is strange, but intentional, every 50 lvls.

will geralds - 2022-10-21 14:49:34.486401

anyone know why on levels 100 and 200 (and assuming 300, 400, 500, etc) you can't stun the flyers? is that a bug or intentional

will geralds - 2022-10-20 20:28:53.152250

@wgw & @216 - i got my first ever great opal and am having the best game of my life thanks to y'alls advice. thank you my internet friends. https://imgur.com/a/1gygY84

WGW - 2022-10-20 3:18:57.470348

@will geralds: For what it's worth, I think your screenshot shows a pretty strong layout. A few things-- none deal breakers-- that I would change personally are: (1) I don't ever build pink diamonds, since they do no damage to air enemies, and ground enemies are completely handle-able without them. They're a waste of a space/turns, imo. (2) I wouldn't have built a great emerald. They just don't do enough damage. Really, for myself, I only build great opals (which are key), and rarely ever build great gems of any other type. This is particularly important if you're trying to maximize your number of turns (which is a complete pain-in-the-ass strategy that's only for those at least as insane as i am who are willing to play completely dull GTD runs for 2 solid weeks just to be able to stretch the max level to its limit before running out of room). But I think you can get past level 1000 without paying all that much attention to maximizing turns/space-- assuming, of course, that you pick a great opal. It's still possible to get well past 1000 without a great opal, but a good deal more luck is required in how air enemies get stunlocked, and it will take considerably longer to get there. A great opal really is the single most important tower to build in this game.

WGW - 2022-10-20 3:08:36.853937

@G: So great to see you're still around occasionally playing GTD. You used to use a lowercase "g", so I wasn't sure it was the same person. :)

will geralds - 2022-10-20 0:42:13.016873

@WGW - i'd noticed the gold number flashing but my brain never put the two together that i was getting more gold haha. great guidance and now i've gotten to 100+ on games worth pursuing. i'd love to see your / anyone's pathway on how the heck you get to 1000+. here is my current thought process on pathing - https://imgur.com/a/MF3hQKn . would love feedback if willing to take a look.

G - 2022-10-19 16:45:32.234733

@WGW: Still the same old G

WGW - 2022-10-19 6:27:51.739116

@G: Are you Satan? ;) More relevantly, are you the same @G that used to post comments here years ago? @will geralds: Indeed, knowing that upgraded Jades earn gold is absolutely VITAL info, and it's really awful that the description no longer mentions it. I've "complained" about this a bunch of times in the comments here. I don't know how a brand new player, who never played the prior Flash-based version of GTD, would ever figure this out, aside from reading lots and lots of comments till you get to one (probably from me) that mentions it.

G - 2022-10-18 20:59:18.782119

After a very long run of games with no Great Opal, I finally got one at level 35 or so. This resulted in a new personal high score for me (ended intentionally at level 666 because I got bored).

will geralds - 2022-10-17 20:08:40.496085

was in a game, level 50 or so, when saw the jade. started building jades and got to level 88. first game changer. thank you!

will geralds - 2022-10-17 17:35:34.940708

holy moly - i avoided because of low damage. that's a game changer!!!! thank you!

216 - 2022-10-17 12:41:07.243098

fully upgraded jades have 5% (was 1% in flash version) per hit to gain 5 + game lvl/2 gold. Its missing in descryption.

will geralds - 2022-10-17 6:18:19.003790

i think i just learned something....jades give more gold??? on kill or damage?

216 - 2022-10-15 10:41:19.324428

Easiest way - build many jades(gold gain) and buy more lives. Harder way - make more (propertly placed!) stunners and try to kill air(still few jades needed). But without a Great Opal hard to kill more than 5 air around lvl 80

will geralds - 2022-10-15 4:43:48.047088

hi there - i played this game in college around 2010, and am back playing 10 years later. tops so far is around level 80. im struggling with the flying creatures. any suggestions?

s - 2022-10-12 2:10:53.673354

I also agree with fluff and wgw this game dose show you how to be patient with other players or with runs and i hope you get a house you like wgw , and i will probably be going away from this game proably for many years , but i do hope you all get what you want in your lives.

Jonathan A - 2022-10-09 13:51:03.802379

216 Ohhh, Ok. I had understood from WGW was supposed to combine on the latest placed gem. Well now it makes sense. THanks.

216 - 2022-10-08 16:27:14.413828

Because you combined on 1st fD. You had to combine on 2nd FA in this case to save PAs (only way to consume 2x gem is combine on it)

Jonathan A - 2022-10-08 16:01:03.348480

Sorry for brining up this again... lol I built the following in order: PA PA FA FA fD Combine on fD. Expected 1st PA to remain. It didn't. I thought the rule was, if you combine on the last placed one, the first one will remain?

WGW - 2022-10-07 4:57:40.067965

* "along these longs" s/b "along these LINES". Sigh.

WGW - 2022-10-07 4:56:33.921937

I agree 100%, too, but have very consciously avoided making any comments along these longs because I could go on and on about it and probably would. But I will say, if nothing else-- and there's plenty else-- playing this game has "taught" me, it's PATIENCE. . . ;) I've made my cross country move but am not yet settled into a new place. But in the meantime, within a day of having my PC hooked up with internet access, I was already back at yet another GTD run. . .

John 21 - 2022-10-06 15:38:41.368714

Thanks fluff. I agree, life is a lot of luck(or RNG), but a lot of it is wisdom and the gunmption to keep on keeping on.

fluff - 2022-10-05 19:04:05.846337

I'm going to get a little deep for a moment here... I think this game has a positive effect on my approach toward life. I'm serious. Most GTD games I start are not going to go well, and I know that before I start them. Nonetheless, I persist. The practice of trying again and again despite steep difficulty I think builds a lot of persistence.

fluff - 2022-10-04 20:03:54.265600

Johathn A "126 Thanks man! Glad to know." Seconded, and good to know about Perfect Ruby. Super weird.

Jonathn A - 2022-10-01 16:34:45.706444

126 Thanks man! Glad to know. Btw there seems to be a bug where Perfect Ruby doesn't seem to be doing splash damage (got it somewhere below wave 10 so I can clearly notice).

216 - 2022-10-01 2:13:29.765365

After, so 1st EG hit deal less dmg.

Jonathan A - 2022-09-25 20:43:28.313010

Does Gold armor debuff happen before or after the damage of its attack?

s - 2022-09-13 2:49:03.436896

@ i hope where ever you go you are happie with that descision and i may be helping with making the things that you see in paraides before the fall festivle that i will have to wait to see ,and i hope everone has a good week and great runs and i know this is not important to the game and i strongly agree with wgw on how the black opalis the most important tower.

WGW - 2022-09-12 14:15:15.575377

@fluff: Your text description of opal effect is clearer than the documentation. Great Opal is is still the single most-important tower to build. I'm in the process of moving so I won't be posting any more new scores any time soon!

s - 2022-09-09 21:51:07.757266

yes perfect opal is beater then black opal for speed reduction but you also have to consider perect opals chance on geting it before wave 50 cause not everyone can go beyond that number for levels so it is not foolish it is more like a tempeary fix to a never ending problem, and i know the game is not never ending .

fluff - 2022-09-09 16:04:21.780353

It occurs to me that "increases...speeds by X%" is actually not correct. "Decreases cooldown by X%" would be correct, but for example, normal opal's description mentions 20%. For many gem types, cooldown is 1000, and it decreases cooldown to 800. This means it takes 4/5 of the time it used to take, and that the *speed* is 5/4 faster. That's an increase of 25%, not 20%. Similarly, perfect opal actually increases speeds by about 54%, and great opal doubles attack speeds (100% increase). This means that if someone is comparing, say black opal's benefit to perfect opal, even not accounting for non-damage benefits of increasing speed, perfect opal is *by far* the better of the two. (I'm not saying they shouldn't be combined, but I do remember a long while ago thinking that I should go for black opal first because it's percentage was higher. How foolish!)

fluff - 2022-09-07 14:09:23.193506

Okay, thanks! That's very clear.

216 - 2022-09-06 19:42:02.456834

@fluff: Yes, selecting anytihng which is not B1, C1, (D1 if paraiba) saves A1

fluff - 2022-09-06 19:19:17.415570

@WGW Congrats! TBH I've found it hard to find games that fill the same role that are as good as this one. I'm not saying it's the greatest game, but it is the best game that feels like itself... @216, so selecting B2 on A B1 B2 C D will consume B1, B2, C, and D, and consuming C2 on A B C1 D C2 would also work?

s - 2022-09-03 15:22:27.490366

@ wgw i think i know what you are saying but i usually finish most of my mazes before wave 30 but i can only get to wave 50 at this curent moment so my information is probably usless and i try to see where my enimie ground units move around my maze to see if there are any holes or acidently blocked ends, and i remove five at a time so the hole becomes more noticable and the way i found to recover is by having a lot of fully upgraded lucky asain jems.

WGW - 2022-09-03 8:10:03.341069

Well, I can die a happy man now. I finally got past level 1200, and the high score text is NOT BLANK! Truly, evidence of a life already well-lived. The last 50 levels were so unbearably slow, it was just torture. Very, very boring, very, very slow torture. I actually had space to go another 15 levels or so, but I just couldn't take it anymore. Who's ever going to beat this score, anyway? Who else is obsessive enough to (a) figure out how to do it AND (b) get good enough RNG to enable playing to this high a level AND (c) has endless time on his hands to fritter away on incredibly tedious hundred-hour-long GTD runs? I think this score will be safe at the top for a while. ;) I expect I'll keep playing if only because, well, I seem to have lost any ability I might have once had to STOP. But I really doubt I'm ever going to play a run this long again, not unless someone out there actually does beat me I need to reclaim my position! I'll probably just play runs up to the point that the enemy movement starts glitching out, which makes the levels take forever (around level 800 or so for me). I won't have to play the "maximize space and build nothing but paraibas for 900 levels" strategy which is necessary to get past level 1200. It would make the early game a LOT less frustrating for me, and the later levels a LITTLE less boring. Or maybe I could just find some other game to play for a change. . .

WGW - 2022-09-03 7:31:13.175012

@fluff, I can't tell you how many runs I've lost (and still do) because of leaving an inadvertent hole in my maze. I always change the layout of the maze around level 30, which requires removing two rocks and then placing two new ones in other spots to plug holes and turn the path into a 7-pass maze. I remove the two rocks, then on the next level sometimes forget that I need to plug the holes elsewhere, and then watch in horror as an otherwise good start falls apart, leaking all 10 ground enemies in a level. You really can't recover most of the time if you leak ground enemies at any point except on the "no stun" levels. It's better to just end the run-- the times I've tried to play out runs where I made this kind of mistake, I always end up losing by level 100, highest. The Flash version of GTD was actually more forgiving on this, to the extent that I used to purposely leak ground enemy for the last 50 or so levels just to speed up the late game levels.

216 - 2022-09-03 0:40:08.731598

aoe range for some gems: silver - 36 BS - 57 (S)YS - 57 PR - 30 combine bug on paraiba - basicly same as other gems, using your example A B1 B2 C D - combining on B2 (or D3, B5, anything 2+ as well ) saves A ( using B1 + C1 + D1 + selected). Combining on something 1 always use A1+B1+C1 (+D1 on paraiba). Combining on someinthg 2+ never use A1

fluff - 2022-09-02 19:44:13.351944

A couple of questions. Do we know how big the "splash zone" is for splash damage? Also, I know with most gems the combine bug works by choosing to combine on B2 in the sequence A, B1, B2, C, but how does it work for Paraibas? Big thank you! I'm pretty sad about ending my best run yet by accidentally placing my final repick gem in the wrong place and invalidating my entire maze. I didn't immediately lose, but I did on the very next level despite fixing the problem.

bitter6290 - 2022-09-02 13:28:23.775518

This game reminds me a lot of a game, Alchemist TD, that I played about 10 years ago online. Sadly, that game seems to be dead. Does anyone have any information about it?

s - 2022-08-31 21:22:21.310494

james i know what you are talking about and i found that it dose slow the enimies down and it hapens before wave 30 but it is not very noticable at first.

JamesCB - 2022-08-31 18:25:21.907936

@216, that makes sense, thank you!

216 - 2022-08-31 17:08:21.605630

Uranium slows enemies well, but there is minimum speed issue, causing that actual min. speed is VERY close to max speed around lvl 30+

JamesCB - 2022-08-31 14:44:19.558459

Anybody ever have Uranium238 just stop slowing enemies down?

s - 2022-08-27 23:10:58.473274

good thing i did not tell you the one way i would know how to overide the power faliur because in thunderstorms it would be much worse if it got struck by lighting now if it was the power facility itself then i kinda would be able to help but it is not so owell but a backup battery is effective enough and by the way some of my comments that i have been trying to send ends up getting deleated even the ones i sent a prior date, # fluff i completly understand about this game being not enough entertaning for you but with practice most of the time come succes but to continue a path is your choice to make .

WGW - 2022-08-26 22:30:16.552144

@fluff: To be clear, I absolutely-- I swear-- did NOT buy a backup battery to be able to play GTD. :) I bought it almost two years ago because the power goes out so often here, for hours or sometimes even days. And of course, because the universe works in perverse ways, there hasn't been a major power failure here since I spent over a grand on the backup battery. Of COURSE. But we do have micro-outages all the time, and in fact, there were just two brief outages in the past HOUR due to-- gasp!-- a thunderstorm. I can't even guess how many long GTD runs I've lost due to a 20 second power outage. So. . . since I had the backup battery anyway, I figured I may as well use it for SOMETHING! I'm very clearly far too obsessed with the meaningless goal of posting a score above level 1200. But even I am not nearly crazy enough to spend a thousand+ bucks for a backup battery just to save long GTD runs. But if you've got one, might as well use it! :)

fluff - 2022-08-26 17:06:27.579878

@216 I see, I think. I just tried a run with multiple blood stones, and found that they were excellent at making sure I kill all ground units, but were crap at killing air units. I leaked way too many. Then again I'm getting more and more certain I'm not very good at this game, maybe just not wanting to put forth the effort to get my attention to detail up to the necessary level. I follow at lot of the advice I've seen in comments at a basic level, but nothing really seems to work.

216 - 2022-08-26 16:27:31.135245

Reason why BS is op is more simple: its only gem that combine multi-target with aoe. That armor thing works better for 1-taget aoe

fluff - 2022-08-26 16:01:19.658636

"I have the PC plugged in to a backup battery (so brief power failures won't be an issue)" Intense. "...so if target enemy have reduced armor, others (nearby) take more dmg too." I guess that's why the unupgraded blood stone is so good against ground. Thanks for the insight!

WGW - 2022-08-26 2:25:29.399379

@216: Your comments based on analyzing the actual game code are so invaluable-- I suppose with enough effort I'd be able to decipher the game code enough to figure some of this stuff out, because all programming languages share certain characteristics, but since I don't know javascript specifically, it would really be a uphill climb for me. Especially if the code heavily utilizes object-oriented programming, which I never learned how to do! I'm currently on level 560 of the latest attempt to get past level 1200-- and I really think this will be the one to finally get there. I have the PC plugged in to a backup battery (so brief power failures won't be an issue), and enough margin of error in case I get up to FOUR frozen rocks. Just a matter of playing it out, which will take several more days, and then seeing whether my high score ends up posting with blank text again. . . I have no idea what text I want to use for the new top score in event. Well, I'll have several days to think it over. :)

216 - 2022-08-26 1:09:00.097457

If i understand code well, all enemies take same dmg from splash, so if target enemy have reduced armor, others (nearby) take more dmg too.

s - 2022-08-26 1:02:48.686860

i have a guess but i am not that good at the game i think the more armor a enimie has the more max health it has so i think the spals damage just gose through the armor or is reduced?

fluff - 2022-08-25 16:34:59.071774

@Mikis Nah. Does anyone know how splash damage and armor interact?

s - 2022-08-25 1:23:50.240951

any ways @ mikis you need gold if you want to make a maze look for scgmeinster on youtube cause i forgot where the Lincke was and you do need to gold farm for the increasing cost of lives and repicks ,and for the rest of the commit i don�t think it should change i enjoy the game mostly as is just without the bugs would be good enoughf for me.

s - 2022-08-25 0:52:28.040338

is any one having commit problems or is it just me that the commits keep on deleating them selves for no reason

Mikis - 2022-08-23 9:01:59.497216

@WGW: As much as I respect people who have the patience to go to level 1000 and beyond (myself, I never went over 600 or 700, I think), I wish that the game got back to its roots, which was figuring out new mazes and combos of special gems. That's why I think there should be some kind of a nerfing update - maybe a limit on the number of repicking gems per round? Or turning off the gold farming? I think more people would enjoy the game if the runs were shorter

WGW - 2022-08-22 22:11:02.813798

@Mikis: I see, that makes sense. Yeah, the game doesn't crash anymore but it still gets ungodly slow in late levels, with either the enemy movement being glitched, or the game slowed to 1/10 its normal speed, depending on whether the game window has the active focus or not. I think this is due to the same memory leak problem that was causing the full-on crashes, but that's just an educated guess. The game still leaks a ton of memory in late levels, but it's more contained-- it was using 4GB of RAM in the prior version by level 400 or so; now it's using around 2.5GB of RAM by the end of my ultra long runs to level 1000 or higher. So it's a lot better now, but the game is still very clearly using far more RAM than should ever remotely be necessary for this type of game. This isn't a 1080p/120dps first person shooter game. ;) I just screwed up my latest attempt to get past level 1200. At least this time it was my fault rather than due to a power failure!

Mikis - 2022-08-22 6:54:08.070487

@WGW, no, I haven't since I got back, but I took the break like 6 months ago or maybe more and wasn't aware they fixed it

WGW - 2022-08-18 16:43:44.104574

@Mikis: The game hasn't crashed at high levels since the last update, many months ago. . . It SLOWS DOWN at high levels, but doesn't crash (how else would there be scores above level 1000?) Are you experiencing actual game crashes?

Mikis - 2022-08-18 6:58:58.350549

thought I was done with this game because of all the bugs and the lack of balance, but here I am again. Strangely addictive. I still wish there was another nerfing update, though, making all the gems somehow usable and making the game more challenging on mid levels, so that the game wouldn't end with crashes at high levels.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-17 3:47:57.115359

Nice... thanks for sharing. Interesting. Impressive. I did similar to that but maybe not close enough...

216 - 2022-08-16 21:28:57.257283

891 time without any paraiba, BS in 25: https://imgur.com/NgLDLec Important is to upgrade malachite at lvl 9

Jonathan A - 2022-08-15 3:36:32.111541

216 Totally. That's my strat too. Needs a lot of luck to get the perfect run. + well placed paraiba. as much BS as possible.

216 - 2022-08-14 20:15:39.917339

I getting near 900, need short maze near c1, strong malachite and enough early BS. Uranium helps as well.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-14 20:04:57.746625

Ok I give up, 1045 seconds that's the best I can do.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-13 20:25:36.440285

Thanks 216 for explaining

216 - 2022-08-13 20:02:27.136216

Wawes 41-50 on no-servival difficulty have no minimum speed (idk why). In flash, game was ending at 41, but 42-50 was in code.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-13 15:34:49.403890

Trying to do speedruns now (Extreme). I see the current winners are 800 something. My goal is currently to go below 1000. Btw, it seemed the creeps were not affected much by uranium, but then around level 40 they started getting slowed significantly. Is this a bug?

s - 2022-08-12 2:47:39.523605

it ose not work for me offline because my chrome book needs inernet to run most of the websites so i am preety sure the answer would be a no for me. and i am not familliar to a abriviation for fd but that is just me.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-10 21:10:05.752189

Promising run (and proof that fD does work) Level 6 fD lol + lvl 2 fD https://ibb.co/dgxTC2s

Jonathan A - 2022-08-10 20:26:30.526265

Aqua is quite reliable at scoring kills. Btw, is it possible to play this offline? I saved the whole page, but the game doesn't seem to load. Here is some of the console output: Error: TypeError: NetworkError when attempting to fetch resource. fetch file:///home/jonathan/Downloads/Gem Tower Defense.html:1 sendRequest file:///home/jonathan/Downloads/Gem Tower Defense_files/game.js:992 sendInitialData file:///home/jonathan/Downloads/Gem Tower Defense_files/game.js:992

s - 2022-08-10 20:22:45.800115

@wgw i agree with your theroy on having multipal stunn yowers and the blood stone, to any player it would be a good stratgy , but the stun ability seems to me be very less helpful then regular game that is my opinion but it might work if you do it exactly as scgmeinster but if you do it different you can forget about the stun effect and you need 5-6 lucky asains to be on the safe side

fluff - 2022-08-10 17:58:42.864307

I did used to play starting with either a flawed topaz or flawed aqua, but it's more fun to play with a malachite.

216 - 2022-08-10 2:05:02.281652

Analized combine logic in (sanbox) code again, looks like there is no logic bug; there is non-sense comparision in function replaceMatchingTowerType. This means bug is easy to fix (almost like 4-combine bug) Now combine behaviour is even more clear for me: Whenever you combine special on no-earliest (currently existing) gem of its type (if you have more than 1), the selected gem is used instead earliest part of this special ingoring type (in case of EG its eariest fD *OR* FA *OR* PA) The fuction was supposed to replce with same gem, ofc. By default game uses eariest of each part to special, but you are allowed to combine on any gem of correct types. This fuction had one job: chance index of default chosen (that eariest) tower to selected, *identical* one in 3-part list (4 if paraiba) if you combine on 1st gem of any specyfic type, bug wont occur. if eariest part of special is same type as selected gem, bug *accidentally* wont occur

Jonathan A - 2022-08-09 22:37:31.737162

@WGW: Right, I'll just try to do that from now on. I never attempted to take advantage of the bug until now. I was just mad things got consumed in a way that I didn't intend :P

WGW - 2022-08-09 20:58:29.040922

@Jonathan A: You need to place the perfect gem FIRST. It doesn't matter how many you build later-- if you want to exploit the combine special bug, the FIRST gem of any recipe has to be the perfect gem. What's wrong with the game code logic I can't say-- it's too complicated to even try to explain, but I can't come up with any model for the logic that governs what gems are consumed, EXCEPT to say (explained a number of times already) that the FIRST gem of any tower has to be the PERFECT gem in order to do a combine special and not consume the perfect. Any gem that's not the perfect gem in any recipe, you'll have to clear them off the board entirely via combine specials until the ONLY gem for any given recipe is the perfect gem, before the bug will work the way you want it to (preserving the perfect gem).

WGW - 2022-08-09 20:53:58.956329

@216: I keep forgetting to mention, I was not aware not the coding for gem type extra damage was so off, mostly because this has such a minimal effect on strategy that I stopped paying attention to it in 2011! :) But it's definitely a bug I wasn't aware of, which I will add to the bug list. I thought I had all the bugs that had been discovered in the list as of a couple of weeks ago, but you ended up leaving comments identifying at least two more since then. :) So I'm glad I hadn't sent it to Peter yet. Also wanted to mention that now that I'm playing a LOT less rigidly in early levels than I used to, I see now that a second malachite IS pretty much unnecessary, as you've said before. A second malachite can save runs early on that would collapse completely otherwise, but only in runs where you're getting truly TERRIBLE gem picks. And it's so early game that you'd know whether you got the worst kind of RNG picks, you might as well just restart. I've made building a second malachite a near REQUIREMENT, so of course if you predetermine that there will be a second malachite in every run you ever play, then every successful run will have two malachites. But that doesn't mean two malachites are necessary. Amazing that I'm seeing now (via other people's comments) ways of playing that I never really even TRIED after about 12 years of playing this game non stop. I think it's a testament to how much deeper this game is than it might appear superficially.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-09 20:47:18.044975

This is confusing... built in order: 2 flawed diamond 4 perfect amethyst 1 flawless amethyst combine on one of the flawed diamonds. both flawed diamonds get consumed and the flawless amethyst, none of the perfect amethysts. Earlier: built in order 1 aquamarine, 1 flawless diamond, 3 perfect opal, combine on the last perfect opal, two of the perfect opals get consumed. Can't seem to find a pattern.

WGW - 2022-08-09 20:36:15.110301

I agree with you, @SCGmeister, as does @216. Build at LEAST one bloodstone near the center as early as possible, and leave it unupgraded until you have plenty of stun power. I usually don't upgrade bloodstones until at least after level 100, though I have had runs where for one reason or another (e.g., already having managed to build a lot of stun power earlier than usual), I upgraded them as early as in the 70s levels. Part of the game, for me at least, is observing how the kills are happening and where your weaknesses are. But as a general principle, I think it's kinda beyond debate that unupgraded bloodstones are hugely powerful early game, and you need a lot of stun power (or some other very good reason) to upgrade them before at least 100. @SCGmeister, I also wanted to add that I'm thinking a lot about whether I can incorporate your strategies to do a lot better on level 150 than I generally do; the only problem is my needing to be very stingy about building towers other than paraibas. But I remember a time, not too long ago (cue blurry effect for flashback), before I became Captain Ahab-esque obsessed with the completely pointless goal of getting past level 1200 and felt free to build whatever towers would be helpful. . . ah, to be back in those days, those more innocent times. Instead of ever even really trying to find a way to get past level 150 without lots of leaks, I just built Jade after Jade after Jade. Switching that up to building bloodstone after bloodstone after bloodstone might be a novelty. ;)

SCGmeister - 2022-08-09 4:41:58.903285

unupgraded bloodstones, if placed correctly (the more of the 7 pass section of your maze that is within reach of of the unupgraded bloodstones, the better) will be a big help in getting past level 150 with minimal to possibly no leaks. I recommend upgrading them right after that as upgraded bloodstones do help to lessen how many flyers get leaked late game when paired well with EEs and EGs. However, if you happen to place a bloodstone around the edge of the maze (not as much coverage), then it might be better to upgrade it right away.

s - 2022-08-09 2:56:07.580855

i upgrade as soon as posiable unless there is something bter to upgrade that is more important to my run like black opal, etc.

216 - 2022-08-08 21:49:42.805639

Depends of position and kill amount, some i remain even unupgraded, rest around 100-150.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-08 20:38:18.515054

At what wave is it recommended to upgrade bloodstone?

Jonathan A - 2022-08-08 18:24:20.488146

I'm glad to hear that, @WGW.

WGW - 2022-08-08 10:09:57.433481

Well, @Jonathan A has me completely rethinking the way I've been playing this game for, well, forever. I'm trying all sorts of crazy things that I'd never even considered before, all of which stem from considering NOT taking the first malachite (or even the silver). I just lost my last run at level 76 (and of course, because it's a low scoring game, the page recorded and displays the text I entered just fine THIS TIME), "WGW Tried starting with a Jade. I don't recommend it." Actually, if I could develop some more patience for restarting the first 5-10 levels, I think it's entirely workable to not start with the first tower you're offered, and for someone like me who's looking for any way to squeeze a few more turns in so I can reach level 1200, the possibility of saving three full turns by NOT starting with a malachite never even crossed me mind before but could end up really helping me out. If I'd gotten a great opal in this last run, it would have been rock-solid, with more breathing room in terms of available space than I usually have to play with. As @216 noted, I don't think this poses a huge advantage on the whole to anyone playing GTD normally (i.e., NOT trying to get level 1200 like an obsessive lunatic). I think it makes the early game a LOT harder and still believe that just about anyone is better off starting survival mode with at least the first malachite, which should be allowed to get as many of the kills as possible. But for me? Saving me three turns in a way I never thought about before? This idea is amazing. So I just wanted thank you, @Joseph A, for opening my eyes to a different approach I probably never would thought of, to a game I've been playing the same basic way for probably 12 years now! :)

s - 2022-08-08 0:59:39.338937

in the last commit it sposed to say i recomend having 4-5 lucky jades if it was not clear

s - 2022-08-08 0:57:40.342670

@ jonathon A it seems that i was half rong about the lucky jades for most of my runs i would be correct but one of scgmenister�s strtagy it would be rong because in my experiances most to all flying units arnt affected by the maze so they go on the actual path ignoring everything in there way so for that stratigy i would recomend 4-5 and intrensing enough you can survive to wave 50 on easy mode using scgmeinster stratgy without black opal , and to the peron ho made my runs end instead of going on forever i thank you.

s - 2022-08-06 19:30:03.450080

@ jonathon A no it is not correct at least in most commit in most it only takes one extra gem but yours might of taken 3 that i can not say acurately because i am not you and i personaly think it has a chance of happening because it has only happened 3-4 times for me personally

216 - 2022-08-06 19:12:08.361458

PA MUST be placed before ANY fD/FA, so need to comsume all parts then wait for PA then use bug. FA was your 1st gem, so well

Jonathan A - 2022-08-06 15:31:14.275369

Actually... I still don't understand. Seems like it consumes the 3 most recently placed ingredients in the recipe? Is that correct? For example it seemed I placed in order: 3 flawless amethyst, 2 flawed diamond, 1 perfect amethyst. Combine on one of the fD and it consumed both fD plus the perfect.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-06 14:45:36.308688

Thanks scgmeister for explaining that bug, I think I finally understand exactly how it works now. Been anxious about avoiding making the mistake to consume 2 perfect gems by accident..

Jonathan A - 2022-08-06 14:44:10.615384

O G.... this is insane. Look at the luck I had this round so far. https://ibb.co/TcvDtRd Level 7 bloodstone

scgmeister - 2022-08-06 14:27:05.466072

Here's another way to explain the gem exploit/bug (at least for the way I know how to do it). Basically once you build one of each gem required for a combine special. wait until the next turn, then build an additional gem for that recipe (doesn't matter which one). Use that gem you just built to do the combine special on and that will cause all but the first gem that you built to be consumed instead of consuming strictly one of each gem type required for the recipe. As a result, if the first gem that you built happens to be a perfect gem then the perfect gem will remain and the others in the recipe will be consumed.

216 - 2022-08-05 23:29:59.036299

Unfortunatelly kills here dont sum form all parts (agree, sum would make more sense). I guess you meant EG instead GE(it sucks a bit, i wish all Great gems was great!). You should not complain about GAq, GA and BS also. im in lvl 141, main EG have 289 kills. But i have 21 EGs - so it dont matter as much. I will try to make even stronger EG. Starting from fD really dont seems a "serious" strategy, fD in lvl 2 give similar results without so much fails and better time sscores. But i like fact how challenging it is + with (much) luck possible to make really strong (almost sanbox-like) EG.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-05 21:15:56.310016

Damn I really want that early fD though!!!

Jonathan A - 2022-08-05 21:15:25.280962

@216: Yeah sum of all parts. Don't remember but I think I normally get it up to level 3 or 4. Even a second one gaining a decent amount of kills but I realize I shoot myself in the foot trying to maximize this shit, gotta keep in mind compromising so I can even get past the early levels lol. My dream would be nothing but EE and GE (+ 1 GO, 1 PT(?), 1 RC, 2-3 Jade, 1 BO), but you almost never roll lucky enough to not get some other stuff so I might just settle with whatever I get..

216 - 2022-08-05 20:23:49.651882

Uranium is quite strong early, i often make 1, but if i dont get any part early, ussualy skip this gem. I accpet 1- turn uraniums. How many kills you can get on fD? I was doing playing quite similar - sometimes was putting gem not in mid, but main problem is fact that fA is almost must have to past lvl 4 and lvl 8 requies few lucky gems. jade parts and NA definitelly helps, but very rarely you can make jade at lvl 8. What you mean by transfer? sum from all parts?

Jonathan A - 2022-08-05 20:02:46.576089

Kills should transfer on combine though right? I think that's how it worked in Wc3.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-05 18:59:00.483801

I realize the fD strat is kind of annoying, I guess I just got lucky a few times. I do find it viable going without malachite/silver/star ruby, but going with specifically fD makes it quite hard.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-05 18:20:10.841318

Is uranium worth getting?

Jonathan A - 2022-08-05 18:12:53.782670

@WGW: I've been successful so far about 2-3 runs this way. Doesn't take much rerolling. However the tricky part is making sure to get a flawed amethyst ONLY at level 4. Other gems needed to beat previous levels. The idea is to place all gems in the middle, only mazing after a satisfactory gem has been rolled. Something like this https://ibb.co/kqhgQsj Still to experiment more with this though. That high level gold feels very rewarding to me though.

216 - 2022-08-05 14:11:33.438939

Well, defeating 196 (after getting enough skill) was MUCH less RNG based than "JAllenge" - needed mostly GO (succesed even without). I wont say there are "very big" advantages, but surely there are: - saving 1 turn - saving 1 good space - more kills* on main EG - extra 2 lvls for end-of-space * - ussually not much more than placing fD in lvl 2 in proper place, fD is too weak to collect much kills. Disadvantages: - SICK amount of reset ( if well counted 44 attempts and 1/8 chance to start so... ~400 resets?, not mentioning fails like getting fD able to make, but clicking combine special instead combine) - no malachite :) mb that the point, but dont underestimate this gem** - more wasted kills - malachite eating kills way better than fD - early EG needed or main point of stragety is gone - no PA untill ley say 30 and EG wont be any unusual strong. - much time lose, about 1000s in comparte to some malachite strats Meanwhile, that lvl 18 EG +39 kills buffed run is going UNUSSUALY well, after 40 got GA, then GO in 45. Also GT and GAq later. In lvl 44 had 2 EG, 3 BS, 4 EE( no even perfect exploit), then i spammed mostly EGs. leaks are really nice: 17 2 (due to mine stupidity) 44 2 (no GO) 48 0 52 0 56 0 60 2, https://imgur.com/a/xRYtCr7 64 3 68 1 72 4 76 2 80 1 84 1 88 2 92 2 **in compare to flash version, malachite works way better now for early lvls, since there was x0.7 on 5 colors and slower attack speed. similar DPS on pink, faster attack but no x1.5

WGW - 2022-08-05 7:38:20.463750

@216: @Jonathan A's strategy would be quite challenging in early levels. I can see, though, how if you manage to squeak by the early levels, that there are potentially very big long term advantages. As is always the case for me with any strategy that requires lots of restarts (going back to the Flash GTD days when you and a couple of others were using the emerald strat to get past level 196), I just don't have the patience for restarting over and over. I'm more likely to play out runs that are sub-ideal if I think there's a chance of making it work, than wanting to restart my way to an unusually strong opening. But that's just me-- I'm very interested in how you and @Jonathan A do with this novel strategy!

WGW - 2022-08-05 7:32:54.950671

@neqo: I don't know what to tell you, but without meaning in any to sound condescending, you're doing something wrong. :) This is a 100% replicatable bug that has been known for a long, long time, and which I absolutely rely upon when I'm playing. Again, using Egyptian Gold as an example (but it works the same way for all towers), place the gems in this order: (1) Perfect amethyst (MUST be placed before any flawless amethyst or any flawed diamond) (2) Flawless amethyst (3) Flawed diamond (4) SECOND flawless amethyst OR SECOND flawed diamond (5) Combine special on the SECOND flawless amethyst OR SECOND flawed diamond, and the perfect amethyst will not be consumed. This is a bit more specific of an order than is really necessary, but it should be clear enough for you to replicate and at least see that the bug exists and happens 100% consistently. Again, not meant to sound conscending, but I'm tellin' ya, the bug exists and exists for everyone and happens every time (if you follow certain rules about the order of placed gems.) Test it out in sandbox mode, to make it easy to pick gems in the order I described above, and I'm sure you'll see! I hope this helps!

neqo - 2022-08-05 7:17:10.006098

@WGW i did the same, i even tried in sandbox, and after the flawed gem all even the perfect disappeared. I have no idea, i understand the logic but seems not working for me?!?!

s - 2022-08-05 3:47:49.177417

in the early levels i woud sugest getting the 2 lucky jades very early so they have more effect on early upgrades for better chances and faster gem upgrades then try to get the gems for black opal and the four gem combination that is on the bottem of the combination list and either get fier stars or urainioms for the basic start

216 - 2022-08-05 2:48:13.829149

Trying to use Jonathan's strate...or more like challenge. I didnt excepted its AS hard, lvl 4 already requies quite nice RNG ( ofc leaks are absolutely unaceptable such early). Also, chance to strat run is 16/128 = 12.5%*, which makes sometimes annonying 20+ reset to start attempt. Some reports for few hours of trying: attempt #1 - fail in lvl 1 ( 1 leak) #2 - fail in 3 #3 (and many others) - fail in 4 #14 - finally succes on lvl 4, fail in 8 even with lucky FE #30 - two NA + two fA in lvl 6.. fail ofc, too few ground gems (but shame of NAs) #44 (its already 4am) - passed lvl 8, get RC and jade after, lucky PA in lvl 17( was even 3 FA) and... 2 ground leaks (let say by mine maze mistakes, could upgrade jade once also). Build EG in 18 (39 kills form fD) - encouraging to continue run, but challenge its failied. *15/64 after getting silver type gems 1/64 after malachite, in practice i reste after malachite type 1st gem.

WGW - 2022-08-04 9:50:48.548622

@neqo: the subtleties of what's amiss in the game code elude me, but as far as how to EXPLOIT the bug that I can't fully explain in detail: If you make sure that the FIRST gem of any tower recipe that you place is the perfect gem, then you can place the other (non-perfect) gems in the recipe, and do a "combine special" on the SECOND (or later) placed non-perfect gem. E.g., you have a perfect amethyst already placed; then you place a flawless amethyst and a flawed diamond (the other two components of the EG recipe). The next flawless amethyst or flawed diamond you place, you can do a "combine special" to create an EG, and it will leave behind the perfect amethyst. That's the best I can do to explain how the bug operates. Exploiting this bug is pretty key, imo, to doing well as the game currently operates.

neqo - 2022-08-04 8:55:45.600490

And now for the second dark emerald the perfect gem disappeared... How should I do it?

neqo - 2022-08-04 8:43:48.566526

Hey guys, could you please help me with the perfect gem bug? It wont work for me, only in case of dark emberald, in the other cases, it wont work. Any tips? Thanks

216 - 2022-08-04 2:23:23.515195

EG always have been doing ametyst dmg(x1.75 on pink, x0.8 on all others)! Thats why they are ussually main (lvl41+) dmg source . Towers that are able to outdamage EG: - BS/ABS - in some conditions - GA - GAq - uber I should remind here that only ametyst dmg have implemented color modifiers, rest are x1 (Peter forgot to finish dmg table) About starting from fD: its causing problems with early air lvls, isnt it? I was often placing fD in lvl 2 for kills, but i wasnt crazy enough to resign form malachite at all. If you are able to clear early air (i dont accept any leaks before 44) , you will benefit form it in late game - not "wasted" place + stronger main EG. In fact, malachite dmg is not as horrible, but single-target dmg matter way more for late air( its about stun and burst). Yes, crits form Eg = "olny" x2 - but they are really visible on air to 44. In average it means x1.3 dmg.

WGW - 2022-08-04 1:54:02.038776

Per the in-game description (which doesn't always line up with what the game code does), Golds have a 30% chance of landing a critical hit which is only TWO times the normal attack power. So it's not nothing, but critical hits from a Gold also shouldn't be hugely important.

WGW - 2022-08-03 23:00:05.654445

I'm starting another run now, because I'm an obsessive lunatic, but THIS time, the PC is plugged in to via a backup battery that I bought to deal with longer-term outages (the power goes out during winter storms for hours, sometimes days, here). Ever since I bought the backup battery, we've not had any power outages that lasted more than a couple of minutes, and I'm moving soon to a more civilized area that won't have outages all the time, so it felt like I'd wasted my money on the backup battery. But now it will serve as my GTD Run Protector. That's worth the $1,200 I spent on it, right? Sigh. Well, no more losses due to 20 second outages from now on! Now watch me never get a great opal again.

WGW - 2022-08-03 22:47:41.301122

@Jonathan A: Wow, very interesting approach. I've never heard of anyone trying survival mode without taking the first malachite or silver. If it works, it works-- I understand your logic, but I'd imagine it takes quite a few restarts (on average) to be able to build a gold early enough as enemy HP rises. I don't think Golds do amethyst-type attacks, but they DO reduce armor of both ground and air enemies, which is going to have a huge effect if you build one very early. They also have a chance of landing "critical hits", which are some multiple of the normal attack (I forget what it is and I don't have a run going now to check-- it might be 10x normal? Something like that.) So yes, Golds are hugely powerful towers and will mow down everything, ground and air troops, early on. But without area of effect towers (like an early malachite or an unupgraded bloodstone), my guess is that you'll start to fall very far behind around level 48. If you factor in the need for a bloodstone in addition to the early Gold, that would take even more restarts to get going-- but I can see how it might be very effective. I hope you keep plugging and and add comments about how this approach works. I'm fascinated. :)

Jonathan A - 2022-08-03 22:10:27.303147

@s: Makes sense. Seems my guess was somewhat accurate. @WGW: Yeah I just reroll until I get a flawed diamond! That way I can stack up kills and turn it into a gold! Silver and malachite sucks late game so I prefer selecting only gems that lead to the late game towers. Although I'm not sure how much better gold is than silver/malachite (against air). Gold does do bonus damage right due to amethyst type attacks right? Sucks you got a power failure man. I can hear your frustration.

s - 2022-08-03 22:02:59.727508

2 jades will be enough for lives that cost less than 200 , 3 jades will be beater for more costly lives .

WGW - 2022-08-03 19:50:17.126358

@Jonathan A: "no malachite or silver"-- how is this possible? In survival mode, the first turn always gives you either a silver tower or a malachite? Did you intentionally not build either? I just lost yet ANOTHER run, this one at level 930 or so, due to ANOTHER 20 second power failure. This is beyond frustrating. Way beyond.

Jonathan A - 2022-08-03 18:47:22.038309

Woaw! The game just crashed! At level 80 I think. Btw got great opal for the first time ever, just a few levels before 80. And I only had one Jade, which didn't give me enough gold to repick, and buy lives. Btw, no malachite or silver, just one bloodstone. Well I think 2 Jades could be ideal, maaybe 3.

WGW - 2022-08-02 11:57:56.195615

@216: Forgot to respond to this: "btw, im interested how system specs matter for this bug" For one thing, I start seeing the bug 300 levels later than @scgmeister reported seeing it, so the obvious (though certainly not only) explanation is that system specs are the reason. But what drove it home for me is that one time I was playing a run GTD (when am I NOT playing a run of GTD) and started doing some video encoding at the same time-- which is very processor-intensive-- and I saw the movement/game speed glitch start happening before level 200. When I paused the encoding process, the game went back to normal. So that tells me that the game is requiring a lot more processor time than it ever should be needing, if running other software that's processor intensive screws the game up even on early levels. Note that the video software doesn't use anywhere near 100% of the processor-- more like 50%-- but it still causes the game to start glitching out. It stands to reason that systems with slower processors (and possibly also in systems with less RAM) that the glitching would start many levels earlier, if I can see the game glitching out on my own system depending on whether I'm running other processor-intensive software or not.

WGW - 2022-08-02 11:45:41.579745

@216: Thanks for the additional input on the bug list-- I agree with you on everything except for removing the memory leak from the list-- it still matters a good deal even if it doesn't *crash* the game anymore, because the remaining memory leak almost certainly is the reason for the glitched enemy movement/game speed late levels-- @scgmeister experiences this bug as early as level 500. The game's slow enough at late levels without this movement/speed glitch slowing it down even further. You've chosen not to play the game out to levels high enough for the RAM leak to seem to matter, but it sure does make the game even more tedious if you do play runs over level 500, 800, or whatever level the game starts to choke based on one's system specs. (And there's also just no justifiable reason for a simple game like GTD to be eating up 2GB of RAM. It should be using a few hundred MB of RAM tops.) But I agree with all the rest of your suggestions, so thanks again! @scgmeister: If you are interested in ever trying to get past level 1200, I'm sure you can do it, maybe with some minor tweaking of your maze to maximize space (I saw a couple of very easy changes you could make that would open up a few more spaces, without really changing the shape of the maze). I'm at level 917 at the moment of a run that, again, should get me above 1200 with extra space reserved in case I get any frozen rocks (though I can only afford two frozen rocks at most, and I still have no idea at all what causes it). For the first time, I actually brute-force repicked a great opal this run. I was at level 300 without one and still leaking so many air troops that I would have needed to spend a lot more turns building non-paraibas, and knew I wouldn't be able to get a new top score run, so I figured that with 5 million gold, I might as well try to salvage the run by just repicking endlessly until I got a great opal or ran out of gold (lots of gold for repicks, but by this point, lives were already costing around 500k each). It took almost an hour of repicking, but I finally got a great opal. . . and the air enemy levels went from leaking 4-7 enemies to leaking 0 or 1, only very rarely 2. So I think this is what I'm going to do from now on, just go for broke repicking for a GO if I haven't gotten one by, say, level 300, because it's just too slow and boring without one (and I think probably near-impossible to get to level 1200 without a GO because you'll be forced to build many more non-paraiba towers just to survive.) It's boring enough WITH a GO. :)

scgmeister - 2022-08-01 4:30:15.536397

@WGW Thanks for the input of the potential for my current run. That said, as it stands right now, it's highly doubtful I will push this current run to it's max level due to me being quite busy right now. Right now, I plan to push it up to level 350, and will likely end the run soon after. Also I have a few ideas I want to try which could potentially allow me to place several more gems late game but it would be at the cost of potentially making the early-mid game substantially more challenging to survive.

s - 2022-08-01 4:04:20.043153

@ wgw we all make mistakes even if we dont mean to like i forgot to tell you on wave 50 my enimies are being affected by stun abilities but sadly i still can not prove anything, any starter combination can be good if you know how to use it to your advantage, @Jonathon A i usuall try to get a great before wave 51 cause of curent game flaws.

216 - 2022-07-31 23:14:20.521064

@Jonathan A: The ONLY reason of spam paraiba is slower filling map for pushing game limits. lvl 1000 would be impossible otherwise. Every 50 lvls is wawe with stun immunity

Jonathan A - 2022-07-31 22:20:40.640969

Phew... Just got to level 104 (and died). Tell me, is level 100 immune to stun? Seemed like it. If so that's a cool feature. It got me thinking all subsequent, at least air, levels would also be immune to stun so I was preparing for the worst, but then it wasn't the case (still died, possibly due to repicking gems 20 times in hope to get great opal, instead of buying lives). Anyway I'm glad I got to a new milestone (seems my highscore didn't get posted though). Thanks WGW for the tips. Bloodstones helped with damage early on, and then it was all about the dark emeralds and golds. I saw you guys talking about spamming paraiba. What's the motivation for it? The frost nova or simply the decent damage? It can't be the armor reduction aura right?

216 - 2022-07-31 19:57:16.033712

Yes, i mostly meant significant shortening some explainations. We can cosider removing maybe leak from list, since its minor... or better add priority to each bug. imo priority is: 1) 4-combine bug 2) speed bug 3) combine special bug 4) SYS 5) score text 6) others You can think why 4-combine is 1st - its ultra easy to fix (changing ONE digit in code) and our uber stone chances crazy depends of it ( with bug chance for legit uber is 1: 409,6 milion [per pick]). So its literaly 1st thing to fix if code is ever touched again. Movement glitch would be more important, but i know that Peter has never intended us to get lvl 1000. (btw, im interested how system specs matter for this bug) # # # # # # # # # Another atempt of explaing speed bug... bugs actually: first of all, there is DISPLAY BUG. You know every wawe, no matter how fast it move, have displayed 0.75 "speed", right? Its because Peter used WRONG VARIABLE to display, which should be invisible to players. It exists in purpose of calculating walking speed modifiers from poison/ice/stun (its multiplicative to level-specific speed). However, this strange displayed viariable is a key to understand minimum speed bug. Since its displayed, we can track this viariable during game - 50% posion slow halves this value correctly, etc. BUT the problem is: why unafected by anything enemies have 0.75? (instead 1.00) Possible to rescale speed to be identical as in flash vesion? But here are consequences: wawe 41 speed: 2.07 (invisible value, also OTHER UNITS THAN IN FLASH!) wawe 41 min.speed: 1.47 (visible value) wawe 41 ACTUAL, unslowed speed: 2.07 * 0.75 = 1.55 so 1.55 unslowed, 1.47 minimum... **RECALCULATING** to flash units (where speed/min. speed was 6.92 / 4.91): unslowed 6.92, min. 6.56 (instead 4.91) which means lvl 41+ units can be slowed by only 6%, while its CLEARLY INTENDED to allow slow by about 29% The problem is that "speed vs minimum speed" comparision (in code) is (ofc, it must be) after multipling speed by that "mysterious" viariable, while minimum speed remain untouched. Multipling minimum speed by 0.75 would allow it to works same as in flash version. Generally whole movement code is quite unclear, idk what new speed units means. but reasons of bug are clear for me. I hope someone will (read and..) understand this...

WGW - 2022-07-31 15:57:45.836747

@216: Not sure what you mean by "shorten" the bug list text-- are there things on there that shouldn't be? Note that some of the detail in the explanation is only there for the purposes of making sure that folks reading the text HERE will understand what I'm talking about. So if you're referring to "shortening" the explanations, I do fully intend to do that. I know Peter doesn't need me to explain to him how "Combine Special" works, e.g.! I would like to add your info about attacks that are/aren't affected by armor, because it's very likely none of this was intended. I think I finally understand mana now (you've tried to explain it to me before), and if so, it's truly completely pointless, isn't it? All it is, if I understand the effect correctly, is a limiter on the frequency of flame/frost attacks, without even a slight RNG element to it, it's no different in effect from "cooldown", it's just a *different* cooldown than the main attack.

WGW - 2022-07-31 15:47:11.406473

@SCGmeister: (and sorry for so many comments in a row, but this is an important self-correction!) I made a boo boo in my spreadsheet-- apparently I should have quadruple-checked, because triple-checking wasn't enough-- your max level is actually around 1161 if you stick to paraibas, which obviously means you won't get you past 1200, but you WOULD beat my top score. . . so have at it. :)

216 - 2022-07-31 15:40:48.732289

135 dps is an "estimation" of 68/0.5s ... idk why Peter didnt wrtite 136. Funny, now it even looks correct, because displaying 67-68 ( display issue). Anyway, to be clear: there is NO SEPARATE 135 DPS effect on BS, it refer to shoot dmg - which is scaling with kills lvl (and amount of nearby enemies due to mechanic!) Attacks that ingore armor: -frost nova -flame strike both of them dont scale with kills, which sucks :( Attacks that SHOULD ingore armor, but doesnt (was in flash version): -uranium dmg aura -star ruby dmg aura Mana works quite simple: ABS has 10 max mana, regen 2/s, use 5 for flamestrike. Similar for frost nova. Not upgraded paraiba regen 1.75/s as i remebmer @WGW: i would shorten a bit that mail to Peter. Some things to clarify: SYS dont have display issue, just wrong combat stats, which are displayed well :) - looks like Peter copied unpgraded SYS (YS) stats and forgot to change. Flash start was: 180-180 dmg 750 cd 121 range (imo it always have been a bit weak) i will explain speed bug again later today.

WGW - 2022-07-31 15:36:59.578932

@SCGmeister: I just checked your intended final layout in the spreadsheet per your screenshot, and with the additional spaces your final modified maze would allow, and accounting for the five spaces that need to be reserved for the final turn, if you build nothing but paraibas from here on, I believe your max level is now around 1137.

WGW - 2022-07-31 15:01:15.867002

@SCGmeister: Oh, and also, I forgot when I plugged your maze into my spreadsheet to account for the fact that you have to reserve five spaces for the final turn-- so that takes away TWENTY TURNS from the maximum possible, which would actually put your max level at 1160. You're maybe one of two or three other people who have any idea how playing for maximum turns affects how you have to play the game-- good to have some "competition". :)

WGW - 2022-07-31 14:51:58.234154

@SCGmeister: No, I confess, I did NOT take the time out to analyze the potential for modifications to your maze, mainly cause it makes my head hurt trying to visualize the possibilities for someone else's maze. :) I was just counting available moves based on the layout as it existed, assuming you would continue filling in spaces without changing it. So my apologies, I really have no idea how many moves are possible based on what you have in mind. I certainly understand that it's possible to change the layout slightly and gain a lot more spaces to place gems that would have otherwise blocked the maze. But still, based on your estimate of an additional 25 or 26 spaces, that would put you around level 1180, and that's again only if you build nothing but paraibas and refuse all single turn towers. I'm impressed regardless, and curious to see how high you can get!

WGW - 2022-07-31 14:42:57.521683

Hopefully @216 can answer your question on the "135 damage per second" thing with bloodstones-- I can't interpret the game code, but he can, and I've wondered the same thing about bloodstones forever. Same question, for me, on the flame and frost attacks-- do they scale up with tower's level? What types of attacks are unaffected by enemy armor (I only know that there are some based on prior comments from @216)? I have no idea, and no amount of observation and testing would ever be able to figure this stuff out. But one good look at the game code by someone who can read it would answer the question, though, so. . . paging @216. :) There are many details like this which I've never, in all these years, really understood (how "mana" works is still a mystery to me), but which I've found aren't really necessary to understand to play the game. E.g., I observed how powerful unupgraded bloodstones are by seeing them in action and how much of a difference they make early game-- the specifics of the stats and mechanics aren't important when you can observe at a more zoomed-out level that a tower is racking up tons of kills, for whatever reason! Likewise with mana, however the hell it works, whatever the hell it's for, I don't need to understand any of it beyond the fact that frost and fire attacks are intermittent-- which REALLY doesn't matter when the targeted enemy is completely stun-locked! Regarding the "combine special" bug, well, see my prior comment with the bug list, it's in there. :)

SCGmeister - 2022-07-31 14:29:31.180030

@WGW Thanks for the info regarding the potential of this run, however I'm curious as to whether you accounted for my plans for removing certain rocks in order to maximize my available space later in the game. https://imgur.com/MgGXxtn Removing those rocks I crossed out would give an additional 25 (possibly 26) availible spots to put gems down at the cost of shortening the total length of the maze down to 4 passes instead of 7. Also take note of the change I did in the center of the maze compared to the video I shared a few posts earlier. @s Not a glitch, it's an example of a maze I figured out which forces the enemies to pass through it 7 times, the highest possible number of passes you can do in this game. Actually, out of curiosity, I left the bloodstones unupgraded up to level 250 to see how well this maze would do against that, and it managed to leak only 2 ground troops. I have them upgraded now as the higher damage vs a single unit is a bit better at burning down more enemies in the flyer levels.

Jonathan A - 2022-07-31 14:17:49.204304

@WGW: Nice, I think I'm also starting to enjoy the discussion more than the game haha. Alright, yeah I realize now malachite would be a better choice, understanding how "op" multi target towers can be (not including topaz). Right now I'm doing a run with bloodstone and I can tell the difference. Does its damage go to multiple targets and the "135 damage per second" description is just an estimation of its damage or that's a separate effect? I was just skeptical the damage scales with level, because the "135 damage" stays the same. I've noticed a frustrating bug when you have duplicates of perfects and when you combine, two perfects gets consumed instead of one of the other ingredients. Doesn't seem to happen consistently but in some cases. Need to work on my maze as well. The one by SCGmeister is impressive. I always did something like this https://ibb.co/LJGr32K ever since Wc3. Just now I tried to pack more towers along the flight path which helped against air but at the severe expense of mazing for the ground units, didn't quite work out. I might try to work towards SGC's design, or stick to the spiral and just spam bloodstones to improve my highscore (and start out with malachite).

WGW - 2022-07-31 13:51:25.027350

Last chance to add to/correct mistakes in the bug list which I'd like to send to Peter H. (thanks again to @216 for the help!) I've made some minor changes and a few additions. I'd really appreciate any input. New draft: - Combine multiple gems When you draw more than one gem of the same type and quality, you're given the option to combine them into the next-higher-level gem of the same type. You're supposed to be able to combine and upgrade TWO levels when you draw FOUR gems of the same type and quality, but a bug in the code requires FIVE gems. (observation regarding the specific coding bug comes from @216) - Combine Special The Javascript version of GTD allows for doing a "Combine Special" to create a tower on ANY gem that's part of that tower's recipe, as long as all the required gems are placed on the board (in the Flash version, you could only do a "Combine Special" on the most-recently-placed gem in a recipe). However, in allowing for this flexibility, a bug has been introduced where the game will, under certain conditions, consume two of the same type of gem in a recipe and leave one of the required gems on the board. E.g., you place the following gems in order: Perfect amethyst, flawless amethyst, flawed diamond, then a SECOND flawless amethyst. If you do a "Combine Special" on the second amethyst, the game will consume BOTH the flawless amethysts and the flawed diamond, and leave behind the perfect amethyst. When exploited correctly, this can mean that, practically speaking, you only need to draw a single perfect gem of any type for the entire game and can create special towers off it indefinitely. - Star Yellow Sapphire When you build a SYS after having built a Black Opal, the Black Opal's 40% (max) buff gets overridden by the SYS's 5% buff. Building another Black Opal restores the 40% buff. Essentially, whichever tower is built most recently will override the buff from any previously-placed tower. The buffs from these two different towers, the Black Opal and the SYS, should either stack, or at least, the Black Opal's buff should not get erased by building a SYS. - Text documentation updates needed - There's no mention in the text description for Jades that they earn gold, a component of the game that is absolutely necessary to understand in order to learn how to play well. - There's also no mention of the new "No Stun" levels game mechanic introduced two updates ago, where every 50th level disables all stun effects. Many players, upon encountering this for the first time, assume it's due to a bug rather than an intended mechanic (as I did when it was first introduced). - @216 has pointed out that the description for the star yellow sapphire's damage stats is incorrect, with the SYS's damage being much lower than the description says. - Because the javascript version of GTD does not have pop-up text with gem/tower descriptions when you hover the mouse over the recipes (as the Flash version did), it would be extremely helpful for new players learning the game if the gem/tower descriptions were added to the bottom of the page along with the recipes, or at least added to the "Instructions" page. Otherwise, there's no way for any new player to have any idea what any tower does until they actual build them so they can read the descriptions in-game. GTD's challenging enough for new players without their being forced to play it completely blindly with no idea what any of the towers actually do. - Movement speed I defer to @216, since I don't really understand what this is about, but from his description, it has a huge affect on gameplay after level 40-- something to do with the minimum enemy speed not being correctly affected by slowing gems/towers, and I think @216 has identified what part of the game code is causing the problem in prior comments. But again, I don't really understand this specific issue myself. @216 added in a recent comment: "Minimum speed bug: due to logic bug, minimum speed works like multiplied by 1.33333333 (/0.75)" I still don't really get it, but @216 knows what he's talking about and unlike me, can actually understand the game code. - Blank high score text For some odd reason, submitted high scores sometimes end up posted with blank name text, or-- I've observed personally-- text from prior-submitted high scores (and not due to autocomplete filling in the field, I can vouch). There doesn't seem to be any identifiable pattern to this, but @scgmeister has suggested it might have something to do with the browser's "process ID". - No "R" keystrokes in high score text boxes When entering a high score, the game does not allow users to type the letter "R", presumably because this keystroke is being intercepted as a "remove rock" request. You can paste text with the letter "R" in it from elsewhere, but hitting the "R" key does not result in the letter "R" being registered in the text boxes - Frozen rocks I think I'm the only one to have experienced this, but I've had it happen several times: sometimes very late game, a rock will become "frozen" and non-removable, because the game fails to register its being clicked on. This has only happened to me post-level 800, and in all but one case, only one rock became frozen (in one run, I had 3 frozen rocks). No idea what causes it, but I have an unproven theory that it related to the glitched-movement bug (below). - Glitched movement/game speed Late game-- depending on system specs, as early as level ~500, on my PC, level ~800-- enemy movement becomes glitched such that, depending on whether the browser window has active focus or not, their movement or the overall game speed is glitched. With active focus, enemies become permanently frozen in place, vibrating back and forth but not advancing. Without active focus, the enemies move normally, but the overall game speed slows to 10-20% of normal. This seems to be related to the still-existing, but much more manageable, memory leak problem. If there were no memory leak, presumably the enemy movement/game speed would remain stable. - Memory leak @216 identified long ago that the critical hit text was the main culprit in GTD's previously crippling memory leak. Peter H. subsequently turned off the critical hit text after level 100 as a quick patch, which worked well enough to keep the leak from prematurely crashing the game. But it didn't actually close the leak, which still exists and is tied to the animation for frost and fire attacks (again, thanks to @216 for confirming this).

WGW - 2022-07-31 13:43:00.358817

@Jonathan A: Any time! I think at this point I enjoy the discussions about the game far more than I do the game itself. :) One more thing I meant to note-- I'm impressed you got so far with a run that started with a silver tower rather than a malachite. I think most GTD players settle pretty early on that they'll restart any game that doesn't begin with a malachite-- I've been playing this game for >10 years and I don't think I even tried a run that started with a silver tower since the first month I was playing. :) You've clearly demonstrated it CAN work-- but I bet you'll find it a lot easier to start with a malachite. Cheers!

Jonathan A - 2022-07-31 12:32:01.365982

@WGW: Thanks for your reply! Good to know, very interesting. And yes, I realize more and more for each game that Pink diamond is not necessary, thanks for pointing that out.

s - 2022-07-31 3:16:55.094372

@ scgmeinster i was able to see your run without interfeirence i find odd and increadiblr that you were able to move the enimies path to a guarinted victory or was that a glich?

WGW - 2022-07-31 2:05:05.547229

@SCGmeister: Nice job, but I have to tell you, I developed a spreadsheet I use to help count spaces/towers/turns remaining, and I plugged in your layout, and with the way your maze is laid out and with the towers you've already placed, as of your level 150, you only have a maximum of about 932 turns left you can make before running out of room (actually, a bit fewer than 932 because you have some uncombined gems already placed.) That would put you at level 1080 or so, tops, before you have to end the game. And that's assuming that you built NOTHING but paraibas for the rest of the game-- and I think you'll find that if you do that, you're going to start leaking enemies pretty hard later in the game. There just aren't enough of the towers placed at this point which you need for long erm stability (golds, jades, emeralds) to be able to start building only paraibas. Each tower you build other than a paraiba costs you a full turn from your total maximum number of moves left. So, not even close to level 1200, sorry. :) It's a LOT harder than I think it looks to people who have gotten past level 150, some of whom just figure that all that's involved to get to the highest possible level is just being willing to endure the tedium of playing out all the levels. There's a lot more to it than that-- you have to be planning for maximizing space from the very earliest part of the game. Some of what you have to do in order to enable more turns is extremely counterproductive strategy for any reason OTHER than maximizes turns, which makes the early game a lot harder than it is normally. Part of the reason I'd never, ever be able to kill all 10 ground enemies on level 150 is because of the self-imposed restrictions on my playing which, long term, allow for more turns to be made without running out of room. I wish it wasn't such a ridiculously tedious slog to play out runs this far, because than maybe more folks would understand that getting above level 1000 is itself a bigger challenge than just getting a sustainable layout past level 150. Getting to level 1100 requires a lot of really careful planning, and level 1200 (which I'm still working on getting past-- I have another viable run going now!) is very, very difficult to get to; you need to have a planned maze layout that wastes as little space as possible, and you really have to be aware of how many non-paraiba towers you can afford to build as you go along. I don't blame anyone for not having the obsessive "patience" to play runs out for two weeks. But if it were possible to play a much sped up version of GTD, where folks could get as far in a few hours as it now takes weeks to do, the subtleties of what makes pushing past level 1000 so challenging would be more apparent to more folks. As it stands, I think I only get credit from anyone for being willing to play runs out for so long, but there's a bit more involved than just my being nuts. :) @Jonathan A: Unupgraded bloodstones attack ALL enemies in range. If you build one early, it will rack up a lot of kills and continue to grow in attack power. The other towers that attack all enemies in range are too weak to matter, but bloodstones remain useful in unupgraded form for the first 100 levels; once you've got enough stun power from enchanted emeralds, you upgrade the bloodstone so that frozen enemies get lots of damage from the upgraded bloodstone's flame attacks. Hugely important gem, though I generally only build 1. But even that 1 bloodstone is hugely important early game. Also, not that you asked for this advice, but I'd suggest NEVER building pink diamonds. Ground enemies aren't a threat if you're playing correctly, just air enemies, and since the pink diamond only attacks ground troops, it's a waste of turns and space, imo.

Jonathan A - 2022-07-30 23:21:51.397161

Personal best so far: level 77. Now playing and at level 66, it's painfully slow lol, a big reason I quit a game. I find it interesting learning which towers are worth using. My strategy so far has been essentially 50% dark emerald 50% gold, along with some support towers. I just learned from one of the comments about blood stone, I never used it thought it was worthless. What about it is so good? And I learned about SYS overriding black opal... Despair... https://ibb.co/LJGr32K

SCGmeister - 2022-07-30 6:25:44.403684

Alright, So I decided to come back after my last marathon of a run to mess around with a slight modification from my previous maze setup that may have the potential to reach level 1200, or at least really close to 1200, should I decide to hold out that long. Anyway, with this current run I got lucky with an early great opal, and to top it off I decided to get a recording of my level 150 run which I managed to get a total of 0 ground leaks, something I didn't quite manage in my previous marathon run. Also I think this demonstrates how op unupgraded bloodstones can get if placed properly. That said, now that I'm past level 150, I'm thinking about upgrading the bloodstones now (which I did in my last high level run) in the hopes of reducing the number of flyers leaking but I'm not sure. Right now it leaks somewhere from 3-5 flyers every 4 levels even without the upgraded, which may go dowm more with a few more emeralds. https://youtu.be/g64ciAEPgd8

s - 2022-07-30 2:46:23.935501

@wgw i can�t tell you how much i think you are rong about the quarts i mean it may very on the levels of difficulty but you might need it past level 52 for normal mode any lower you dont for normall mode the least you need to make it to level 51 is 3 lucky asians 3 fire stars 2 silver towers a black opal obviously and 1 pink dimond all fulley upgraded but you must have 1 lucky asain by level 14 otherwise it will be a fail i cant say that it will get you to 100 because i can only go to level 51 and no further because of the game itself not me losing all lives

fluff - 2022-07-28 14:20:05.073912

@WGW Thanks for taking a look at that! I definitely need to be aware of the shape I want in advance and start placing a few gems in the center ASAP. I tend to go around the edge first, but it makes sense that getting the Quartz in the right place merits getting at least one of its parts in the center.

WGW - 2022-07-27 23:12:29.971073

@216: Thanks for the input on the bug list. I still don't really grasp what the minimum speed bug is, but presumably Peter will understand! @fluff: Congrats on making good progress. . . but be forewarned, the REAL killer is level 150. I don't think I've ever managed to kill more than 5 ground troops on level 150, with the strongest and longest maze/layout I've ever had. Without a great opal, I'm luck if I can kill one ground troop; with a great opal, I usually only kill 3. If you can get past level 150, though, odds are very, very high that you won't lose after that unless you end the game purposely (I have lost one or two runs after level 150, but even those were probably salvageable if I'd played them out differently.) One thing I noticed in your screenshot of the earlier run-- you didn't have a quartz built yet (you absolutely need one by level 36, latest), and the two gems you placed as part of the quartz recipe were off to the side of board. Since you can do a "combine special" on any gem once you have all three placed, you should try to put a flawed amethyst or a normal ruby in the middle of the map early on, so that you can build a quartz from it as soon as you pick a flawless emerald. Otherwise, with these two gems already placed in locations where you do NOT want the quartz, you're now forced to keep repicking in the center for the final gem, the flawless emerald, which is the hardest to get (lowest odds). I suspect that you were trying to avoid leaching kills from the malachite, but this is one exception to the rule, because the quartz is so important. Ideally, you'd place a flawed amethyst in the center rather than a normal ruby, because the amethyst will only kill air troops (and not many of them). But if I get a normal ruby early on before I've drawn a flawed amethyst, I'll put it in the center, even though it does leach kills-- at least those kills will end up inherited by the quartz when you build it. Another exception, of course, to the rule of trying to keep gems away from the initial malachite, is to get a decent opal in place ASAP. I hope the run goes well!

s - 2022-07-27 21:39:51.450196

@ wgw there is one glich that you di not mention in your draft and aparently it is only affecting me the enimies a is not apearing on the track ,and yes it was a obvious joke but i never joke about anything and i assumed that you were not jocking and i was focusing on something important for yesterday

fluff - 2022-07-27 16:57:20.421445

I had to do a lot of repicking following that last screenshot, but still very lucky overall! I made it through level 50 easily without any leaks, and there were only 3 on level 44 and 4 or 5 on level 48. I really, really hope this doesn't end with me closing a window or some other problem. Also sorry for the repeated posting. Pretty excited about this run. I will wait to post more for now.

fluff - 2022-07-27 14:53:44.884683

And as soon as I say that, I have an absolutely fantastic run going so far. https://ibb.co/w6VHvN9

fluff - 2022-07-27 13:54:50.853500

Got to level 100! I must say, despite a lot of advice, I'm kind of... bad at this game. I'll keep playing though.

216 - 2022-07-27 11:34:35.562128

Minimum speed bug: due to logic bug, minimum speed works like multiplied by 1.33333333 (/0.75) Also, SYS have wrong combat stats

WGW - 2022-07-27 3:32:27.114045

Sorry, didn't paste the full text. Proposed text of bug list: - Combine multiple gems When you draw more than one gem of the same type and quality, you're given the option to combine them into the next-higher-level gem of the same type. You're supposed to be able to combine and upgrade TWO levels when you draw FOUR gems of the same type and quality, but a bug in the code requires FIVE gems. (observation regarding the specific coding bug comes from @216) - Combine Special The Javascript version of GTD allows for doing a "Combine Special" to create a tower on ANY gem that's part of that tower's recipe, as long as all the required gems are placed on the board (in the Flash version, you could only do a "Combine Special" on the most-recently-placed gem in a recipe). However, in allowing for this flexibility, a bug has been introduced where the game will, under certain conditions, consume two gems in a recipe and leave one of the required gems on the board. When exploited correctly, this can mean that, practically speaking, you only need to draw a single perfect gem of any type for the entire game and can create special towers off it indefinitely. - Star Yellow Sapphire When you build a SYS after having built a Black Opal, the Black Opal's 40% (max) buff gets overridden by the SYS's 5% buff. Building another Black Opal restores the 40% buff. Essentially, whichever tower is built most recently will override the buff from any previously-placed tower. The buffs from these two different towers, the Black Opal and the SYS, should either stack, or at least, the Black Opal's buff should not get erased by building a SYS. - Lack of text documentation for Jades There's no mention in the text description for Jades that they earn gold, a component of the game that is absolutely necessary to understand in order to learn how to play well. - Movement speed I defer to @216, since I don't really understand what this is about, but from his description, it has a huge affect on gameplay after level 40-- something to do with the minimum enemy speed not being correctly affected by slowing gems/towers, and I think @216 has identified what part of the game code is causing the problem in prior comments. But again, I don't really understand this specific issue myself. - Blank high score text For some odd reason, submitted high scores sometimes end up posted with blank name text, or-- I've observed personally-- text from prior-submitted high scores (and not due to autocomplete filling in the field, I can vouch). There doesn't seem to be any identifiable pattern to this, but @scgmeister has suggested it might have something to do with the browser's "process ID". - Frozen rocks I think I'm the only one to have experienced this, but I've had it happen several times: sometimes very late game, a rock will become "frozen" and non-removable, because the game fails to register its being clicked on. This has only happened to me post-level 800, and in all but one case, only one rock became frozen (in one run, I had 3 frozen rocks). No idea what causes it, but I have an unproven theory that it related to the glitched-movement bug (below). - Glitched movement/game speed Late game-- depending on system specs, as early as level ~500, on my PC, level ~800-- enemy movement becomes glitched such that, depending on whether the bowser window has active focus or not, their movement or the overall game speed is glitched. With active focus, enemies become permanently frozen in place, vibrating back and forth but not advancing. Without active focus, the enemies move normally, but the overall game speed slows to 10-20% of normal. This seems to be related to the still-existing, but much more manageable, memory leak problem. If there were no memory leak, presumably the enemy movement/game speed would remain stable. - Memory leak @216 identifitied long ago that the critical hit text was the main culprit in GTD's previously crippling memory leak. Peter H. subsequently turned off the critical hit text after level 100 as a quick patch, which worked well enough to keep the leak from prematurely crashing the game. But it didn't actually close the leak, which still exists and is tied to the animation for frost and fire attacks (again, thanks to @216 for confirming this).

WGW - 2022-07-27 3:28:44.462729

Proposed draft of identified bug list: @216 identified long ago that the critical hit text was the main culprit in GTD's previously crippling memory leak. Peter H. subsequently turned off the critical hit text after level 100 as a quick patch, which worked well enough to keep the leak from prematurely crashing the game. But it didn't actually close the leak, which still exists and is tied to the animation for frost and fire attacks (again, thanks to @216 for confirming this).

WGW - 2022-07-27 3:27:48.615092

Attn @216, and any other long-term GTD players! :) I finally got around to writing up a first draft of what I hope to be a comprehensive list of GTD bugs, which I will send to Peter Holko after getting other folks' input. I know I'm missing things-- I went by memory, rather than re-reading all the dozens of existing comments here-- but I think this is at least a good starting point. If I've missed or anything, or got anything wrong, please do offer any corrections/additions. I don't know whether Peter will have the time to update GTD again, but if he does, I don't think it's reasonable to expect that he's going to be able to comb through all the discussion here to find all the specific bug reports. But if we can collaborate on making a list first, then I can send it to him via an email, and whether or not he has time to update the game again, he'll at least have the bug list available for reference. I'll post the first draft in a second comment.

WGW - 2022-07-27 2:54:25.563581

@s: Sometimes the intended tone of text-based messages doesn't get through-- I was just being tongue-in-cheek/joking in referring to myself as insane. I *am* clearly and hopelessly hooked on playing this game, but I don't see that as a sign of actual mental illness. . . :) That said, I'm now trying yet ANOTHER run to beat level 1200 and this time I did NOT get a great opal-- currently at level 300, and I should make be able to make it to level 1200 even if I never get a great opal, but man, is it SLOW. And this is completely pointless, especially given the strong possibility that any high score I post will end up with blank text. But onward I forge. . .

s - 2022-07-25 2:49:43.787135

i kinda know what you mean but it is for something else , and i am truely not trying to be rude or anything but i am more insane than you are and there is always worse even if you think you have it very rough there is alwase worse

WGW - 2022-07-24 0:34:32.625070

Attempt number-- I don't know, nine or ten?--at getting past level 1200 once again lost due to a 20 second power failure. I was at level 500-something and had extra room reserved to account for the possibility of getting three frozen rocks, just had to play it out. I keep saying after every run like this, that's it, I'm not playing this any more for a while. . . and then after about five minutes of trying to just, say, watch TV with full, undivided attention and no GTD run going, I get so antsy/bored, I end up starting another GTD run. And each time, I tell myself, don't play for level 1200 this time! Just play casually and GTD as the digital fidget spinner it mostly is for me anyway! And each time I end up getting a great opal very, very early and figure, eh, what the heck, I'll go for level 1200 again. And then the power goes out after 30 hours of playing. I'm clearly beyond hope. �The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results." Einstein didn't actually say that quote, but it's still true. . .

s - 2022-07-22 3:13:32.808172

after looking at the score board for the time people took to defeat level 51 i am at a personal conclusion that it is broken for me not as they are very slow it is as is they are not being generated at all because i let my computer run about 3 ish hours and nothing chaning as far as i can see , @SCGmeinster i am sorry that i was a little rude in the last commit .

s - 2022-07-16 3:39:24.072955

once i had 2 anchient blood stones 1 regular blood stone with a black opal and lost that run because the other toweres witch do most of the damage in both of our runs mine was not doing enough you�re run was doing enough but i cant change your mind you think you are right i think you are rong just except it and disscintinue this conversation.

SCGmeister - 2022-07-15 4:33:55.513214

@s The having several unupgraded bloodstones in the center of my maze, situated where it can attack over 6 enemies at the same time is the main reason I was able to get past level 150 where I only leaked 1 ground unit. Basically unupgraded bloodstones is better when it can attack several enemies at the same time. In fact, I had a couple instances where I upgraded my bloodstones too early (not enough emeralds yet to provide decent stunlocking) and suddenly I started leaking ground units.

s - 2022-07-15 3:57:09.401901

well i just restarted about my 13 run cause i dont know how long it takes for the enimies to appear on the game and @ wgw personly i think you are over estimateing the blood stone but that is my opinion

WGW - 2022-07-10 21:23:49.740326

Thanks for the sympathy, @SCGmeister! I console myself, though, by remembering that there's a good chance that if I continued, I'd still end up with a blank text high score. So in a way, it saved me another 50 hours of deadly dull gameplay with, very likely, no payoff. But someday I WILL post a high score at level 1200 or higher. @s: You do need a Black Opal to get past level 50 without leaking any ground enemies, in my experience. But don't underestimate how powerful an early, UNUPGRADED bloodstone is!

s - 2022-07-10 4:04:32.851512

@wgw i do not have any clue on what is wrong with my commit section every commit from yours on the 5 to scgmeister did not show up till after my chrome book did something weird and it is the third time that i noticed it hapening , @ wgw i agree that it would be a good very early tower with other stun towers for me it would be level 10 to 20 any futer i feel you would need a black opal and the tower upgraded to do any sever damage to enimies .

SCGmeister - 2022-07-09 5:16:30.140503

@WGW Ouch, that sounds rough. I was getting quite paranoid of something like that potentially happening towards the end of my run also, mor specifically the possibility of my pc randomly deciding to restart to finish an update, even though I have the uac set to prevent my pc from auto restarting on it's own. Anyway, I'm also taking a bit of a break right now, and it's highly doubtful I'll attempt another 1000 level plus run anytime soon, not unless we happen to get lucky enough to see another update to this game that fixes several of the known bugs.

WGW - 2022-07-08 21:32:49.960023

@fluff: Yeah, that's what I mean. Sometimes the game just endlessly gives you rotten, rotten picks. . . . and I just lost my level 1200 run which I've been playing for DAYS because of a power failure. Nothing like waking up and seeing the computer that you've left powered up for a week is turned off. And not even just a power failure this time-- it looks like somehow the circuits in half of my house got blown out while I was asleep, even though all that was running was a single PC. I'm moving soon, so at least I won't have to FIX it. I think that's going to do it for me and GTD for a while, at least until after I've moved. I'm pretty maxed out after "losing" that run and all the high scores I've posted recently which ended up BLANK. But I'll keep checking in on the comments.

fluff - 2022-07-07 21:34:59.834462

Playing a round now where it REPEATEDLY offers me perfect rubies and basically no other perfect gems.

WGW - 2022-07-06 20:44:01.405065

@fluff: You could also just be having a run of unusually bad luck-- when I'm starting new runs (as opposed to spending 2 weeks playing a run out to level 1000+. . . ), occasionally I go several days (meaning dozens of attempts) without getting a stable layout, without any difference in how I'm playing. I definitely don't think that exploiting the combine special bug is what's messing you up. :) All it does is allow you greater control over what towers you can build without lots of repicks. The only real hedge against bad luck is building Jades-- or whatever alchemy @216 uses to be able to get by with so few Jades. (I would love to see @216 play out the first 50 levels of a successful run to see how he develops his maze-- his approach seems a lot more consistently successful than mine.) Re: the high score text bug, there was a really good suggestion below from SCGmeister that the bug might be related to the browser's "Process ID" (comment at 2022-06-12 21:12:33.686562)-- which is a very intriguing idea and might well be correct. But I haven't been able to verify it yet (and even @SCGmeister was only offering this as a possibility, not claiming to know definitely), so I consider it at this point to not be avoidable. I will say that I now always close the browser tab after a high score run and open a new tab before I start again, but I don't even know if doing this changes the "Process ID", so I don't know if it will even prove anything if I get another blank text high score. My last high score wasn't blank, but used text from a much earlier run, and I'm quite certain that it wasn't a result of autocomplete filling in the old text. It's all very weird behavior and far beyond my programming experience to even guess what's causing it, because it seems (to me) EXTREMELY unlikely that the high score text bug is a result of errors in the game code itself. Seems like some sort of javascript platform/browser type problem rather than a programming error, since it's a such a ridiculously simple function to store text entered by a user. This is, like, the second thing you learn how to do when you're a novice programmer, right after "Hello, World". :)

fluff - 2022-07-06 19:35:50.492517

I thought the bug was narrowed down to something to do with browser session. I'm also doing far worse now focusing on exploiting the combine bug than I was before, so clearly not applying that correctly. =(

WGW - 2022-07-06 6:26:42.503796

@DR JM NIPOK: No known way to avoid this bug with the blank text high scores. It's a huge bummer-- I think all the other blank scores over level 500 are mine.

DR JM NIPOK - 2022-07-06 4:16:42.487429

Second Time a High Score (level 715 this time) did not record the Name and left it blank. Is there a known way to avoid this or is this random or browser based or due to a known reason ? Thx ! Sigh..

WGW - 2022-07-05 22:27:53.455233

Congrats, @SCGmeister! Now that there are two people other than me to play GTD over level 1000, I feel less insane for doing so myself. Well, slightly less insane, at least.

SCGmeister - 2022-07-05 15:33:56.889893

After a good month of grinding and putting off restarting my pc (despite my computer pestering me to do so) to avoid losing my progress, I finally managed to get past level 1000 which was my primary goal. Once getting close to my goal, I realized I'd be able to reach 1100 instead if I were to make a slight alteration to my maze thanks to an unupgraded rock allowing for more room to plase another 16 of them or so. In tghe end, I would have been able to get up to about 1116 maximum I believe with this run. As a note, I barely survived level 150 and 152 thanks to the unupgraded bloodstones placed in the middle of my maze only allowing 1 leak on level 150. As for the star sapphire, I didn't put that down until late game and it was only placed because I absently kept a gem instead of clicking to repick. (there were a few other minor mistakes). That said, I think the only thing it did was increase the total ammount of time it took to reach a higher score as the vibrating glitch was already in full swing. Here are a number of pics showing a little of how this maze transformed. https://imgur.com/h9Om13k, https://imgur.com/SYWIhs9, and https://imgur.com/4HH0Sx1

WGW - 2022-07-05 9:14:44.933958

@s: Bloodstones aren't useless without the black opal buff by any means. Having one early game matters a lot-- but you have to leave it UNupgrapded. The upgraded "Ancient" bloodstone is only good when you have lots of stun power. As for the kill count, that's not a bug-- the gem you did the "Combine Special" on to make the bloodstone already had those 22 kills and the bloodstone "inherited" them. It never worked this way in the Flash version of GTD, but it does now, and it's a good change. A tower will ONLY inherit kills from the gem you do the "Combine Special" on. Any kills racked up by other gems in the recipe are just lost. I'm on level 767 of attempt number. . . five, I think? To break level 1200. I have enough room to make it to level 1210, which gives me a margin of error for TWO frozen rocks, if that bug happens again (which I may be only one to have ever seen). If I get MORE than two frozen rocks, I will be so po'd! But I've only had one run where I got more than one frozen rock. We'll see! Screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/LNmG349

s - 2022-07-05 4:59:14.032310

i am soory to any player that thinks i am spaming messiges i am trulley sorry i hope you forgive me and @ wgw i found another bug it is with the blood stone in my new run i have two blood stones and 1 i just creadted but it is saying it has 22 kils but it is imposiable because i just made it and blood stones is preaty much usless without the black opal buff

s - 2022-07-05 4:42:27.977351

i think the enimies around 39 i faster then usuall , and on wave 51 is there a certain time limit i have to wait?

s - 2022-06-30 2:58:58.033256

i fianly got to wave fifty one and now i see what you are talking about when the enemies are moving slower . and good luck to everyone on a run.

s - 2022-06-29 11:08:10.876376

i am not sure what is going on but from @wgw comit onthe 25th to @fluff comit on 28th they all did not show up for me till 11 a clock at night yesterday , and i am not seeing how the blood stone is beater then the anchient blood stone but that is my personal opinion.

WGW - 2022-06-29 1:26:10.936941

@fluff: I'm Glad the tips were worth posting! Keep plugging away and you'll get it, I'm sure. :) I'm doing a run now with no great opal at level 106, leaking too many air enemies as usual without a great opal, anywhere from 4 to 8 bats escape every air level. . . It might stabilize without a great opal, but I'm gonna need a lot more jades. . .

fluff - 2022-06-28 14:11:41.405053

@WGW Your latest tips are helpful! Especially the one about exploiting the combine bug. I was aware of the bug, but not that it was so important. I got to level 96, as opposed to the previous 92. Maybe insistence on exploiting the combine bug will help me get further.

WGW - 2022-06-27 19:57:43.213729

Well, I not only accidentally ended what SHOULD have been a record-breaking run at level 1151 (it should have gone to at least level 1180), but I entered my high score text without my initials. . . well, at least it's not BLANK! Level 1151, "Say My Name", is my latest run. I've posted this run to YT for lord knows what reason, since it's the most boring gameplay video in history, but for anyone who actually wants to glance at it, it's here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLnLuT-xRQN1qOO0jU6DiYWh60mhp2KUAl My current theory on frozen rocks-- thoroughly unproven-- is that rocks get frozen only in late levels when you allow enemy movement to get glitched. If, on the other hand, you make sure the GTD window loses focus for the first few seconds of a late level, you can remove all the rocks without problem. But this may be a pure coincidence, that I've observed this pattern. I really have no idea what causes rocks to get frozen late levels.

WGW - 2022-06-25 10:16:01.497708

@216: That's interesting, that the Star Yellow Sapphire is even more bugged than I was aware of. At some point soon, I think I'm going to try to put together a comprehensive list of the bugs that we're aware of and send it to Peter- there's no way he'd ever have time to read through all the comments here, and if he ever has the time to do another update, it would be great if these bugs got addressed. Some of them may be very tough to diagnose and fix, like the high score text bug, but things like the combine special bug, the multiple gem combine bug, the problems with the SYS, those are all VERY easily fixable. If I get around to this, I'll post it here before sending it to Peter so you or anyone else can add to it. @s: I didn't think that you had suggested that Black Opal buffs should stack, I was just clarifying for my own comment that I didn't think that would be a good idea, because I was otherwise saying that the SYS buff SHOULD stack with the Black Opal buff. So I was just trying to be clear that I was only saying that these two diffeent gems' buffs should stack with each other, but not trying o suggest that the attack buffs should all stack upon each for every new tower you build withbuff properties. I alsomeant to clarify, but forgot to, that when I said that I estimate about an 80% of being able to get past level 150 in any run that you don't have to restart very early, I didn't mean that this would be true of everyone-- I mean that if you know the game very well, you can develop a sound strategy that will "win" you 80% of your runs. But as I keep saying, I consider this a difficut game-- especially for newcomers who are missing key information about the game that isn't documented anywhere (e.g., that Jades earn gold). For a brand new player, your odds of getting past level 150 are approximately zero. :) The more you play and the better you get, the higher the odds get-- but there's a limit, because very bad luck can still sometimes ruin even very strong runs.

s - 2022-06-25 3:08:45.642333

@wgw from what i read of you commit i dont think you got what i was saying about the black opal buff i already know none of the buffs stack so i was saying seperate the black opals to get a greater damage buff for more towers when they are seperated, @216 at least now you know that is curently broken so now further on you will know to make the smae mistake again.

216 - 2022-06-24 13:15:21.661544

More about SYS: it dont even have correct dmg (same as unpgraded). And due to speed bug slowing effect is very minor. Shame, in flash version i was using SYS.

WGW - 2022-06-24 4:23:59.022491

Reposting the tips from my earlier comment because I inadvertently buried them under a bunch of gibberish at the top. So, repeating: 1) Do NOT repick gems early game. I almost never repick gems until I've fully upgraded gem chances and have at least one jade built to earn gold. Maybe I'll repick ONCE early game, but only if I have an otherwise very strong start going. If you get a turn with lousy gems, just consider it a wasted turn. When I get more than one turn with lousy gems early game, I just restart. You can't afford to blow gold on repicks early on. Eventually, you'll have so much gold that repicks become trivial, but not at the start of the game. 2) EXPLOIT THE COMBINE SPECIAL BUG! I can't emphasize this enough. The way to do this earlyu game is to NEVER place a gem that's part of a tower recipe until you FIRST have the perfect gem needed placed on the board. If the first gem of any recipe that's on the board is the perfect gem, then you can keep creating towers off of it forever without consuming it. But this will only work if the perfect gem is FIRST placed. I can't imagine how many more attempts it would require for me to do as well as I do if I had to pick a perfect gem for every tower I build! 3) Avoid wasting early turns on towers that become dead weight by level 30-- namely, silver towers, malachites (beyond the first one or two, which you do need), star rubies (always useless), uranium (almost useless) 4) Never, ever, EVER build a Star Yellow Ruby-- while the description accurately says that they provide a 5% damage buff to gems in range, what is DOESN'T say is that this buff will OVERRIDE THE BUFF FROM BLACK OPALS, which is 40%. Bad enough that the buffs don't stack, but if you place a Star Yellow Ruby AFTER a Black Opal, you'll actually LOSE 35% of your existing attack buff. You can get the 40$ back by building another Black Opal, but that means you've wasted 6 full turns to get right back where you started. It's easily to worst tower in the whole game, because it not only doesn't help, it actually HURTS your existing layout. Hope this is at least somewhat helpful-- and sorry for the repost, but if it were me reading, I'd have just skimmed right past that comment I left because all you can see without scrolling down is nonsense I didn't mean to paste!

WGW - 2022-06-24 4:18:08.326685

It's not even worth it to build a Star Yellow Sapphire BEFORE you have a Black Opal, because the 5% buff is tiny, and you're going to need a Black Opal to get past level 50 anyway, so you're really just wasting three turns. It's a terrible gem-- Peter Holko would need to fix it so that the attack buff stacks with a Black Opal buff for it to ever be even remotely worth ever building one. I don't think it would be a good idea for the Black Opal buff to stack with other Black Opal buffs-- you'd be to overpower your attack gems far too much. Not unless other aspects of the game were changed too. But the fact that the crappy Star Yellow Sapphire OVERRIDES the Black Opal buff is just a mistake in the game coding, and it makes this tower absolutely useless.

s - 2022-06-24 3:24:05.601814

some thing odd hapened with the last commit it is supposed to say (yea you are probably right that i will inprove and i do not know the way i will chose to improve because) .

s - 2022-06-24 3:17:17.437600

yea you are probably right but with the way i bont know the way i will chose because the last run had i think 3 blood stones and i probably upgraded them way to early or some thing and i had other combinations like the dark emerald mabby 2, the black opal, and other good combinations , and i use to repick so i would get one of each gem which i now relize is not a good idea, and my last run i had two malachiets and it kinda carried me through while i was geting the other combinations and i try to get them full upgraded before anything else , and thanks for the yellow star information not making that probably also helped me and since the black opal buff dose not stack it will be beter if i have one on a half of the map and i asuming that will work but i could be completly rong , and the debuf could be redone depending on the player had a extra combination but did not combind it at the time they made the star but otherwise you are probably right , and the odds of geting past the level i think will be significantly lower then the odds you have in your commit cause you can predict what gems you get and also depends on how much time the player has on this game because if they have never played before and dont check the other tabs they will be in the dark of how to play the game but that is my thoughts and have a good run next time.

WGW - 2022-06-24 2:35:17.318278

. . . and my apologies for posting four comments in a row, but I need to correct a mistake in my comments with additional gameplay tips: When I wrote to never build a "Star Yellow Ruby", I meant Star Yellow SAPPHIRE. I couldn't remember what it was called because I never build them-- but I just used sandbox mode to build one and see now that I got the name wrong. Again, my sincere apologies for the gibberish at the start of what might be a useful comment for newer players, and for needing to correct myself when I could have just proofread what I wrote first! :(

WGW - 2022-06-24 2:26:41.484448

Sorry for the gibberish at the start of my last comment-- I was pasting from notepad and didn't realize I had other stuff typed in already! But there's actually a comment there if you scroll past the gibberish! (I do this far too often. . . )

WGW - 2022-06-24 2:25:41.997659

6/28 12:45 prfcisionpharacy 516-833-6262 5300 10600 14000 5300 5300 3400 A couple more tips that I don't recall having come up in comments before, which may help folks struggling to get past level 50: 1) Do NOT repick gems early game. I almost never repick gems until I've fully upgraded gem chances and have at least one jade built to earn gold. Maybe I'll repick ONCE early game, but only if I have an otherwise very strong start going. If you get a turn with lousy gems, just consider it a wasted turn. When I get more than one turn with lousy gems early game, I just restart. You can't afford to blow gold on repicks early on. Eventually, you'll have so much gold that repicks become trivial, but not at the start of the game. 2) EXPLOIT THE COMBINE SPECIAL BUG! I can't emphasize this enough. The way to do this earlyu game is to NEVER place a gem that's part of a tower recipe until you FIRST have the perfect gem needed placed on the board. If the first gem of any recipe that's on the board is the perfect gem, then you can keep creating towers off of it forever without consuming it. But this will only work if the perfect gem is FIRST placed. I can't imagine how many more attempts it would require for me to do as well as I do if I had to pick a perfect gem for every tower I build! 3) Avoid wasting early turns on towers that become dead weight by level 30-- namely, silver towers, malachites (beyond the first one or two, which you do need), star rubies (always useless), uranium (almost useless) 4) Never, ever, EVER build a Star Yellow Ruby-- while the description accurately says that they provide a 5% damage buff to gems in range, what is DOESN'T say is that this buff will OVERRIDE THE BUFF FROM BLACK OPALS, which is 40%. Bad enough that the buffs don't stack, but if you place a Star Yellow Ruby AFTER a Black Opal, you'll actually LOSE 35% of your existing attack buff. You can get the 40$ back by building another Black Opal, but that means you've wasted 6 full turns to get right back where you started. It's easily to worst tower in the whole game, because it not only doesn't help, it actually HURTS your existing layout. Hope this is at least somewhat helpful!

WGW - 2022-06-24 1:27:55.479107

@s: If you keep at it, I'm sure you'll continue to improve. . . but I expect that repeatedly playing (and losing early) a game like GTD only appeals a very specific type of game player (which obviously includes me!) It's not a very exciting game. But it does have a lot of depth to it beyond the surface, and good playing can drastically reduce how much bad luck can screw you. You can't completely prevent bad luck from ruining a run, but you can come pretty close-- I'd say about an 80% chance of getting past level 150 for any run that you don't have to end really early (before level 10). I'm still in the middle of a run which I thought would get above level 1200, but again, around level 600 I started losing so much gold that I had to build some more towers other than paraibas, which cost a turn every time you build one, so I'm only going to be able to get up to level 1180 or so. Level 1200 is definitely possible, but I'm finding it very challenging. Even if you manage a run that will make it that high, you still have to endure the absolute tedium of playing it out for two weeks! I've been recording the run since level 475 and will post it to YouTube when it's done. But I can't imagine why I'm doing this, since there's absolutely nothing remotely interesting about the gameplay-- I'm basically just building one paraiba after another, except for the brief period around level 600 where I built some other towers. It's just 80 hours of deadly boring gameplay. But if my high score for this run ends up blank again, at least I'll have a way of proving that the high score is really my run! :)

s - 2022-06-22 2:21:53.991893

@ wgw thanks for the help even though i did not make my runs much farther it still helps and @ fluff not every run you play will mean you get every gem you want immidiatly some will take longer then usuall some will not and i hope you have a beater run next time you play

fluff - 2022-06-21 19:45:23.642374

I've had abysmal luck lately. Just played a game where I got up to level 40 and did the maximum number of repicks and still couldn't even get a PERFECT opal. I was stuck with a flawless.

DR JM NIPOPK - 2022-06-16 0:10:25.110550

Thats a real game changer but now I know not to stock up on lives and keep the bottom right corner for last. Besides the levels 500 and 600 which always seem to leak all 10 flyers, I had maybe 5 other leaks across 200+ levels. They really need to update the instructions better on game play someday. Thanks for the response! sigh...

WGW - 2022-06-15 22:36:33.365547

@DR JM NIPOK: Sorry to say, but that's exactly what happens when you run out of room, the game just soft locks and you can't post a high score. I suspected that this is what would happen, but made sure I had ways of leaking enemies late game to avoid it. It was only just confirmed, in the past day or so, that what I suspected was accurate-- that the game soft locks when you run out of room with no way to end it and post a high score-- by @NeoVIP_MD, who commented JUST before you. Check out the comment at 2022-06-13 8:22:09.334369. So yes, you have to make sure you have a way of leaking enemies late game. You can always end on a "no stun" level, but you have to be aware of how many moves you have left or you might go past your last chance at ending on a "no stun" level. Otherwise, there are ways to be able to leak enemies late game. The main way, I think, is to make sure you have removable rocks that will alter the maze and massively shorten the ground enemy's path. My maze can be converted from a seven pass maze to a one pass with the removal of a single rock. With all the attack/stun power in place, most of the ground troops still get killed off even with the shortened maze, but a few do get through, and that's all you need. Sorry you weren't able to post a high score. It's really not fair, since there's no warning about it anywhere but here in the thousands of words of comments!

DR JM NIPOK - 2022-06-15 22:08:20.225318

Some may find humor. I tried to post this question multiple times and kept trying different gem names but it would never accept my comment. For S&G just tried the words gems and wouldn't ya know. Please tell me the game does not just abruptly end without saving if you have 50 lives and 260,000,000+ gold and no where to place a stone. If so the gameplay should be much better described so we know what to expect. First time I've ever filled up the board. very depressed if it can't be saved after playing on and off for almost a week. sigh.

DR JM NIPOK - 2022-06-15 22:05:05.012464

At level 657 with only 4 open stones and it won't let me place the last stone anywhere. I assumed when all spots left are blocked the game would end gracefully. How do people with other high levels get it to end/save ? HELP !! THANK YOU

NeoVIP_MD - 2022-06-15 7:32:52.126626

@WGW To be honest I was hoping maybe I could leak another few enemies, but it didn't work out. I'll get em next time though! Cheers.

fluff - 2022-06-14 15:02:30.470618

@sYa This is a known glitch. It's related to the order in which you place the gems, not where on the map you place them. Between the main malachite, an EG, and another malachite, special gems got 185 kills in the first 20 levels, so I guess pretty good.

sYa - 2022-06-14 13:48:10.830950

I've managed to replicate the behaviour: https://snipboard.io/OeQZAJ.jpg Combine special with Flawless Opal selected when there is another flawless opal present consumes BOTH flawless opals, and this time left the flawed emerald, the gem most bottom right, standing, so I'm guessing gem placement factors into this as well. My next experiment would be trying to get a different gem to be bottom right = last in sequence, to confirm. This happened to me fairly early into an otherwise successful survival run but with no luck on opals, I had a flawless opal to buff my towers which I did not want to consume until I had better or at least a replacement; when it consumed both, I was left without opal buff and leaked two waves. Probably wouldn't have gotten to 100 anyway that time, but it's a bug, hence breaking my long lurking to report! :-) Keep up the good work everyone!

sYa - 2022-06-14 12:52:04.891940

Odd glitch: I made a paraiba, and it consumed BOTH my flawless opals ( + one of my two flawed emeralds, and the only perfect and flawed aquamarines, as should be). Does anyone want to try replicating that, in case it's not just a random glitch?

WGW - 2022-06-14 10:32:25.787771

@scgmeister: Thanks for kind comments on my playing style. :) There are plenty of other ways to approach the game-- whatever alchemy @216 uses, e.g.! One Jade Challenge? Seriously??? I'm a certified Abuser of Jades. My current run-- with the great opal at level 21-- I only have 8 jades built, we'll see if I can keep it that low. But ONE??? @NeoVIP_MD: You're probably the only person so far to ever play out a run to the point of not being able to make another move! Did you not see it coming, or wanted to see what would happen, or couldn't leak enough enemies? Cause playing a run that long and not being able to post a high score, ouch, that's painful. Well done, though!

WGW - 2022-06-14 10:20:36.071225

@fluff: I overstated-- the first malachite should get most of the kills, not all. It's not really possible to let it get ALL the kills. But it's definitely something to take into account in the earliest levels, to avoid letting other pieces (particularly gems rather than special towers) leach kills from the malachite. I started a run today where I was thinking, eh, I'll just play casually for once and not worry about leaving space for maximum turns, which would sure make it a lot easier to get past level 150 (there's a lot of self-imposed limitations that prevent building towers where you want to, if you're planning for max turns/space). And then lo and behold, I got a great opal on LEVEL TWENTY ONE. I'd just done the final upgrade to gem chances that turn, and boom, a great opal. So now I'm going for level 1200 again-- though I already built a couple of towers in spaces that will cost me about 20 turns. But I can still make it, easily, if I endure the tedium. Which I will. I clearly need mental help. Screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/tb7w85p

s - 2022-06-14 3:07:14.730113

@ fluff i would try to get a blood stone or black opal next personaly or a scendary malachite but it is your choice to what you think is best for your run

fluff - 2022-06-13 23:01:15.281442

When y'all say malachite that gets all the kills for the first 20 levels, how many of the kills is "all"? I got to level 21 (through the first 20 levels) with a malachite getting 158 out of 200 kills, which I think is probably about as good as I'm going to get it without some major new insight.

NeoVIP_MD - 2022-06-13 8:22:09.334369

Long time lurker. Just got to 717 but couldn't continue due to lack of space. Just learned from this run that I got to be more space conserving. Too bad I can't post it on the high scores, but wanted to share this pic: https://imgur.com/a/v8TKJc9 Had an early great opal and another one later on. Also @WGW - I checked out your video. I have the same name and last initial as you! Wowow. Cheers y'all!

SCGmeister - 2022-06-13 5:20:16.871021

Update, Ya, that last one didn't go much further, but I just got another lucky early great opal and this run is looking to be a lot more promising for getting a high score. https://imgur.com/h9Om13k

s - 2022-06-13 2:29:30.428908

i thought it was a example my bad and the link kinda worked but kinda did not because of some thing in my computer that is installed in mine and it is the same thing on imager if it was not instaed the link might of worked , i would also be able to get on integer , or give you a video of my run but since of the thing that is instaled there is nothing i can do to present the screen shot , and i am not trying to be rude to anyone at all i do agree that i need to lose the habit of making a lot of small and usless comitss that is not about gtd and i also agree that i am geting to personal with my commits and @scgminster i got to the same point as you did but i thought you would be able to get past it my bad so i guess this conversation is over now cause there is nothing i can do about the software that is instaled , @wgw all of the links worked on my side but that aparently dose not matter unless some one else can axxis it , and the only person who would care would be the person playing the game to get to that level, @scgminster if you dont have patience i sugest just walking away for a few moments because you dont have to be at what you are playing the game on , @wgw if you actually think my behavior is rude and incosiderate then i adviseyou to NEVER come to piedmont ever . and the black opal is broken now it took two perfect opals , a Aquamarien but did not take the flawless Dimond and good luck to the people that is on a run, and have a good week to all , @ wgw i think i figured out a posiable flaw in my runs it may be that instead of going for one of each combination first i probably should be geting duplicates of each combination that is more help full for mid game to late game and less on imidiate begining waves i think i covered every thing ?

scgmeister - 2022-06-13 0:44:50.144646

@WGW I just just checked out your video out of curiosity as to the way you set up your maze and I have to say that is quite impressive and complex, especially on the way you use certain key stones for the purpose of changing the direction in which the ground units effectively multiplying the total length of the maze.

SCGmeister - 2022-06-13 0:01:15.636992

Meant to say "mystic black opal by 50"

scgmeister - 2022-06-12 23:59:44.476853

Right when I was about to give up on this run due to several ground leaks around levels 41 and 42 (wasn't even getting a PO) I finally got a well placed early great opal. Not sure if it will be enough to make back what I lost early to reach a stable run, but after managing to also get a great opal by 50 and seeing the big damage improvements from both, this is starting to look promising. https://imgur.com/nsOqmhJ

WGW - 2022-06-12 21:49:50.597558

New video: Getting past level 50 without leaking ground enemies, as requested by @John Cena. More details in the video description. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzwAfw8M188

WGW - 2022-06-12 21:47:22.300803

@SCGmeister: Oh wow, that's great to know, and great thinking on your part. This never even occurred to me! I will see if this helps for my next run. Getting a stable run without a great opal is pretty rough. It can be done, but I couldn't tell you what precisely separates the no-great-opal runs that stabilize from the runs that don't. A decent amount still comes down to luck, I think. beyond gem picks and what towers you build, because if the game refuses to stun an excessive number of air enemies over and over, you're going to lose, even when you should have enough EEs to expect to do better. I had a recent run with a very strong layout and plenty of EEs WITH a great opal around level 28, and I lost it at level 116 (the one in the video I posted.) Again, it amazes me how many folks here were commenting repeatedly how the game is way too easy!

SCGmeister - 2022-06-12 21:22:07.761147

Upon further experimenting, it seems that the only way to get the game to point to a new process id is to open the game in a new tab or window and close the old one, so it seems like a possible work around to the glitch of the game leaving a blank or an old comment in the score submission is to open the game in a new tab/window and close the old tab.

SCGmeister - 2022-06-12 21:12:33.686562

Yep, that run ended ate level 132, and it seems to have left a blank comment. The only thing I can think of is that I didn't bother to refresh the page from my previous score submission resulting in both games pointing to the same process ID. (I surrendered on the game right before this one and didn't refresh the page which may be the cause of the blank score submission)

scgmeister - 2022-06-12 20:36:13.377379

Heres an image of the updated maze I'm going for. As you can see this run likely won't last much longer (still no luck on a GO) I attempted to focus mor on the higher damage gems but without a great opal, they just don't seem to do enough damage to counter the number of flyers that gets leaked for me to be able to afford to replenish the lives lost on those levels. https://imgur.com/k41sfNS

WGW - 2022-06-11 13:55:13.906020

I just ended my current run which should have gotten me above level 1200. . . because I got a dreaded "frozen rock" at level 1060 which robbed me of four turns. Add this to the potential for a blank text high score as reasons why, if I had any sense at all, I wouldn't play runs out for two weeks trying to get above level 1200. I mean, honestly, who cares??? This time, the high score text didn't end up blank-- instead it ended up repeating one of my prior high scores, and this time I'm absolutely certain it wasn't because of autocomplete filling in old text, as I used to think was the cause when text repeated. I was hypercareful. But it ended up repeating text I used for a failed run weeks ago. Sigh. (L1067: "WGW Lame lame lame") Screenshot: https://imgur.com/BlTJkb8 The rock in the bottom right is the one that's frozen, meaning it can't be removed because the game won't recognize its being clicked on. This only happens very, very late levels and has only happened a few times to me, but like with the high score text bug, there doesn't seem to be any pattern to it at all. Completely random when it happens, and this time it made the difference between my being able to get above level 1200 or not, so I just threw in the towel.

WGW - 2022-06-11 13:45:03.557657

@SCGmeister: You really go all in on the jades and EEs! I would think, even though this obviously works, that the game takes a lot longer without more of the stronger attack towers. Regardless, the only real challenge left for you, which I doubt you'd want to endure, is increasing the level you can play to. But considering that the game is glitching for you 300 levels before it does on my PC (this is something that's still affected by PC specs), it would be even slower for you than it is for me to play to level 1000 or higher. Believe me, it's no fun anyway. I only do it because I'm fixated, clearly. :) Thanks for backing me up on the comments stuff.

SCGmeister - 2022-06-10 5:37:09.257529

Alright, I suppose I may as well post a screenshot of my current game progress so far which is without the use of a great opal (I tend to have pretty bad luck in getting a GO in my games). Anyway this one I believe has the potential to get me up to around level 900 though I'm not sure I have the patience to push it that far as the game starts to slow down considerably after around level 400-level 500, including the movement of the mobs glitching out (vibrating in place) when the browser is in focus. I also have plans to attempt to get a stable run going using a slightly more simple maze which will result in a more precise and cool looking spiral pattern in the middle and raising the potential maximum level Id be able to reach even further, though still not to the extent that WGW is going for. https://imgur.com/qAXXI8V As a note, I didn't upgrade those bloodstones right away, not untill I got to some of the higher levels where I felt like having more focused damage would be a bit more effective than the aoe damage. @S, I attempted the link and it just stated I don't have permission to access the file . Better to upload the image to an image hosting site like imgur.com then posting a link to that here instead whatever it is you were trying to do. I also mirror what WGW stated. Better to keep this comment section gemtd focused. Also, please avoid posting a bunch of small comments in a row, especially if you don't actually have anything useful to say. Not everyone needs to know your every detail in your struggling to try to share a screenshot.

WGW - 2022-06-10 4:44:35.499123

@s: Sorry, that was the wrong link for posting screenshots. It's actually https://imgur.com/ Now you can see what I mean about not testing links before posting them here. . .

WGW - 2022-06-10 4:42:41.855554

@s: The link doesn't work, with one dash, two dashes or no dashes. Look, as I said, you can USE a free website-- such as imagur-- to post the image. I wasn't suggesting that you CREATE a website. I don't know how you could possibly gotten that impression from what I wrote. Go to www.imagur.com and you can post the image there. You don't even need to have an account with the website, you can post an image as a guest. But I'm really not interested in tortuously helping you figure out how to post a screenshot. If you can't figure it out, I'm sorry. But please-- as I tried to say gently in a prior comment-- consider how you're posting comments HERE. You've now posted seven comments in a row that aren't about GTD, but that are you talking to yourself about how you can't figure out how to take or post a screenshot. And that's not only not useful or interesting commentary to add, but adding it over the course of SEVEN comments pushes all the actually relevant discussion down the page. I've really tried, very hard, to be as nice as possible to you, but I have to say, we're at a point where I'm finding your behavior disruptive and/or inconsiderate. I'm sorry, but that's how I feel at this point. If you can figure out how to post a screenshot-- and please TEST the link before you post it here-- I'm happy to talk about it. Otherwise, please be more considerate of folks who are actually trying to, you know, discuss the actual GAME. Thanks.

s - 2022-06-10 3:13:24.242473

there is one too many dashes but i think you might be able to see the screen shot if not owell at least i tried my best effert and sorry if i wasted your time.

s - 2022-06-10 3:01:43.351883

this is just a test it may or may not work but at least i tried https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KHHPdAHIU9zXRhQT2DbQcf--WP0r8Z3mHrrEBMMO8F0/edit

s - 2022-06-10 2:43:25.526703

ha i got the screen shot finally!

s - 2022-06-10 2:35:21.330018

unless you know wich wires a computer needs i cant make any thing to post my run for me to show you not cause i dont know how i just cant even if i wanted to i cant .

s - 2022-06-10 2:28:06.897075

forget it i am not able to do this so just forget about this intirely

s - 2022-06-10 2:22:56.298230

oh and i am going to have to put it on something else cause i dont think i will be able to create the free website myself so i will have to improvise on that as well if you dont mind .

s - 2022-06-10 2:15:05.973202

i think i may not be able to screen shot my run because it is not like a how should i say this it is kinda picky i guess since it is not like a pitcher? i can show the example on the link if it dose not work i may have something else that might work if this dose not.

fluff - 2022-06-09 22:16:53.644711

Well, got to level 92, though this run was clearly less good than the one I accidentally ended prematurely. @JC Kill 7 or 8 flyers in level 44?? I thought I remembered reading that *leaking* 7 or more flyers in level 44 was a game over, but trying to kill 7 sounds really, really hard. Then again, I'm not an expert. I don't think this run was particularly good or lucky, but I kept track of my leaks: 40 1 44 6 48 5 50 1 52 5 56 6 60 7 64 8 68 7 72 6 76 6 80 6 84 7 88 8 89 1 So I did break the rule of not leaking ground units, twice, in levels 50 and 89, and also leaked one in level 40.

s - 2022-06-09 11:10:10.057791

i try to get the combinations as soon as posiable for any of them and i just figured how to play the game kinda and be at the commit section at the same time so it will make the screen shot faster to make?

WGW - 2022-06-08 20:25:07.963004

@John Cena: I've thought about doing a video or two to help new players learn the game-- it just always felt like it might be a decent amount of work to put in for videos on a game that, for all I know, there are only 12 people still playing. . . :) But the high score list does keep growing, and people do keep leaving comments, and you did ask, so I'll try to do something soon. (I was surprised to see the YouTube video I posted, which is only linked in onew comment way down below and is otherwise totally unlisted on YouTube, has gotten almost 50 views-- imagine if I *listed* a GTD video! It'll be instantly viral! I'll be the Future King of YouTube!!!) It'll be a while, though, since I have to at least first finish playing out this run, which I'm masochistically intending to play out to level 1200. Currently at 971 and it takes upwards of 8 minutes a level to advance at this point. It's amusing to me how many times people commented here about the game being far too easy. I maintained that the game is not easy at all-- it's simply *learnable*. But it takes a whole lot of experimentation and/or reading comments on other people's strategies to make any headway. And for the folks who've posted high scores saying, e.g., "There's no challenge to this after level 100", well, I'm not going to argue that anyone else should waste their time playing runs to level 1200 like I'm doing, but that said. . . Being able to play the game to this high a level requires very specific strategies that are very counter-productive otherwise. Even in this run, I started being in danger of losing all my gold around level SIX HUNDRED, long past the point when the run should have completely "stabilized". I had to scramble and build a handful more EGs, EEs and even a few more jades before going to back to building nothing but paraibas. There's also every possibility that someone has a lucky run or two of GTD-- luck can go in streaks, after all-- and then decide the game is a cakewalk, when it's really, really not. Look at how specific the strategy recommendations are just to get past level 50. @216 thinks I do certain things in less than ideal way-- and I'm kinda clearly pretty good at this game. . . :) All of which is just to say, I think this is a hard game and always has been, except for maybe the initial javascript version where jades truly were overpowered in gold production. Will try to work up some sort of a video soonish. In the meantime, I'm still happy to comment on screenshots! @s,m,g: Look up how to take a screenshot, it's not hard to at all. Then you can post it to a free site and put the link here-- I use imagur, but there are a ton of them. Otherwise, really, it's impossible to help any more specifically than what's already been said here, mainly: (1) Always build a malachite first and let it get all kills for the first 20 levels, (2) build a central rose quartz by level 32, (3) build a bloodstone in the middle of the maze as soon as possible and don't upgrade it. There's never a need to leak ground enemies until level 150.

s,m,g - 2022-06-08 20:08:56.308568

okay i will try my best but i am not thattenical so it may be a while and now id prefer to use my curent name tag.

JC - John Cena - 2022-06-08 17:31:04.825339

I started the same way, way back when. And it's funny @Fluff because I picked the game back up because it's something I can easily do at work. I'm a Stationary Engineer at a Power Plant and it can be pretty boring. It's nice when I get to "later" levels where I can let it run while I go do a round. The strategy to get further than I have just still doesn't make sense to me. I started a run last night that was a pretty perfect start in my opinion. I had two oops leaks at lvl 24 but no more before level 40. By 44 I had 3 blood stones and 4 EE's and more damage that I won't ramble on about. I was still getting 3 - 7 leaks per flying level. If I can't even reliably kill 7 - 8 flyers at lvl 44 with a near perfect start then I'm not sure how to improve. @WGW would you be willing to record your next new game and post it to youtube so I can compare strategy?

fluff - 2022-06-08 13:50:52.457940

"...your new moniker has me picturing you this way: https://imgur.com/AoBCmoy" He'll yeah. Re: digital fidget spinner I did read that comment from a while ago, and it fits very well with how GTD feels to me. I think that was around when I started to read the comments section. My recent playing of this game started shortly before that.

WGW - 2022-06-08 10:48:21.738268

@fluff: Well, you're definitely making progress. RNG can be a real pain in early levels. Incidentally, your new moniker has me picturing you this way: https://imgur.com/AoBCmoy Interesting you referred to using this game "to digital fidget at work", since I used almost the exact same phrase in a comment somewhere down there, where I was pondering why I still play this game at all, let alone play runs that take two weeks to finish. GTD is a great digital fidget spinner. @s: Post a screenshot, otherwise there's not much more advice I can offer that I haven't said already covered in comments, probably long-windedly and more than once! :)

s,m,g - 2022-06-07 22:52:06.640885

i have been reading every ones commits and hoow the people use them but either i am doing something very wrong or something else but i have yet to get past level 25? and i have 1 blood stone ,black opal and others witch i forgot most names.

fluff - 2022-06-07 15:43:54.817015

@John WGW answered your question perfectly. I don't have anything to add. @WGW I played this a long time ago before it was JavaScript and remembered it when looking for ways to digital fidget at work. I noticed something about "gold generation" in the updates section, and between that and the comments section, figured it out. I had noticed the yellow numbers appearing above jades, but wasn't sure what they were at first. My current run is a bit sad. I haven't leaked a single ground troop through level 50, but I have ZERO enchanted emeralds and was late to get a blood stone. As a result, levels 44 and 48 were pretty rough.

WGW - 2022-06-06 23:41:42.043561

@John Cena: You probably haven't read my earlier comments about this (there are a LOT of comments here after all), but building so many paraibas isn't good strategy for any reason EXCEPT to maximum the number of turns you can make before running out of room on the board. It actually slows the game down in late levels that already way too slow to begin with-- both because the frost attack animation causes a progressive memory leak, and because you're not building any of the other towers which help kill enemies faster (primarily Egyptian Golds and Bloodstones). You're actually best off having only one, maybe two paraibas for the first 100+ levels of the game. I only start building them like a madman when I get a very early great opal, because that opens up the possibility of playing for maximum turns and not really paying much attention to overall attack strength. By level 800 or so, enemy movement is so glitched out that you really can't leak any enemies anymore no matter how good/bad your attack power and maze is. So basically, attack power and killing enemies quickly and efficiently just isn't what I'm focused on in runs like this. You shouldn't consider building endless paraibas to be a good strategy. :) The only way to earn gold in this game is through enemy kills and Jades-- and I still think it's absolutely terrible that the documentation for the game no longer even mentions that Jades earn gold at all. I don't know how new players ever figure it out, unless they're looking at the game code. Otherwise it would take, I think, a ton of experimentation to figure out that Jades have a low chance of earning gold. And this is so absolutely key to being able to play this game, I don't know how new players ever figure out how to play well enough before giving up in frustration, just because they're not given access to basic info like this (unless, I guess, you spend hours reading the comments page!) One ongoing difference between how @216 and I play GTD is that I build a lot of Jades, which gives me a cushion to leak more enemies than I'd like to. But it's a real tradeoff, because every turn you spend building a Jade is one you're NOT building an actual attack tower (golds, bloodstones, paraibas) or an Enchanted Emerald-- so you're sacrificing attack/stun power for a tower that's only real use is earning gold (Jades kill enemies in very early levels, but they're very weak on attack power and their stun effect is basically trivial). It amazes me this game still attracts new players at this point-- how did all you find it?

John Cena - 2022-06-06 21:52:24.988889

@Fluff what is your strategy to accumulate so much gold? Lucky Asian Jades?

fluff - 2022-06-06 19:59:45.782144

SSHAAAA! Got through level 40 with no leaks. Don't anticipate any before level 44.

fluff - 2022-06-06 15:01:39.156928

Welp. I didn't notice I was entering an air level and turned my attention elsewhere. I had only had 2 lives at the time, so my run ended accidentally at level 76. I had 125389 gold--way, WAY higher than the scores around mine lol. Oh well. I've learned a lot recently. Hopefully my next run will be even better. P.S. Part of the reason for the new moniker was score posting. My scores will at least include "fluff" in them, if not just be "fluff".

John Cena - 2022-06-06 8:56:47.572416

Hey 216 thanks for the exploit tip it works like a charm. And thanks WGW for the tips. I focus on mass producing Blood Stones and Enchanted Emeralds. I know we get (I think) a 5% gold bonus from Lucky Jade towers but what is it 5% of and how often? WGW your last screenshot blew my mind I would never think to use Paraiba as a long term strategy. I just try to spread a couple around for the armor busting. I'm really not seeing how to make it (much) past lvl 100. I can normally get to 44 with no air unit leaks. But by around 64 I am lucky to kill 4 out of every 10 air units. My level 100 game I purely lucked into 11 EE's and 5 Blood Stones. I admittedly only have 2 Lucky Jade towers but I fail to see really how the gold bonus from them can out earn the lives cost for very long. How are other people making it so far beyond lvl 100?

WGW - 2022-06-06 5:20:30.719004

Why did I type "fluffly" instead of "fluff"? I have no idea. . . except that it's getting late and clearly time for me to go to bed. ;)

WGW - 2022-06-06 5:14:29.793787

Oh, and @fluffly, I love the new moniker. :) Good luck on your current run! Here's a screenshot of the run which I have going which will get to level 1200 if I don't kill myself first. It's possible I can do better than this-- I made some mistakes along the way-- but not much. And my GOD, it's deadly boring. Screenshot: https://imgur.com/V7iT6qM

WGW - 2022-06-06 4:43:52.212776

@John Cena: @216 answered 100^ correctly, but if you're having trouble completely following (due to abbreviations and such) I can always offer a more long winded explanation. :) An early UNUPGRADED bloodstone is hugely important, imo. I've played out successful runs without getting one (and again, by "early", I mean getting one before around level 35), but they're just hugely powerful early game. It might have gotten lost, due to the way comments work here, how important it is (and I think @216 would agree with this) to have your first gem be a malachite that racks up nearly all the kills for the early game. That's due to its "aoe" (area of effect) attack, which attacks all enemies in range. Same with an UNGRADED bloodstone, except it's a lot stronger than a malachite initially is-- but of course it takes a little while in the game before you'll even possibly be able to build one. So for the first, say, 20 levels, I want the initial malachite getting all the kills, and as soon as possible after that, I want an unupgraded bloodstone in the middle of the layout. Sometimes I build more than one, usually not (not when I'm going for macimum possible turns and building as many paraibas as I can), but having an early bloogstone in the middle of the maze is hugely important. I usually don't upgrade that central bloodstone until I'm getting near level 100. I have a run going now that should finally break level 1200. . . if I play it all the way out. There's every possibility that if I do play it out, my high score text will end up being blank. I'm. . . conflicted. @216: I have to say again how impressed I am at that "one jade" challenge run you did. It's kinda inconceivable to me to leak so little for so many levels (particularly leaking air enemies on normal levels from 48 up). It feels like alchemy to me. :) I'd love to see the progression in your very early game, understanding that (as you've acknowledged) a lot of things have to fall into place by RNG luck for it to work. But still, you did it. Well done, indeed.

216 - 2022-06-04 11:13:26.976027

Nomally need 4 same perfects for uberstone, due to bug need 5, which is nearly impossible. Perfect exploit: took perfect before any of 2 other parts of special, build other parts and combine special on not perfect and not 1st gem of this type, ex.: PE FS [FS] fT -> PE # EE # PE FS fT FS [fT] -> PE # # FS EE BS and ABS are just much different, BS have great aoe, ABS great DPS on stunned target.

John Cena - 2022-06-04 8:22:11.849415

Post Note: I've been looking at same of your screenshots and videos. Is it really worth it to not be upgrading your Blood Stones?

John Cena - 2022-06-04 8:15:54.890829

Hi all, I have a couple questions if anyone would be willing to help. How do I use the glitch for combining gems without consuming the perfect that I have? And it looks like the uberstone is still unavailable beacuse of bugs, but what is the recipe for it? For reference my personal best is lvl 100. Screenshot for reference. https://imgur.com/a/CMSkwha

s - 2022-06-03 20:43:20.579576

good luck fluff but my computer is starting to freez for absoulout no reason that i can think of so i will be typing less frequent then usaual and i know this means nothing to anybody on this game and no one cares but owell .

fluff - 2022-06-03 18:53:18.904795

My maze lives to see level 61! This is by far the best run I've had. I really hope I don't accidentally close the window or something. https://ibb.co/HNWhj1w

fluff - 2022-06-03 17:26:45.119566

@216 Sorry, I forgot to answer one of your questions. "What was life cost at this point?" I don't remember, but I think it was 14. I definitely leaked way more than you or WGW were saying I should, but it wasn't a really high amount.

f - 2022-06-03 14:43:03.840397

@WGW&216 Thanks! That is helpful, and makes sense. f is too generic. I'll be fluff from now on.

216 - 2022-06-03 13:02:10.810728

Disagree about builing 2 RCs before lvl 50 - unless you get one 1-turn, its cost too much moves. But positioning 1st one is critical. Covering all path is not as imortant - need cover dmg zones. Having EG hitting outside RC aura is not optimal. About 1JC: I finished it at 251 - survived lvl 250. Not 100% sure if it would go to 1000, but almost no leaks at this point, so it should be enough gold for 300, 350.. I considered it as succes. Also i wanted sumbit score before i close game accidentally, shut down PC instead hibernate, etc. I needed to repick a bit less than i like, without exploiting combine bug it would be near impossible. Anyway RNG forced me to build so much (A)BS. And definitelly RNG matter a lot for 1JC (2 more leaks untill 200 would fail) . Early GO seems to be nesesary in addition to decent start (getting like 7 leaks in 44 = you can give up).

WGW - 2022-06-03 2:44:47.176430

@216: How's that "one jade" challenge run going?

WGW - 2022-06-03 2:42:02.932303

@ Minor correction: "You really should never be leaking ground enemies at any point"-- to be more accurate, you are going to inevitably leak ground enemies on the "no stun" ground levels (150, 250, 350, etc-- but you should be able to kill all ground troops on level 50 even with "no stun" in effect. Shoot for having at least one egyptian gold, one paraiba, one unupgraded bloodstone, and a black opal by level 50 and you should be able to kill all the ground enemies without stun. And if you're killing all the ground troops on a "no stun" level, then they're sure not going to be a problem for you on normal levels!

WGW - 2022-06-03 2:36:00.107002

@f: You really should never be leaking ground enemies at any point. The way the math works with buying lives, the cost starts to skyrocket pretty quickly. You might be able to muddle through if you don't leak more than, oh, about 10 ground troops, tops, for the whole game-- but you'll be behind the eight ball the whole run. So I'd say as a general strategy tip, to focus for now on making sure you kill all the ground troops. You can't really extend your maze-- it actually looks pretty good to me, nice and long. But I'd suggest: (a) Build the Rose Quartz closer to the center horizontally, and up at least a few rows. And seriously consider building a second one-- I usually have two by level 45, which covers the entire air enemy path for armor reduction. This isn't going to help you kill ground enemies, but it's super important. (b) An early-ish bloodstone (before, say, level 35) is very powerful and will mow down both ground and air enemies for quite a while. I see you have a perfect ruby and a flawless aquamarine in your screenshot, but no bloodstone-- if the game just didn't give you a perfect ruby until level 51, well, you had no choice, but otherwise, I think you would have done substantially better if you'd built a bloodstone near the center of the maze (and leave it unupgraded-- it's unupgraded "all enemy attack" is more powerful early game than the upgraded bloodstone) (c) Build at least one paraiba for armour reduction purposes, also very important. Hope this is helpful!

216 - 2022-06-03 2:02:39.289702

Make bloodstone for aoe dmg and ground wont be a problem. if its not enough paraiba near will help. And definitelly need Black Opal at wawe 44. Pay attention where you build towers, that EE and EG near c5 is not so usefull, missing some dmg near mid - stuns without dmg won't work well. You shouldnt leak anything in lvl 50 and before 44. What was life cost at this point?

f - 2022-06-02 21:38:57.497433

@WGW That's good to know. I was leaking ground troops. I think part of it is that I wasn't thinking critically about what I need for approaching levels or being intentional enough about where I construct gems. To clarify though, I shouldn't leak ground troops even in level 50? I'm on a better run than usual, but I still leaked 3 ground troops in level 50. Here's my layout immediately after that. I think this is working better than usual as I said, but I've at least been using a similar layout lately, so I'll post it anyway. https://ibb.co/b5MYWPn

WGW - 2022-06-02 17:48:28.038791

@f: It's hard to offer particularly helpful advice without seeing a layout-- could you post a screenshot? Are you leaking ground troops, or just flyers? Because you should really never be leaking any ground enemies in this game. If you are leaking ground enemies, then the problem is likely in the layout of your maze rather than in what towers you're building.

f - 2022-05-31 22:13:07.362658

@WGW Bummer... and here I thought it was fixed. Perhaps it's random luck, but I had several that were all blank and now several that aren't. I have a lot of trouble getting past level 60. It seems almost always start getting a lot of leaks in the levels immediately before this. Even if I gain a couple more good gems (like Egyptian Gold or Enchanted Emerald, even the damage booster (I forget its name--Black Opal?)) I just get too many leaks in level 60 and lose. Is there anything in particular I should be focusing on from level 40 to 60?

s - 2022-05-28 19:47:07.292785

now that i am reading my own commit i dont think i made my point clear but i meant it as like wgw and many other players have a voriety of games to play and plenty of people to talk to but i don�t have that option i am luky that i have the games that i have now and the very few people that apreat what i do for them and i do not know where to get the cords i need for my computer to start working then i would need the password till then i am stuck with what i got sorry for any confusion.

s - 2022-05-28 19:09:22.997221

and the creators already know about this problem and have got nothing from them as in comunication.

s - 2022-05-28 19:07:14.437915

i would take your advice but i am already doing that but there comit section either they can talk to me but i cant say a thing to them another example sometimes i can barly talk to a diffrent player or i cant type to anyone at all , so this is the most comunication i get in any game i play unfortunaly and there is one game i have found a way to make their cuerency wothless but i cant tell them because of the commit section.

WGW - 2022-05-28 17:13:54.518671

@f: Not so on the high score text bug-- I've posted two high scores this week, one ended up blank (just now), the other didn't. It's been an intermittent and (as far as I can tell) totally random bug since I first saw it happening-- and it still is. :( I had two runs going which would have broken my highest score, one of which I accidentally lost at level 460-- I really am a bit relieved, because I will not be happy if I play for two weeks to get a higher level score than before only for the text to end up blank. And at this point, it seems to be a total crapshoot whether the text shows up or not. @Bepis, great job getting to level 200 for the first time! I'm curious, if you see this comment, how long it took you playing GTD to get to this point? @s: Just my opinion-- not like I'm in charge of the comments or anything, just saying what I think-- I really think it's best for the comments here to be about GTD. I don't think this page was intended for general "community discussion". It's understandable if you start to find the discussion boring after a while since it's only about this one game-- there are really only two of us (me and @216) who have consistently been commenting here for years and years. When other people have had their fill of playing and/or discussing GTD, they just move on to other things. @216: There's a whole lot else I'd like to respond to from your recent comment, but for now I at least wanted to say what I forgot to say before: I'm pretty much blown away by your "one jade" challenge run. I'd never be able to do that without some sort of major change to my approach to the game. Really impressive. :)

s - 2022-05-25 22:26:59.093522

forget the last half of thhe previous commit because this is probably just ment for the game my bad.

s - 2022-05-25 21:56:00.178576

well dose any one else have any game problems that they curently know off? and wgw since 216 did not answer my question can you tell me if you know what was rong with the enemy on level 50 ,100 and etc . i would also like to talk about some thing else then just this game cause i pesonly think talking about one thing at all time is just geting boring i mean i do like to talk about stuff but if it�s just one thing i tend to lose intrest in it and i like diffrent views of diffrent things and that is just my pesonal thoughts. {this is not meant to affend any person} :)

f - 2022-05-24 17:19:02.887037

Well, score names appear to be working now

f - 2022-05-24 14:14:28.905902

@bepis Congrats! @216 Good to know. Thanks.

216 - 2022-05-24 12:49:29.156171

Combining on earliest placed gem of any type should prevent bug. If bug occur, 2 gems of clicked type is consumed instead earliest gem.

bepis - 2022-05-24 7:31:27.232300

Just hit my goal to get to level 200! First run with a great opal and I ended up getting TWO!! One question: I've noticed that sometimes when doing "Combine Special" the wrong gems get "consumed" to make the special gem. Is there any way to prevent this?

s - 2022-05-24 2:29:42.898720

well wgw and 216 did you figure out what was causing the enimes to move slower than they should just curious?

216 - 2022-05-23 2:10:04.513134

It's true that extra malachite can help in lvls 12/16, where i often fail (leak before 44 = reset usually). But i wouldn't waste 3 turns + good place for it, since its useless after (spitting kills -> ~same dmg as one malachite). 1-turn silver is not mistake at all. Becasue bug, slowing effect is minor, but still is. Accepting bad starts would make sense, but that case is a not clear for me: You made 2nd malachite intentionally form parts, then you got next chipped? it would be after 4 lvls at least, lvl 5 = chances upgraded twice - bad luck, but happens. But the thing i asking myself - what is reason to waste another 2 turns to finish 3rd malachite? (Getting 3x olny chipped seems too unlikely). I rather dont use repicks in early wawes - need max chances asap. Agree that stun RNG definitelly matters - in longer games it should average out, but still matter. If i got 2 leaks more (in 44 to 200) i would fail mine 1JC. I restart a lot, but after 20 it rarely happens. But i dont get any any EG untill 44 (~20 repicks possible) rather i do ( unless got GO or something). typically restart reasons: - no lvl 1 malachite (quick restart) - leak in 12/16 (rarely happens in other wawe) - forced chipped ( in lvl 2 often, rarely later) - many kills stolen from malachite (by not carrefully placed gem early) I often run 2 games untill lvl 20-40 in case of bad luck, restaring 5 times in row (becasue leak in 12, most often) is frustrating.

WGW - 2022-05-21 2:02:08.227198

I didn't phrase it very clearly, but I didn't mean that EGs aren't necessary until late game-- I just meant that I built MORE EGs than I needed to, when if I had built Jades instead, I wouldn't have lost that run at level 116. I think I'd built 7 or 8 EGs-- in my experience, the way I play GTD, I only really need 2 or 3 EGs early game, even without a great opal. But when I got the early GO, I figured, eh, what the heck, build a ton of EGs, I shouldn't need as many Jades with such an early GO. And usually that's true-- but that run, again, I had terrible RNG luck with respect to air troops getting stunned. I'm thinking now that one of the key differences in our experiences is your willingness to restart runs that aren't going well. I will restart runs many times before, say, level 10, if I'm getting really crappy picks, but beyond that point, I try to make it work. I almost NEVER quit a game after level 20. Whatever real challenge is left for me in GTD is in trying to make a stable run out of less than ideal starts. If I have what I think is a promising layout, but get hit with really bad RNG with respect to air troops not getting stunned and leaking excessively, I'll still keep playing trying to make it work, where you (probably a lot more sensibly) just say, "to hell with this" and restart. :) As for the malachites, I do find it helpful-- though definitely NOT necessary-- to have two, the primary one being on the left side. Very early game, having another malachite on the right side of the maze helps a lot with air troops. I never intentionally build more than two, and I never intentionally build ANY silver towers, but that run I lost at level 116, I had three malachites and a silver tower, simply because I got picks in very early levels of nothing but chipped gems and didn't have enough gold to repick. If you had the same pattern of picks, from what you've said, you would have just abandoned the game (probably the sensible thing to do), but I try to make it work, and I have had successful GTD runs with one or more low level gems in addition to the two malachites I actually WANT to build. It's not a "fatal" error to build more of those low level towers in the beginning of the game. It's not ideal strategy, it's not something I ever intentionally seek out, but the only two options when you get lousy picks early in the game when you can't afford repicks are (a) treat these as wasted turns but try to make the run anyway (which it can), or (b) just restart. :) But I would never argue that it's helpful, at all, to build more than two malachites, or to build ANY silver towers. I just won't automatically end a run because I'm forced into building a couple of these towers that I don't want. I think, also (though these runs all sort of blur together), that at least one of those unnecessary low level gems was a single turn gem, where the other two gems picked that turn were completely, totally useless. Like, I picked all three gems to make a silver tower, and the other two gems that pick were a chipped ruby and a chipped amethyst, which are REALLY useless. So I took the low level gem as the best of bad options. It's never helpful to build anything beyond two malachites in my experience. But I won't end a run just because the game forces an extra malachite or silver tower on me. I hope that makes sense!

216 - 2022-05-20 16:54:16.011278

@WGW: Mostly agree, need keep rocks (extented mid maze) to lvl 150, Which limits mid space much. So, olny most important gems (like GO) should be there + top dmg gems (EG, (A)BS, GAq). EGs within 100-110 range form crossroad can be considered as "mid", ABSs should be a bit closer (BS -very close). Too bad RNG early = restart for me. The thing i dont agree: EGs cant wait untill late game, the point is to have high dmg (much kill) mid EGs, then they outdamage any other gem, even ABS (uber dont count). Also late game is getting more stun-based. So if you dont build them untill late game, they arent really needed( ABSs may be better). Unless you meant only armor reduction EG, yes they can wait. First few close mid EG should be build before lvl 50. Jade gold gen. increase much around 60-80, so dont need hurry with jade as much. In fact, if you started to build jades 10-15 lvls eariel, you would not lose, because (IMO) jade gold generation is really too high. Probably you can just start builing only jades after lvl 50 and you never lose (if no ground leaks), but i think its not way that we should play (also you agree that its boring). Basicly i just trying to reduce leaks as much as possble. Meanwhile im doing quite succesfull One Jade Challenge, very early GO: https://imgur.com/AKAV0FR Leaking 10 in lvls 44-200 = 400 leaks. If 1 jade allows to buy 90 lives untill lvl 200, it would need 87 jades for 400, but having less dmg and more jades also increase lvl time, so probably less, which is possible to build. You didnt anwser about malachites, im just curious how you start with so much. :)

WGW - 2022-05-20 11:58:50.027676

@216: One more thing I should have pointed out is that maximizing attack power in the middle of the maze is something I can't do, even if I wanted to, because I'm always planning from the earliest levels for maximizing number of turns. This means I can't fill in the majority of the center of the maze because I will eventually need to remove the rocks that make the ground enemy path long enough to reliably kill them early on. I've experimented with this, and shortening the maze in the middle too early leads to leaked ground enemies, which you can't afford at all. The old Flash GTD had some elements, too, which meant that making the best moves short term would mess up your late game. Needing to maximize the number of turns you can make is something brand new to this version of GTD, and if you're playing with the goal in mind of getting the highest level high score possible, you can't fill in the middle of the maze without making the ground enemy path too short. The last screenshot I saw of your maze layout, quite a while back, the maze was good but wouldn't have allowed you to get anywhere near level 1200. Which isn't important to you, as you've stated, so of course you're going to look at my layout and wonder why I have so few attack gems in the center. :)

WGW - 2022-05-20 11:25:24.292241

@216: I wasn't really looking for a dissection of my playing style/strategy when I posted that video-- just wanted to see if you observed any differences in game performance, which you've said you haven't. Thanks for checking. Remember that there's RNG in this game beyond your luck in what gems you pick. There's RNG in the critical hits (not important), and in how enemies get stunned (very important). I had several levels that run where, even with a very strong layout (which is in no way different from COUNTLESS runs that I didn't lose), 7 or 8 air enemies were leaking. Sometimes as few as 4 enemies would escape, sometimes, 7 or 8. You can't withstand that level of leaking unless. . . You build a ton of Jades. We have different approaches (you like to concentrate attack power, where I like to have it spread across the map, e.g.), but neither is "wrong". Especially given my track record, I think my playing strategy is perfectly sound. I don't enjoy building a ton of jades, but guess what? It works. I have a run going now where I sailed past level 150 without a great opal, and with a layout essentially the same as that run I lost WITH a great opal. Because the stun pattern, due to RNG, was more favorable early on. All RNG factors become less important to the point of irrelevancy late in the game. But losing that run so early, with a great opal, wasn't due to anything but bad luck, which I could have insured against by building maybe 5 more jades (instead of EG towers-- those can wait till later game, if I end up needing them at all.) Again, it's fine that you wouldn't have played it that way, and that you see other ways to do well without resorting to building a lot of jades. But I'm 100% correct when I say that I would never have lost that run if I'd built 5 more jades in exchange for 5 of the Golds I built. But I appreciate your suggestions, which I'll think about for future runs. Right now, I'm most concerned with the high score text bug getting fixed, because it's utterly pointless to play long runs of GTD if I'm going to end up posting a blank text high score at the end. But I'm not expecting it to get fixed anytime soon. We haven't heard anything from Peter in quite a while (which, I always try to emphasize, is NOT a complaint-- this is a free game!) Cheers!

WGW - 2022-05-20 11:13:53.247882

@s: Stuff comes up in life that means answering comments on GTD isn't always top priority, you know? I'm really not trying to be a jerk in saying this, but your spelling and grammar makes it very hard to decipher what you're trying to say a lot of the time. And sometimes you post comments that have nothing at all to do with GTD-- like asking for help on Minecraft. And because every comment added here pushes all the existing comments down, off topic posts really make it more difficult for people to follow the conversation. None of this is meant to be insulting. But how you take my comment is up to you-- I'm simply trying to point out some things that you haven't considered.

WGW - 2022-05-20 11:09:35.308223

@f: I used to lose runs due to having inadvertently closed the window all the time. E.g., accidentally hitting the button to go back to the last page viewed. So now I make sure that that when I start to play, GTD is the FIRST page for the browser tab, which disables the "back" button. One less way to mess up. It would be very nice to have a save feature, but I don't think it would help with accidentally closing the browser. because the only way to implement a save feature that wouldn't ruin the game is that the saved game can only be loaded once. Otherwise, the game would allow save spamming to make it a brainless exercise in simply restoring your game until you get the picks you want. And if you can only load a saved game once, then accidentally closing the browser tab will still be fatal. Just have to be more careful! :)

s - 2022-05-19 2:41:54.714073

plus this is not the only one i rember being coversed be fore in fact i know i insulted wgw twice and apologized twice for a fact and complimented him twice and at the end of both arguments 216 gave the smae awnser both times now obvisioly the outher random players have not repeated there conversations.

f - 2022-05-18 20:44:54.330862

It was the farthest I had gotten too (which isn't very far; I think level 64, but things were going well.

f - 2022-05-18 20:44:00.203244

Just tried to select the window that I had GTD in and closed it instead. T_T It would be really nice to be able to save somehow.

216 - 2022-05-18 1:14:23.152605

@WGW: Looks like game runs identical for me. Why (and how?) you always have as much malachites? Also i wonder how you lost 56 lives in lvls 44, 48, (50?) 52, 56, 60, 64, 68, 72, 76 (avg 6.22 leak) with early GO. 4-5 leaks after - not as bad. Amount of jades wasnt biggest problem this run, there is lack of dmg in the mid zone. Wawes 44-96 are more dmg-based than stun-based. I can see only 2 EG in mid zone. Sometimes i get 2nd malachite and take it, becasue only chipped to choose, but getting 4 chipped special is pointless and unlikely... unless you build them in 3 turns ( incredible waste of moves). 3 paraibas 1 PAq at lvl 96 - rip 13 mo.. ok 1 paraiba may be needed, so 9 moves - you would make 3 extra EEs/EGs instead (or jades at least). Other possible moves lost (unless you got 1-turn): a) 2 BOs - 1 should be enough ( try to affect all EGs) b) 2 RCs - also 1 enough, at this point worth ingore some upper or lower part of path for 3 moves in most cases. c) strange located PO, but not sure how game looked like before. Good position of EEs (only quite few of them). But EG positions... looks like you try to range all path as fast as possible. but its not nessesary (in late game rather it is). No point to place EGs where is no stunners. Also your leftmost EGs dont range flyers after start of wawe - quite wasted potential dmg. Becsue early leaks cause life cost going to absurd values, need focus to reduce them, someimtes i was leaking 0 in 44 without GO (4EG + 2-3EG or 3 EE +3-4 EG may be enough, with towers like RC, BO, ofc). Just idea about blank scores, mb typing email adress cause bug? idk if you type it always.

WGW - 2022-05-17 21:10:14.469246

@F, thanks for the info. This is a pretty bad bug. . . completely deflates whatever insane desire I otherwise had to keep playing insanely long runs, if there's a very good chance the name text won't be recorded for totally unknown reasons. :(

f - 2022-05-17 21:03:25.098236

@WGW I typed names in all the time--no pasting--and ended up with blank names.

WGW - 2022-05-17 16:59:29.927112

@216: As requested, here's a video of my last run, levels 77 to 116, posted to YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwZKd71lrys Infuriating loss for a run where I got a great opal around level 53. I blame not building enough jades, and exceptionally bad luck with how the air enemies got stunned (or rather, how they didn't get stunned) in several levels. I'm very interested to hear from you whether you would have had the same degree of air troop leaks with comparable gem attack/stun power. Or whatever comparisons you can make against this video, re enemy movement speed or whatever. Meanwhile, I also posted the prior video to YouTube so I could remove it from my dropbox account, so on the low chance anyone wants to see it (a video to show how enemy movement is glitched late game), here the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JY4_SwWm68U The high score for the run I just lost did NOT end up with blank name text (level 116, "WGW Will this be blank?"-- it's there). So that's great, that my level 116 run has the text there, but my prior level ***1051*** game doesn't. (<--- sarcasm) It only took, oh, 8 or 9 days for the level 1051 high score. . . who would mind it ending up with blank text after only 8 or 9 days to get there? (<--- more sarcasm) My working theory at this point is, because I actually TYPED text into the name box last time (text ended up not blank), but last time I PASTED the text into the name box (text ended up blank), that maybe you have to type at least one character in. That is, you can still paste text (which you have to do if you want to use the letter R), but have have to also type at least one character too or the game doesn't recognize there's anything there. Or not. But it's at least something to test out in the future.

s - 2022-05-16 23:26:08.167032

now that i thought about it mayby i am think of the rong year posiably? and am able to screen record on my chrome book if you want a third veiw just saying . and comit 522560 was not intended to afend you 216 it was just a obsevation of you comiting rate as in general and i will say this again it was not to affend you.

s - 2022-05-16 20:57:42.113440

huh i know for sure i had this discusion before because wgw did not respond for two weeks and i know ive played this before or i am rembering it rong or it might of been a dream? and i dont meant to spam commits i honestly i some times submit comits before i think of every thing i might need to say that is just the way i am and i am preaty sure the same bugs was mentioned as well but i cant argue about something that was not there. and i think i know what you are talking about the path way that the enimes foolow from beging to end correct me if i am rong, and f i would of done the same honestly for my reasoning every game hase to end at some point?

f - 2022-05-16 16:15:47.607400

WGW, thanks for the comment. Unrelated to the no-stun levels, but probably related to display, the game basically seems to crash when certain monitor connection problems occur. I just had my monitors go black and had to fiddle with the cords to get them to display properly again. When I went back to the tab with GTD it was blank white and then displayed a little sad face in the upper left corner. It also doesn't run when it's not displayed on the screen, which I assume is intentional, but I found it odd.

WGW - 2022-05-16 3:28:51.546232

I will do an early game video soon, @216. Indeed it would settle the question of whether system specs affect game performance, if you compare against your PC. Cheers!

216 - 2022-05-16 1:28:49.839690

@WGW: Could you make similar video, but in lvl 50 or 100? (active focus) Reason is to compare speed of units, which would end discussion about how system spec affecting game. @s: 1. (almost) all comments from 2007-2020 possible to find in web archieve. 2. No, we dont repeat disccusion, since flash version was a bit different (and different bugs ofc). 3.I check comment page quite often, but i prefer to make longer comment than 4 in 1 day (to prevent spam) and sometiems im not in mood to explain what checkpoint is.. 4. Ok btw checkpoints - that 6 places in map where enemies need to come in correct order before they can leak (you cant place gem here). We call them c1 - c6 ussually. - - - - - btw Analizing 1050 video, not active focus give almost x5 slow, but speed of enemies seems correct(almost x5 slower, like fire rare of towers)

s - 2022-05-15 21:58:24.522560

ugh how am i such a fool soory but this is hard to understand for some people but this is just a repeat of what was said in 2018 this discusion has repeated its courseas people might say every heated discusion between me wgw and 216 is just a repeat even if we did not know it.

s - 2022-05-15 17:17:52.096349

and for further commits wating a respone for wgw if two days pass and there is no respone by him there is usally going to be no response and 216 response is usally once every month or so you can tell this because if you look at there commit response most people will be able to see the patern.

s - 2022-05-15 17:14:08.984327

sorry if the commit dose not make any sense.

s - 2022-05-15 17:12:36.645771

i know but i had nothing else to do and the video will be usefull to creator and �not trying to be rude� his team if there is one or random peopl that like to fix game problems,and people to show prof of glitchis in games like this, and mayby �this is my opinoin� mayby �the two bugs are some how conected , and if the creator is kind enough mayby there is some commit records from 2018 to 2017 there should be some records of us metoning or talking about the text glitch or whatever you want to call it and there might be some awnsers there if my memorie serves me right . wait mayby 216 was more right then he thought but this is just a theriory wait never mind because why would the game intentialy make a person lose unless there would not be many levels left or after a certain level something might hapen to the game?

WGW - 2022-05-15 0:12:56.394712

Video capture of levels 1050 & 1051 with glitched enemy movement: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ytijfbll7bu21yu/WGW%20GTD%20run%2C%202022-05-14%20level%201050%20%26%201051.mkv?dl=0 --------------------------------- (Warning: Ungodly long comment follows. . . ) I finally figured out a way to do video capture (not that it's difficult or anything, but I just never knew how to do it), so I thought this might be of some interest. . . to someone. Maybe. :) This is the run I just ended on purpose, last couple of levels (1050 & 1051) to show how glitched enemy movement becomes and just how slow the game gets. . . and also, sadly, to show the "blank high score" bug in action, which happened AGAIN. Note that even though level 1050 is a "no stun effect" level, I can keep the enemies frozen in place anyway just by keeping the browser window in active focus. You'll see me click off the window a couple of times to show what happens: When the browser window loses active focus, the game slows to a crawl (including the in-game timer), but the enemy movement "unglitches", meaning the enemies "unfreeze". Without doing this (making the window lose active focus), no enemies will ever escape. I even froze all 10 enemies in level 1050 when they were all *right* at the exit, just to show how you can freeze them pretty much anywhere at will. This starts happening, for me, around level 800. Most of these two levels are with the window NOT having focus, so that the enemies would (very, very slowly) actually escape and I could end the game. You can tell when the window has focus by the change in color of the title bar (top of screen): darker blue with focus (glitched movement), lighter blue without focus (slow speed but unglitched). There's a delay of a few seconds when you return the window focus before the game speeds back up to normal and the movement glitches out again. But when you click off the window to take away active focus, the game slows down *immediately*. Once again, I'm VERY sad to see that this run's high score text got blanked out. The score at level 1051 with no text was this run, and in this video you can SEE me typing in the text at the end. . . so here's the evidence it definitely wasn't anything I messed up! (The text was supposed to have been "WGW Could have gone higher. . . but sanity prevailed"). It's not exactly riveting video (no commentary, just video), but if you want to see what happens when you're insane enough to play the game this long, here you are. And it might be useful for Peter H. sometime, too, if this is something that can be fixed someday. I'll keep this video on Dropbox for a while, but since I only have a free account and very limited space, eventually I am going to have to remove the file. Enjoy (?) while the link's still good!

WGW - 2022-05-14 13:06:49.045206

My comment was pretty short, @s, I don't think it needed to be summarize. Besides, it's not "after 50th wave"-- that would mean stun effect is disabled for the whole game from level 51 on. Stun is disabled only once every 50 waves. Level 50, 100, 150, 200, etc.

s - 2022-05-14 2:36:12.000879

to put wgw comitt in shorter words after 50th wave stun abbilities is usless.

WGW - 2022-05-13 12:45:46.808469

It's unfortunately not documented anywhere but in the comments, but every 50th wave now disables all stun effects. It's just a way for the game to force enemy leaks.

f - 2022-05-11 21:41:14.105554

Okay... and now in level 51 they're stopping them just as they were before. Huh.

f - 2022-05-11 21:38:48.151872

Just went through level 50. I have 3 enchanted emeralds that the creeps go past several times. None of them stopped a single one of them even once. Usually they stop them many times. I think this was a glitch/bug

s - 2022-05-10 21:28:25.091457

i did not relize 216 comit from yesterday but i have no clue about what 216 is talking about there is no called�checkpoints� nor �arowns� on my screen but it might be my chrome book that is causing that mayby and i am typing to much soory for that.

s - 2022-05-10 21:24:27.045278

i should have mentioned it has to power at most 15 - 8 furnaces with no dificulites or very little difficulties

s - 2022-05-10 21:20:40.320969

i have a equasion that sombody could help me with and it is a diffrent game but i know the phisicks well like ive plaed it for years there is no right or rong answers as long as you can prove your work and gose along with the physicks and there is no point in trying to look it up because i have a old ish version of it and dose not have all the same physicks as the new versions . You have infinate materials for this equasion now since i said all the basicks you need for this equasion set by me so i gues i give the part that actualy needs solving oh i forgot to mention the game is mine craft ,redsone works the same as new versions and if you dont know there is two options for this 1 dont get involved in this conversation if you know nothingor very litle or dont want to play, or option 2 look up basicks of redston then goto more profesinal tutorials or machines your choice for the beter redstone players i would personaly recomend mumbo jumbo but rember we bont have the same physicks and you dont have to play the game all i want is just a basic idea on how twwo fix the problem and i will test the idea to make sure it works anyways back to the problem the is multipal fuel sources lava, wood items, leaves,wool coal, charcoal kelp ,and blaze rods.now the advantages and disadvanteges. Lava it lasts a long time but you can hold on to one times how many slot you have in your inventory the max amount is 36 slots, wood items infinate but takes a long time to harvest but you get four planks per log but it takes 1 1/2 to cook a item or you could make diffrent wood items but it gives less fuel time before it runs out,leave worse then wood items takes two iron to make shears to be able to harvest but you could put mending on it witch take xp to mend it if it has this inchant, char coal made from burning logs but it gives a beter burn time then wood items but would still have a colection problem ,coal it can cook 8 items t a time but it will runout in the begining world then you would have to go to the nether every time you run out and it will be more dangerious and there is only one mobe that drops it and it is usely not that much and they dont have a great spawn rate and usely spawn in one area , kelp first you have to be luky enough to be able to find it then you would be beter off building a auto harvester witch requires redstone and redstone knoledge of course and iron ,wood,glass as well depending on land scape tools to clear the area to make the proper space storage system wich requires wood and iron and a crafting table to convert the dried kelp into blocks. if you think i mised some thing or need to clear the phisicks or something i will do my best to help in that mater and this is to help me and outher players to become beter any help is welcomed even from wgw but if you dont want to help it is fineit is your choice no presaure at all.

216 - 2022-05-09 21:54:54.751188

@s: i think he meant checkpoints shape by "arrow" # ## #

s - 2022-05-09 21:42:41.771224

but if there is a diffrent game that dose not require to know about codeing and just playing the game i might be able to help with that.

s - 2022-05-09 21:15:04.839999

that is weried because no �arows� in any direction is showing up for me and to avoid any rude comits from or to me i am not going to help unless i am asked about this matter.

Jaxrud - 2022-05-09 14:11:08.885436

Noticed that the "arrows" that's the targets for the units in pathing, is not pointing the right way. All the ones on the top is pointing downwards. And the one on the right is pointing left. While the bottom one is pointing upwards. The old WC3 version was Down, Right, Up, Left, Down, Right. In the order of the unit path travel.

s - 2022-05-09 1:55:07.680868

well it is nice to know you but i probably wont be geting on in a few days untill a few months pass by so if i dont respond to any commits this week or next week that is why.

s - 2022-05-07 22:15:16.777177

oh i probably should mention to make the comit below this less creapy i don� live in a city, i think you live in or close to some deceantly wealthy area because you mentioned status, and i think people would mention that if they were a boss or higher of a busines or something.

s - 2022-05-07 21:59:33.072328

and you know more about me then you think you know.

s - 2022-05-07 21:58:57.421717

yes it was out of character for me i usually am nice even though how most people treat me and i just rmebered that we had a conversation some thing like we had on the fifth about 3-4 years ago or some thing like that and i personaly we know more about the people we dont like then our friends . and if you don mind could you help me get my thought more clear so people like you could understand me beter. and i probably should stick with what i do best help people that are new to games i know best.

WGW - 2022-05-07 3:35:28.750742

@s: I accept your apology, and for what it's worth considering I don't know anything about you, I already fully believed that the comment you left that I objected to was "out of character" for you, in that you've NEVER been nasty to anyone before in comments here. I just couldn't understand why you were lashing out at me-- but I'm old enough and have long enough to know that we know very little, too little, about other people's lives to think that we understand each other. I just simply am not willing to engage in further interaction with folks who attack me without provocation or apology, a position I maintain. But you've offered an apology, and I genuinely, sincerely appreciate that. I hope there are no remaining hard feelings on either side. I truly wish you well.

s - 2022-05-07 2:04:40.304673

i gues i just cant get all my personal thoughts clear or something it like i want to do some thing or i want to prove some thing to some one but no matter what most of the time i feel like i shouldent say any thing cause nno one would listen, or care about it, give dumb answers on purpose, lie , or critizies it what ever just forget about it.

s - 2022-05-06 21:25:30.547439

i gues i was thinking it was the same as reality or something and i am truely sorry :(

s - 2022-05-06 21:14:08.662809

the commit below this is mine i just mistyped the name and wgw i apologize for the harsh words.

1 - 2022-05-06 21:11:59.021453

first of all get use to it , it hapens to me every fucking day of every month of evey year constantly no mater what i do and i will admit i was very mad last night second of all you are probably right 216 i thought it was saving data but owell i am probably wro my bad . 3rd of all wgw did not make sense to me it is just our opinions sorry.

216 - 2022-05-06 13:07:03.116315

@s: Obvious bug... it could display only top 1000 scores to prevent any problems. Banning name text on 5th score = troll idea.

WGW - 2022-05-06 5:41:04.839337

You honestly have no idea what you're talking about and are making no sense, @s. But since you've now insulted me for absolutely no reason, I think this conversation has run its course. Believe what you want.

s - 2022-05-06 2:47:49.188851

and you are not thinkig about the big pictcher just for this game alone there could be about 1,000 people playing at any hour presumably even though we dont know about them the game will always know witch more players requires more space and if the programing has a set amount then those unknown players wont be able to play and no one would be the wiser then it would afect the main player adventualy till the game gets more memory or wiped clean and if there was no such programing this would be hapening weekly but is not can you expane even though it is very litle it all wasys adds up kno mater what if you can reduce the impact it would be beter for every one . and i know you are repeating because the exact same thing is hapening to me if you actualy looked you would know that and you are probably are thinking theye are diffrent but they are not even though you say they are it seems that they are.

s - 2022-05-06 2:34:55.721913

you know you a some times you think stupidly not every body has the best equipment at there disposel at any time at there wish in your text that is what you are asuming .

WGW - 2022-05-05 9:41:05.168377

Sorry, but there's no way whatsoever, no possibility at all, that the game is programmed to intentionally leave high score names blank to "save memory". It wouldn't make any sense-- text is TINY in terms of memory usage. Miniscule. We're talking about a few BYTES here. A game designer worrying about the memory usage of high score text would like a multi-billionaire worrying about dropping a penny. Besides which, I know that I absolutely wasn't repeating prior text in any of the high scores where the name ended up blank. Even further, I already do have 3 high scores posted that DO have the exact same text-- "WGW Double phooey" (the repeated text was a mistake on my part). Obviously, if the game was intentionally blanking out text if it's repeated, there wouldn't be three separate high scores from me that have the same text repeated. Not to mention the many, many, many scores from other folks who just post a name or their initials and which are repeated many times. No, something else is going on here. It's clearly a BUG, not something that Peter programmed into the game's code to "save memory".

s - 2022-05-04 2:30:38.414957

yes it will if and only if you type it at least 1 letter diffrent then any outher high scores you have then the text will be and im sure it is intentinal because imagain this a player played 500 or so times and all are a little difrent from each outher and same name the game would have to store each name in its memory bank and outher players are doing the same the memory bank would over fill and migh ruin the game in any way posiable to slow this down you would probably have the clusters of saved scores by same person in one file witch i think would take lees memory for outher players to be able to play with less trouble

WGW - 2022-05-03 3:29:54.351411

Next time I get a good high score run, I'm going to try using an alternate email address when I hit the "submit" button and see if that makes any difference. Not that it should make a difference, nor would it really prove anything no matter what the result is. But I'll try it!

WGW - 2022-05-03 3:24:14.851169

It's almost certainly true that many of the other blank text high scores were, like mine, due to the same glitch/bug, whatever it is. But until seeing it happen to my own high scores, repeatedly, I had no way of knowing whether the other scores with blank name text were due to this glitch/bug, or due to people simply not bothering to enter any text. As far as I'm aware, no one else has talked about it in the comments. But I'm sure you're right that many other high scores have blank name text for the same reason. Not such a big deal when you lose a game at level 40. . . much more of a bummer when you lose a game at level 700-something!!! :)

s - 2022-05-03 2:07:58.808309

oh then you shoud of said that was the problem because it&#347; the same for every one the first one that shows your name to a new name that is not yours every thing between is yours it is the same for everybody so the would be less codeing problems i thought you were talking about the stats for instint 754 to have it not the title it must be the same as the ones above and below it to not show the text.if you are still lost look at the botem of the score board there you will find the same thing with diffrent players.

WGW - 2022-05-02 5:26:00.605984

I mean that there's no TEXT for the high score of my last game under the "name" column-- the high score is there with no TEXT at all. This has happened to me four separate times now, high scores at levels 459, 500, 754, and 956, just look at the currently top 15 scores-- four of them have blank "name" text, all of them my own runs where I absolutely had text typed in when I pressed the "submit score" button. You play a game for 30, 50, 80 hours, and end up getting a line on the high score text WITHOUT YOUR NAME. That's not exactly gratifying! :)

s - 2022-05-02 0:55:10.532393

i donk�t know what you are talking about? because everything is there on my screen so it mighy be your device gliching out or something but it is all there.

WGW - 2022-05-01 8:42:07.727916

(I should have pointed out that the blank high score at level 956 is mine, too. . . major bummer, especially since I don't know how to avoid this problem in the future, whatever it is!)

WGW - 2022-05-01 8:39:16.568271

Grrrr. . . . just ended a no-great-opal run, voluntarily, at level 754, and again the high score text ended up being blank. I have no idea why this happens, but it's a MAJOR bummer to play a game for days and end up having the high score text blank. . . :(

s - 2022-05-01 2:41:16.265950

honestly i though it had more of a artitic meanig behind it then poetry but that is just me, and i personaly write the truth of what i see not what lies or what outhers tell me they see

Ebonyekinshade - 2022-04-30 18:42:54.571197

i merely speak when inspired by that which lies around me...also used to write alot of poetry when i was younger and more naive to the truths within the world around me....

WGW - 2022-04-30 0:26:14.750811

Very poetically stated, @Ebonyekinshade. Love your comment. :)

Ebonyekinshade - 2022-04-28 4:17:54.995093

a perfect game is like creating a exact painting of a moons light upon the reflected still pond....though many seek it few will ever truelly attain close to its beauty....all most can be content with is that which comes closest and wondering what it lacks when it truelly comes closest to perfection.....

pat - 2022-04-27 8:55:02.884338

there is a small bug that whenn you merge 3 gems to an enchanted emerald sometimes two perfect emeralds are consumed. Great game!

s - 2022-04-26 22:54:04.287180

true but any game will feal incompleat to one player no mater what that is why some player try new games at least i feel some people no mater of wealth or fame should try new games so outher can enjoy that game and that is why many game like to have feed back sorry if this is confusing.

Ebonyekinshade - 2022-04-25 5:44:52.181038

i played this game years ago and recently refound it earlier today, and lordy was a i struck with a dose of nostalgia and fun i havent had since the days of aol chat rping....while i always hope they will someday add more gem combinations to liven things up, overall i always feel this game is an 8/10....would be 9/10 but the growth curve might make it hard for those inexperienced with tower defence games yet is ideal of experience td gamers....would be 10/10 but it feels incomplete no matter how many times i play it...like looking at a polished gemstone but not knowing whats lacking to make it perfect in function and form....

s - 2022-04-07 23:53:53.166816

now i see what a sand box might be good for like to see what combinations of gems to get the things that is on the list in play mode is good and to figure posiable stratiges or some thing and unfortinatly i still need help to figure some thing out in minecraft if anybody is willing to help

s - 2022-04-06 2:24:22.401998

i agree that this game is kind of like a fidgit spiner but adventualy any game would become boring after a person has been playing after a while but for mee it keeps me itnteristed reading outhers comits to atempt to see their ideas of games and how they like it to be changed or not and i personaly have much more to do on a daily bases and i personaly perfer to listen to music that i know i like especicaly after a anoying day.

WGW - 2022-04-04 11:40:48.107836

I've been trying to understand why, for more than a decade now, i keep playing GTD, even though figuring out a working strategy means that the game holds no surprises anymore. It's not like GTD is viscerally thrilling to play. Other than the pride involved in posting high scores (however dubious that pride may be), it's not as if I have actual "fun" playing it. So I've come to the conclusion that for my particular set of mental quirks, GTD has become a sort of a digital fidget spinner for me. I'm basically always on the PC when I'm awake, so I basically always have a GTD run going, requiring attention only every few minutes. It's like an interactive aquarium of sorts, where you get to post a high score at the end. :) My mind drifts when (especially when I'm watching TV), and GTD adds JUST the right amount of calming background "noise" for me. So I'm probably going to keep playing regardless of whether the game is updated again, cause it's oddly soothing to me. Even if GTD never changes, and thus can never really become "interesting" to me again. But the thing is. . . the core of the game is so good, I'd really love to see the game re-jiggered in any of a million different ways, some I've suggested, some others have suggested (@216 and @s, e.g.), or whatever ideas Peter Holko may have in mind (just. . . don't ONLY nerf jades, it doesn't help ANYTHING! But I've said that a million times by now, haven't I?) I believe GTD can evolve from the game it's been all these years, a great game to be sure, but one that can be "figured out" to reliably achieve a definable "win state", and at that point it becomes dull. There are so many possible changes that could make this a game that's enduringly ENGAGING TO PLAY in survival mode. (If Peter finds has time/interest to do it.) But even if not, I'll continue to enjoy my digital fidget spinner. And I still contend that survival mode GTD remains a very, very hard game for newcomers-- steep learning curve.

RGEN - 2022-04-02 22:00:50.715006

The Letter R is now typing. Awesome.

s - 2022-04-02 14:37:46.153032

you might of been thinking of something else than the game and did not realize you were losing lives for the text i don�t know

WGW - 2022-04-02 9:00:51.013463

The blank text high score at level 956 is mine. . . not sure why I ended up losing, nor why I ended up posting a blank text high score (I had actual text typed in), but I'm actually kind of grateful to have lost at this point, cause it would have taken days more to get to the highest possible level (in that run, at least 1200).

s - 2022-04-02 2:57:32.060239

i don�t know what happened at the last commit but there is some keys i did not type?

s - 2022-04-02 2:55:32.449693

i just had a odd thought what instedad of making gold more rayer why not use it to upgrade the gems individualy or atleast acertain amount of gems because if you make it more rayer adventualy you would have the same problem of too muh gold and i am talking as if there is no end to this game because i clearly dont know if there is the thing i propse i think would set the problem of too much money further back than making it more rayer or you could oboth and mayby never have it again? at leas that is my oppinoin and thought�s. :)

s - 2022-03-25 2:35:06.389977

oh and if there is aperson that is actualy good at mine craft red stone and mobspawner stuf i nee your help.

s - 2022-03-22 22:37:08.905711

i know but you can do the same thing in play mode and wgw there is more to fynal fyntensay then i told you already. :)

WGW - 2022-03-22 20:40:04.150570

Sandbox mode is only intended for experimentation and testing purposes. It's not meant to be a "play" mode. :)

s - 2022-03-20 16:51:00.337276

i dis agree i don think this game needs to be rewned and it shound not be for lots of money, a san box is pointless because allyou are doing placing toweres and making gold for something that is not going to be on any score record so why would you want it at all. it may work bu i think it is pointless.

thank you 216 - 2022-03-20 15:59:10.368098

thank you 216

216 - 2022-03-20 14:26:17.201284

For me sandbox (0.6.0) works http://45.55.255.26:10001/

tell me why - 2022-03-20 13:29:52.440380

why the sandbox mode is removed?

dollars - 2022-03-20 12:29:13.806118

this game should be renewed and you could be rich as fk

s - 2022-03-20 1:58:18.929202

sory wgw i shoud of put it in better words like what i ment is the area of the batle field is kind like a chest board but there are obstacles and the people you chouse to fight on your side dose not work like chess pices

s - 2022-03-19 2:39:11.266131

i am no a great chess player as well it just requires a lot of stratigy and dont wory you can take as long as you want for breaks even in a battle and i know a few stratiges in a few places to get a lot of job points wich is impotant to give your characters new skils, and each character has to get their own job points.

s - 2022-03-19 2:22:14.322487

and the last one is up for you to decide and i will help you for any further question for this game if you have any and i the last comit is brief as i am going to get .

s - 2022-03-19 2:19:37.778393

no it dose not you only need 5 people for reguler batels 4 to progres through the chapters and maby 3 at the very end i am on chapter 2 fyi and the are people though out the story the first betrayel batel is in chapter 1 the second is basicaly in the beging progresion of chapter 2 and once a guy of yors is down you have 3 turns to resurect people wich a priest or chemist can help you there is three diffrent types of magic ,white black ,time , and you can have people with atributes that the class they are on for example you can have a wizzerd witch uses black or magic with chackra wich is under the catogor of monk and since it sound like you dont know much of the game i can help you get the basicks of characters you want immidetly witch you can change throught the game , start with priest or chemist they are kind of the same but chemist uses healin items in your inventory priest has about the same radious but i think requires more points to get every thing, you also want a monk because he has a ability to heal when he moves , a knight because he can reduce enemy damig by breaking there weapon stat and you can see you weapon thig in formation wich gose for every character and pay atation to faith and bravery wich is also for each individual person and can also find in formation, archer because they have a beter attaking radious to kill enemy�s at a distance

WGW - 2022-03-18 14:54:27.168246

@S: I'll check out final fantasy tactics-- sounds interesting. Thanks for the recommendation. Though truth be told, to my everlasting shame, I'm a pretty terrible chess player, and not through lack of trying. So if it calls for the same sort of game skills, I'll probably be pretty awful at it!

WGW - 2022-03-18 14:34:14.335986

"the original 8 pass " That should have been "7 pass", not 8. Always with the typos.

WGW - 2022-03-18 14:31:13.952164

Re: leaking enemies on normal levels late game, it's a combination of a few things: (1) EEs won't stun forever no matter how many you build (and besides, I wasn't trying to build endless EEs, I was trying to build as few towers other than paraibas as possible) (2) As the enemy hitpoints keep going up, and it takes longer to kill them even while their stun-locked, this leads to other enemies not being targetted by the EEs that are already stun-locking something else. E.g. (making up hypothetical numbers), if it takes only a few seconds to kill a stun-locked enemy, then multiple enemies are going to get stun-locked by the same EEs on the pass through the maze. If it takes 45 seconds to kill a stun-locked enemy, then every other enemy will pass right by all the EEs targetting the first one. The most number of maze passes you can force ground troops to take in GTD is 7-- there are 10 enemies. Slower kills means more enemies advancing past areas where an enemy is getting (very slowly) killed. (3) My end game maze is not just substantially shorter than what I start with (as @216 suggested), but also the path modified so that what started out as a 7 pass maze is essentially a ONE pass maze at the end, all for the sake of maximizing space. (4) Building only paraibas, while necessary to maximize how many turns you can make before running out of space, is not in any other way a good strategy. :) You ONLY do this to maximize turns, not because it's good play. I'd imagine (though have no plans on testing it) that if I kept the original 8 pass maze layout and built lots more EEs and EGs, rather than literally nothing but paraibas for 800 levels, that no enemies would be escaping late game.

WGW - 2022-03-18 14:30:38.884413

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, I'm not really clear on where the challenge lies in "no rocks after level 300" when your maze is already completely laid out with actual gems. . . ? The rocks don't do anything but to control ground troop movement, and you've already accomplished that goal. How would additional rocks help at that point? I must be missing something.

mikis - 2022-03-18 13:05:47.352916

I decided to challenge myself and play with no rocks after 300 lvl. Notice the Malachites - in the early game I tried to not upgrade chances up until a point when I really had to https://i.gyazo.com/59fb8e068e45e3ee27875fe9e143e742.png

216 - 2022-03-18 12:38:21.542402

I didnt have patience for lvl 1000, but shortening maze -> possible ground leaks, but... just make less EEs, keep 1 air leak for lose

mikis - 2022-03-18 12:25:07.878315

I have a question for people who get to 1000 level or so - how do you actually lose not on a stun-proof level? Whenever I get over 300 level and get bored, I just turn of the game bc I don't want to wait for the stun-proof level to lose lives.

s - 2022-03-18 2:02:30.258584

besides we all make mistakes just like some times i want to do something then forget about it it dose not mean i don�t care it just means i forgot about it and short aning it might make it beater but then again it might make it worse we don�t know yet there is multipul ways for this game to go but their is only one truley good way , and wgw i think ther is a game you should try out it is called final fantasy tactics in a it is like chess but there is diffrent abilitys and weapons you can use and their is diffrent jobs i mean like preast ,geomancer, knight,etc

s - 2022-03-17 22:15:44.650533

their is no need to thank me if you was not here the game would probably would be at a worse state of function , and i was wounder ing if it is posiable to get like the beater players some help full advice in the instruction tab if they are willing for newer players just to give them a hand in a succesfull run.

WGW - 2022-03-17 6:03:35.521771

@S, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to ignore your earlier comment, and I really appreciate your very kind words. I guess I was just wrapped up in the discussion of GTD's game mechanics and how to change them! :) Thanks for the support-- I just want to see people think a little more creatively about the game than has generally been the case in this discussion. I'm all for shortening the game, but let's also, maybe, try to at least think about how to make it a better game, too!

s - 2022-03-16 2:25:10.115282

i'de like to thank wgw because this hase been the most discusion with people with a actual head and not for talking about nonsense and bs that dosent even mater im not saying this really maters but it is beter the nonsense i hear all day , for instence makeup people can live with it or without it dont mater and cloths that also dosent matter, and wgw makes sense of what could happen if a certain thing could happen good or bad and helps people understand him or at least he tries .

s - 2022-03-16 2:16:47.411246

mikis for one you dont need a pc to play this game if you did not know, how i play dose not require leaving it on , wgw i did read the comit but i though you were talking about some thing else and in commit 460657 ide like to see you go with option 1 personly ide think it would make the game less boring honestly , commit 524268 i completly agree with you i take it as if you take something from a game you must give the game some thing else to balance the game and just so you know wgw ide also read your commit but your commit 203502 looks like you completly ignored my commit 008854 wich i was trying to say i don&#776;t know how to phrase this but i was trying to say that you are smart even when you don&#769;t know it at the moment at least

WGW - 2022-03-15 23:18:30.256906

Really no need for any apology, @mikis, but I appreciate your offering one! I totally agree that's it's crazy for it to even be possible to play the game out until there are literally no more spaces left. Who wants to do that? Not even me. :) I just think that there are so many more interesting ways to change the game to prevent survival mode from going on forever rather than just tweaking a couple of stats to (a) force more enemy leaks (by nerfing EEs) and (b) overly restrict your ability to work around bad luck (by nerfing jade's gold earnings.) It is certainly true that nerfing jaes and EEs will severely limit how high a level you can play GTD to (which in itself is a good thing), but I don't think it will make the game even one teeny tiny bit more interesting to play-- instead, the same old boring runs will just END a lot sooner. But they'll still be boring runs to play. Just throwing out another idea (I've got a dozen of them), it might be interesting if the number of enemy troops increases periodically, maybe every 50 levels-- and then we can also get rid of the kinda silly "no stun" levels. No matter how many EEs you have on the board, if there are an ever-increasing number of enemies marching around rather than always 10, an increasing number are going to end up escaping no matter what you do. What I'd really like to see is a version of survival mode where it becomes increasing difficult to get to a higher level, but without creating a sort of "gate" where basically every run, at its best, is going to end on the same level (e.g., in the Flash version, it was close to impossible to ever get past level 196, and doing so meant using a very specific "emerald strategy" that required really amazing luck-- but which also nearly always ended up with your losing runs well BEFORE level 196). Unless there's some wiggle room to always do just a little better in your next run, there's not much motivation to keep playing once you've figured the game out. And it would lead to everyone who has a good idea how to play GTD getting to the same level.

mikis - 2022-03-15 20:56:37.124615

@WGW Sorry for not replying to you directly. In short: yes, I think that the game should end at about 150-200 lvl, that's why I mentioned nerfing jades and emeralds. I think that much more people would be enjoying the game if it didn't require leaving your PC on for days. Moreover, what I usually find appealing in tower defense games is creating new mazes etc - right now it's not about the mazes anymore... That's why I would prefer to make the game more challenging and virtually impossible to get to a point where you have no more place for the gems

WGW - 2022-03-15 14:41:09.203502

Glad to know at least you read the comments, @216. :) You actually mentioned the main reason why I hated the ultra-nerfed jades version 0.61-- the fact that if you got lucky enough to get a great opal, you could still go on forever, but without one, you'd almost always lose by level 100. That's just way too much of an effect on how well you can do that's dependent on the pure luck factor of whether you get a great opal. I'm more okay with a survival mode that's designed to be impossible to beat past level X (say, 200) even WITH a great opal, than one where you're either stopped at level 100 without a GO, or can go to level 1,400 with a GO. It was exactly the "roll a 6 and you win, but it'll take you HOURS of playing to find out if you roll a six" problem, for a great opal to mean the difference between getting to level 100 or level 1,000. But even if v0.61 were rebalanced so that great opals weren't so completely all-critical and so drastic in effect, I still think there a million more interesting possibilities for changing the game than this never-ending debate of "to nerf or not to nerf" the jades. I mean, anyone should feel free to tell me why any of my ideas for changing the game are a mistake, but that's not really my point in the suggestions. My point is to demonstrate that making GTD a genuinely more interesting game would require thinking a lot more outside of the box than just deciding a gem needs to be nerfed. I think you and I, at least, agree on that!

216 - 2022-03-15 13:45:19.896533

Ofc jade nerf is not enough to balance game. Cutting stun by HALF is extremelly much, 10-20% is already much... but i had better idea: late wawes have PARTIAL stun resistance. it can reduce chance or duration of stuns( . I dont think stuns are too long before lvl 200 In fact i liked more 6.1 than current verion, i was ok with losing near 100, but with GO i got stable run. Dont worry WGW i read your comments (few times sometimes to undestand).

WGW - 2022-03-15 13:34:16.229928

Just to be clearer, cause I don't think I explained this well: by "decouple gold from lives", I meant that you would not be able to buy lives with gold anymore, at all. Gold would only buy repicks (with jades earning much, MUCH less gold than they do now), and you'd only be able to earn lives via a low-chance event from one of the special towers that's completely useless now, like the sapphire. The life-earning tower could be set to do no enemy damage, adding in the first purely "defensive" tower type to the game. This would force you to consider how much space to trade off between attack towers and no-damage towers that earn lives back. Does anyone out there see what I'm getting at? Anyone? :)

WGW - 2022-03-15 13:14:28.460657

My current thinking on an interesting way to change the game would be: (1) Decouple gold from lives. Part of what makes balance GTS as it stands so impossible is that gold serves two purposes, to allow for repicks and to buy lives. So. . . (2) Make jades work like they used to in the old flash GTD (earning way less gold, but enough to afford reasonable amounts of repicking) (3) Remove the cap of 50 lives maximum, and make one of the useless special towers (e.g., the sapphire) have a low chance of earning lives. This would add an interesting new mechanic (building towers to earn lives), while also addressing the issue that most of the special towers are completely useless-- at least we'd have one more tower to play around with. I'll spare everyone a long explanation, but I think if anyone interested gives this a little thought, you'll at least see the possibilities for much more interesting ways to change the game than just "let's make it artificially harder and more dependent on luck" (which is what nerfing both jades and EEs without changing anything else would do.)

WGW - 2022-03-15 12:46:02.524268

Side note, but I don't understand how nerfing jades and EEs in any way makes the game "more playable"-- it will make it a lot "harder", which is kinda the opposite of "more playable", isn't it? If nothing else in the game is changed but to nerf jades AND EE's, it'll be a near-miracle to ever get past level 150. If that's the goal of the suggestion, fine, but that's not what I'd consider "more playable"-- "You'll almost always lose by level 150-- GTD's now more playable than ever!" :)

WGW - 2022-03-15 12:36:51.906144

Everyone's entitled to their own opinions, of course, but it does feel as if you've ignored absolutely everything I tried to say below, or didn't read it. Which is fine, really, but I tried to lay out actual lines of reasoning-- particularly with respect to why simply nerfing jades is a bad idea. Nerfing the jades AND the enchanted emeralds would be even worse. . . . We had a version of the game where basically everything else was the same except jades were heavily nerfed, v0.61). I personally hated it. There are a million other ways to change the game. You've suggested the exactly one way I tried to argue at length is the only way the game should NOT be changed, but offered no reason for disagreeing. Totally fine, but doesn't lave much room for further discussion. Which also is fine. . . If you just want to state an opinion. But for what it's worth, I'd personally be very interested in reading the thoughts of anyone who wants to take the time to try actually show me why I'm wrong.

mikis - 2022-03-15 10:15:03.572794

What I think this game needs right now is proper nerfing of two gems: Enchanted Emerald and Lucky Asian Jade. Cut the damage and stun time of the EE in half and the chance to get the gold bonus of the LAJ as well, and the game will be much more playable.

s - 2022-03-14 2:58:42.008584

after reading real closly reading wgw&#347; commits 2022-03-14 0:52 and 2022-03-14 1:15:08 combind the section of text i cand imagine this game with a size upgrad and mob degrade to make the game more fun and added bose if it hapens. i de wanted to add the senteces ime talking about butyou have to read his comits haha.

WGW - 2022-03-14 1:15:08.740304

I don't think I remembered to post a screenshot of my last run which is the current high score, at level 1154: https://imgur.com/a/2aT4HMb And let me tell you, it was no fun at ALL after the first few hours. And it took more than two (real time) WEEKS. Getting past the last 100 levels alone took about 4 days, the game gets so slow. So yeah, I never want to have to do that again, and I'm all for changing the game so that what feels like a "win" state doesn't require your having some sort of mental disorder to pursue it. ;) But I would really hate to see the game changed to simply make bad RNG end otherwise good runs. (Oh, and I'm sorry for the length of the prior comment, which maybe two people will ever read. But if you can believe it, I actually had a lot more to say. . . that was me trying to be BRIEF. Sigh.)

WGW - 2022-03-14 0:52:09.100335

I think folks have to bear in mind that if you've already put in many hours into playing a "winnable" game to learn how to win it, that doesn't mean the game is easy in any objective sense-- it means it's consistently "winnable" for experienced players using sound strategies. If it takes 20 hours of playing a game to get good enough at it to nearly always win, that doesn't mean the game is "easy". A great comparison is, I think, to the game I've played the most over the years second only to GTD-- FTL (Faster Than Light). FTL has a VERY strong RNG elements, much more so than GTD, and which to new players, feels "unfair" in that they think the game is constantly throwing them into no-win scenarios. But if you stick with it long enough, you begin to learn that there's almost never really a "no win" scenario in FTL (at least at easy and normal difficulty levels), you just didn't know the game mechanics well enough. But the RNG element in FTL is used more to vary the SCENARIOS the player faces, which call for very different responses, than to turn the game into an elaborate dice toss (roll a six and you win! Only it'll take you two hours of gameplay to find out whether you rolled that six! Yay! Fun!) FTL is also game that's several orders of magnitude more complex than GTD in its game mechanics. There just isn't any simple tweaking that would make GTD "harder" for experienced players who understand the game mechnics well, without simply bumping up the importance of RNG so that simple bad luck itself will ruin runs that you've already invested hours of playing into. (YAY! Fun!) Just figuring out a good maze layout is a challenge for a new player. Understanding all the different gems and how to use them in concert with each other and how many of each to build is a challenge. Striking a balance (early game at least) between saving gold for leaked enemies and using it for repicks is a challenge. It's not so much of a challenge when you've already learned all this stuff-- that doesn't make it "easy". :) Even for me, after playing GTD for well over ten years, my latest high scores required a hell of a lot of planning and forethought to maximize for available spaces to move. Maze layout wasn't about efficient kills but about not wasting board space, and I had to limit as much as I possibly could building any towers other than paraibas when the game would have gone SO MUCH FASTER if I could've just built the towers I really wanted to build. (I could only start to go after building paraibas exclusively after playing 200 levels in preparation for it, otherwise I sure as heck would have built a lot more egyptian golds than just 9 or 10 for the whole game! Playing this way turned a lot of the most basic strategies for playing GTD upside down.) But yeah, for anyone who's played hours of this game over years of their lives, nothing has changed so much that you can't pretty "easily" get a stable run going where, say, after level 200 you know you pretty much can't possibly lose. That's how GTD has always played. Just bear in mind how many hours os playing and how much learning was required to get to that level of understanding the game. I'm in favor of potential changes to the game in any manner EXCEPT to simply make RNG override player control. E.g., if folks prefer a survival mode GTD that doesn't just go on indefinitely until you just run out of space on the board for more moves (or, more likely and much earlier, you run out of patience/sanity to keep playing), then a more fundamental change has to made to the game than just "nerf the jades", or "increase the damage done by certain gems". As an example, imagine GTD basically as it is, but where you're given a finite number of lives at the start of the game (50?) and can't buy more. Ever. Gold is used only for repicking purposes. This would mean the game is always going end when X number of enemies has leaked, no matter how good your maze/layout is, no matter how much gold you're earning. Especially if the "no stuns" are still part of the game, 50 lives isn't going to last you all that long, certainly it won't get you to level 1,000. This could create a survival mode where with the right stats/formulas in the game design, even the best players using the best strategies could have a lot more difficulty getting to level 100, and where, say, getting past level 200 is close-to, but not entirely, impossible. But that would be a FUNDAMENTAL change in game mechanics (and of course this is just one of many possibilities). GTD has only been tweaked, not fundamentally changed, over the years. And it's always been a game where good playing with good strategy nearly always "wins" the game. I'm all for changing the game so that losing at level 200 feels like "I won!", rather than having to play for TWO WEEKS and fill the entire damned board to get the highest score possible! :)

Phaedraz - 2022-03-13 16:55:05.613061

Thanks @216, makes perfect sense, I hadn't even considered running out of space yet :) I guess I'll have to rethink if I want to try pushing further, but agree, the game is too easy at the moment.

216 - 2022-03-13 12:41:05.914154

There is theoretical max lvl, 334x4 + 5 = 1341 (unless you find way how to put 342th gem). Only reason of using paraibas is slower filling map. EEs always have been a key gems, but current vaerion is way too easy, so only end game is out of space, if you dont fail early.

Phaedraz - 2022-03-13 10:42:29.824871

First time I've ever checked comments after playing this off and on for years. Interesting to see the mazes you're using. I'm going to have to quit this soon as I have no option but to reboot my PC today, but is there any (end game) reason you're going for Paraiba's over stunning? I'm only at 354 currently, but feel like this could possibly go indefinitely https://imgur.com/a/TiXnhF2 as no ground units get past point 3 and flying waves I'm only letting 1 through. The longer I go, the more Emeralds I can add, which in theory should make all waves (apart from the stun immune ones) easy. I'm getting stupid amounts of gold and can repick endlessly to get more emeralds, but is there a theoretical max level achievable? The only drawback of using emeralds is that it seems VERY slow compared to the scores/times others have posted. I'll have another go at some point when I get time.

s - 2022-03-12 5:11:08.799226

sorry i for got jade is not a regular gem i was thinkig of some thing else , and jad in line 3 is supposed to say yello and one of my commits wa deleated after i posted or i am just bumb today

s - 2022-03-12 4:59:40.788893

their is a commit glich in my commit before this one and in wgw two commits and it seems like it is in 216 commit and the jade gems need to be up graded as well because a mid level yello gem is worse the a level 2 jade

216 - 2022-03-11 13:06:39.514153

https://imgur.com/BQC9tR7 Possible to get a bit longer maze with same amount space by moving some gems by 0.5 One more to clarify: 4-combine is not "combine special", its regular combine. The chance of getting specyfic Perfect gem is over 7% every pick ( including combination), in normal (late game) gameplay there is no problem with Perfect gems. If you build 300 paraibas (no exploiting) at lvl 1200+, then need about 2800 repicks, which should be possible with current (5%) jades. Good advangate of exploit is fact that no need to store many Perfect gems on the board, like i was taking every sigle PE in flash. I hope now more ppl agree that jades need to be nerfed, but its only one of thing to balance. But i dont think that is possible to balance this game to be able to overcome bad RNG always, just need accept that.

WGW - 2022-03-11 4:51:37.004545

@216: I hope you do post a screenshot at some point of a "maximum space" end game layout-- I'm very interested in seeing your take. In the meantime, I'll just say: (a) Thanks for clarifying that there's no relationship between the two "combine special" bugs. (b) You might find that if you play GTD intentionally exploiting the "combine special out of order" bug (the bug allowing you to never consume a perfect gem), that it has a lot more impact on the game than it might seem otherwise. Especially in early levels (25 to 60). It is true, though, that in any sustainable run you'll eventually have enough spare gold to repick endlessly, which makes getting needed perfect gems is more a matter of tediously picking and repicking and repicking until you get what you need, rather than strategy (in the sense that you would still be able to pick as many perfects as you need-- very tediously.) So I'm torn on this-- on one hand, fixing the "combine special out of order" bug will make the early levels more challenging (speaking as a player who has been exploiting this bug shamelessly), but it would also make the UNBELIEVABLY tedious late levels even more unbelievably tedious if you did need to pick a perfect gem for each special tower. The "combine special 4x merge" bug, though-- that just needs to get FIXED, no debate about it. You've already pointed out here exactly what part of the game code needs to be changed-- one line! Meanwhile, until it's fixed, we can forget about anyone getting an uberstone ever again.

WGW - 2022-03-11 4:47:19.315957

@mikis: Thanks! I don't know if the right word for what I've got is "patience", so much as "obsessiveness". :) Better "balancing" a game like this might not be possible without a some kind of complete overhaul. There are plenty of numbers/formulas that can be easily tweaked one way or another, but whatever the changes, some of us will probably hate them and others love them. If the game mechanics allow for overcoming bad RNG (as it does now), then there are going to be strategies that nearly always work and which, as a result, will become mind-numbingly boring runs fairly early on. It's a legitimate problem. But if you can't overcome bad RNG, you might as well sit on the floor and spin a dreidel as play GTD, if (really) good luck is about all that's required to do well. It may not be a solveable problem at all, but almost certainly not by simply tweaking a stat/formula or two up or down. Just my take.

s - 2022-03-11 3:36:21.234025

and i&#769;ve plaed before the new gliches hapened and the special were point less no mater what i did it was the same ending every time i tried them that is why i said get rid of some of them

s - 2022-03-11 3:33:09.632250

so like add a boss for every 100 levels that gets harder every time you face him

mikis - 2022-03-10 9:47:02.170033

basically, I think it should be a real challenge to get to 100 lvl

mikis - 2022-03-10 9:44:39.219388

i think what this game really needs right now is to balance all the special gems to make them more useful in the late game. As for now, there's only a few special gems that work. Moreover, maybe cutting the stun time in half would be a good idea? at this point, when you know how to start properly, the game just goes on and on and about the lvl100 I start to lose interest and often just shut it down. That being said, I admire WGW and other guys who have the patience to go over 200 levels

s - 2022-03-09 23:06:06.334327

I wonder if is posiable for this game could take out the some of the special tower that do not do that much or curently buged for some reason and make kind of like a small inevetory system that only holds the most basic gems or to get rid of towers and gems it is just food for thought

216 - 2022-03-07 23:45:45.113436

No doubt, combine special is definitelly bugged, but i dont agree it as important as you think. In fact, that bug helps, expecially with bad RNG, but it don't change entire game. There are aslo negative aspects, for example ,when i take too many flawed part early, its harder to remove them. I hate situation, where i could build well placed BO, but it would consume both mine POs. I often use this bug, but not always. Also amount EE created by this bug is often similar to amount PE ingored. Its NOT related to 4-merge bug, which can be fixed by changing 1 number in code. I will upload sceen later, i made this "maze" using mine wawe 196 sim that i have on laptop (idk if you even know about that, since you werent active in comment in 2020). Ofc it have short ground path, it would casuse too much ground leaks probably, its for theoretical purposes now. Actualy i made 2 different layouts with 341, 342 might be possible, not sure.

WGW - 2022-03-06 0:58:58.389956

@216: One more thing. . . (Doing my best Peter Falk impression-- you may not get that reference in Poland!) I wanted to ask you-- how do you feel about the way "combine special" works now, with respect to the fact that as the game stands now, you only ever need to get one single perfect gem of any type, and can keep building special towers off of that one perfect forever without consuming it? I doubt this was intentional on Peter's part-- and from your prior comments, I'm guessing the programming logic for "combine special" that causes the game to allow you to never consume a perfect gem is related to the outright bug you've written about which makes combining four identical gems NOT produce a 2x upgrade as it should. They could be unrelated, too. But as for never needing to draw more than one perfect gem of any type. . . I just can't believe that this was an intentional design. We've gone back forth as to how much gold jades should earn for ideal game balance, but if there's any single element of the current version of GTD that, imo, makes it far too easy compared to the Flash version, it's the fact that you only need to ever get one perfect gem of any type for each entire game now. If you agree that this is a bug rather an intentional game design change, would you also agree that this is much more important to change in a future version of GTD than rebalancing any other element? If Peter meant the game to operate this way, that's one thing, but if not, this "bug" (if it's a bug) truly and deeply and fundamentally changes the entire game. I'm interested in your thoughts on this.

WGW - 2022-03-06 0:41:50.699949

@216: Interesting-- you squeezed in a bunch more blocks than I was expecting. Are you able to post a screenshot? I'm interested in what the layout looked like. I'm currently at level 1052, with the memory leak at 2.5GB. It remains to be seen (a) whether the memory leak will grow to the point that I have to end the run to avoid a crash, even if I have spaces still left, and (b) whether I can endure this tedium much longer in any event, and (c) whether there will be a power failure before I end the game because it's STILL SNOWING here. Now that I realize I can still leak enemies this late in the game if I want to, it's no longer necessary to end on a "no stun" level. . . which means in theory this run could get up to 1170 or so. If I don't shoot myself first.

WGW - 2022-03-06 0:36:43.882759

@SC: I have a feeling that the game getting paused is a function of the javascript platform itself, not anything that can be affected by the game's programming code-- unless there was a specific command in the GTD program to pause the game when the window is minimized, which I really doubt is the case. It's most likely a byproduct of the platform itself. Also, just to clear up the technical terms here, because I made a lot of references in recent comments to whether the browser has the focus or not-- minimized means that the browser window isn't visible at all; not having focus just means that even with the game browser window still *visible*, you've clicked on something else (another window or on the desktop), so the GTD window isn't the currently active window. If a window is minimized it can't have active focus, but a visible (non-minimized) window can either have the active focus or not. It's an important distinction, because the game only pauses completely when it's minimized. Losing active focus doesn't pause it. But at very, very late levels in the game, the game's running speed and the enemy's movement end up getting affected by whether the window has the focus or not. It remains the case at these late levels that the game pauses completely if minimized. It would be nice if the game didn't pause when minimized, I agree, but I kinda doubt it's changeable, at least not by changing the game's programming code. But yes, totally, I agree it would be great if this could be changed!

SC - 2022-03-05 20:47:46.900137

Would like it if the game wouldn't be paused when the window isn't in focus

216 - 2022-03-04 15:22:32.620024

@mikis:Yes (in flash version it was different). @WGW:I got 341-5 possible places (334x4+5 max lvl in theory).

mikis - 2022-03-04 13:23:54.778598

General question: Is the rate of the damage dealt by range-based gems like Uranium affected by the opals?

WGW - 2022-03-03 23:41:26.023655

@216: To be more clear, I had actually already factored in the need to leave spaces open for the very end of the game when I said 318 gems/rocks could be placed-- that's with five empty spaces reserved for the final turn. Bur. . . I also made a little mistake, in that I left a couple of additional spaces empty when I was figuring this out by accident, just silly oversight-- so the total number of gems spaces, in my layout, and with five extra empty spaces held in reserve for a final turn, is actually 320, not 318. I do think, as I said, that could possibly be bumped up a few more with an alternative layout, but only trivially, maybe another 3 or 4 additional spaces. I'm not saying I see a clear and obvious way to squeeze a few more spaces out of an alternate layout, but it certainly seems possible due to all places in my layout where there are tiny gaps of less than a full block that can't be filled. I played around with this in MS Excel of all things, if you're curious about the layout. I'd be interested to see if you can up with an alt layout that allows for a few more gems (if you're interested in spending the time on it!). Here's what I've got: https://imgur.com/a/xv0DSS4 (The five spaces on the lower left are for the final turn) I think there's also a pragmatic limitation in the sense that you can't completely ignore every other element of the game just to come up with a end game layout that completely mazimizes space, because along the way to getting there, you need to have a workable maze, too. But I'd be unsurprised if a few more gems than 320 can be squeezed in, in THEORY. Re: the movement glitches, what you described is exactly what happens for me at high levels (800+). Air enemies are, for some reason, much less glitched out than ground enemies. Air enemies still get stuck, but not completely stuck the way ground enemies do. At a certain point, the ground enemy movement glitch is so bad that if you don't click somewhere off the browser so that its window loses focus, all 10 ground enemies will get completely stuck at the very, very start of the maze, kind of virbating in place, but never advancing. The only workaround is making the browser lose focus temporarily, which "unglitches" the enemy movement, but GLOBALLY slows the entire game down to a crawl-- across the board, enemy movement, tower fire rates, and the in-game timer all slowed. So you have a choice between letting the enemies all get bunched up in one place, which makes the levels take even LONGER, because most of your tower firepower on the whole rest of layhout goes unused; or having normal enemy movement but with the game slowed to 1/10th of its normal speed. Either way takes FOREVER, but I find that if I let the levels start off without active window focus, and I let the enemies advance (very slowly) far enough so that they're spaced out throughout the maze, then I can allow the game to have the active focus again and even though the enemies are mostly paralyzed, they get killed more quickly because (a) the game isn't slowed down anymore, and (b) at least they're getting hit more towers overall. I don't know if I explained any of that very well. I tried. :) Bottom line is, it's an absolutely agonozing slog to get through. I'm at level 924 now, and it will still probably take three more days before I get to 1150. If I don't just shoot myself first to end the tedium. (Also, there's another snow storm coming here tomorrow, and the power could very easily go out again.) Good to see you're still around, @216, at least looking in on comments-- I thought everyone else who used to comment had disappeared. And thanks for confirming that the frost animations are another source of leaking memory. :)

216 - 2022-03-03 14:51:31.277548

I observed minor leak by Paraibas (~3MB leaked at lvl 110 by builing only them), while i was looking for main reason, i blame frost nova too. Some about space ending theory: to start lvl, need to have 5 free spaces. To build a Paraiba need 8 ( 3 for parts + 5 spaces to take 4th). after that is possible to build one 3-parts special, then take 2 regular gems. So if maze have 318 possible gem places, you can make 311 Paraibas and start next 5 lvl, so max lvl is 1249. If you mean that you can take 318 gems (322 spaces), then max is 1265. Can you tell more about movemet glitch at lvl 800+? I experience some movement glitch, while dev uploaded wrong build with way faster enemies. then at lvl 30+ they was vibrating in places and sometimes moving forwad, while towers hit in normal speed, so was possible ot kill them at start place sometimes.

WGW - 2022-03-03 2:08:21.527200

@216: I had 3 lives at the point I lost, intentionally keeping it low because I was going to have no choice but end the game at level 1100. I see from the game I've got going now that it's still possible to leak as many 3 or 4 ground levels very very late game, IF the GTD browser window doesn't have the active focus. So I'm pretty sure now that this is how I lost that last run unexpectedly at level 1063. At least there was no power failure and I got to post something! Having done some playing around with late game maze layouts, I find that the theoretical maximum number of rocks/gems you can place before running out of space for new moves is 318. I can see the possibility of bumping that up a few more with an alternate layout but not much more-- you always have to leave a valid path for ground enemies, of course. If you built literally nothing but paraibas (which is pragmatically impossible), you could get to level 1272-- but that would mean no single turn gems and no great opal. I think with very, very careful playing, and the luck of getting a great opal pretty early, it SHOULD be possible to make it level 1200-- I think that provides just enough wiggle room to build just enough of other necessary gems (gold, quartz, jade, dark emerald). In theory. But the game also slows down massively around level 800 and only gets worse and worse, not just because of the increasing enemy hit points, but because of the glitched enemy movement. I'm at level 904 in my current run, with more than anough space to get to level 1150, but it's taking 10 minutes per ground level in real time now. I have to toggle back and forth between the browser window having the focus or not, because if I don't, the enemies either get completely stuck in place (with focus), or (without focus) the game is so slowed down, it's running at about 1/10th real time (meaning each second ticked on the game timer is taking ten real time seconds). So I don't even know that I'll be willing to play out my current run all the way to 1150-- it's just too tortuously slow. I really doubt I'm ever going to want to go any higher than 1150. Also worth noting that there actually IS still a memory leak-- which probably is causing the movement glitches/slowdown in late levels-- but of course it's much *better* now than it used to be, and doesn't grow fast enough to cause a crash before I have to end the game anyway. The browser was using 2.5 gigabytes of RAM by the end of my last run (the level 1063 one). My guess, based on your determination earlier that the critical hit text was causing the prior version's much worse leak, is that the remaining leak probably has to do with the animation of frost and fire attacks-- and probably the reason the leak is getting so much worse for me so late game is that I've been building nothing but paraibas for hundreds of levels, which obviously means a lot more onscreen frost attacks. Nothing about runs like this is even interesting or fun after the first few hours of a run. . . I honestly don't know why I'm still doing this except that I can play GTD while I'm watching TV.

216 - 2022-03-01 23:49:11.331604

@G: since v0.6.0 every 50 lvls enemies have stun immunity, strange mechanic. @WGW: leaking single ground unints (over 4M hp) with so low EG amount seems possible,even 50 EEs dont stunlock 10 units forever, possible you didnt notice that you have 1 life at start of lvl? I still waiting for updates to play GTD again.

G - 2022-03-01 17:26:53.792091

Are flyers immune to stun on level 100? I've noticed in my last three playthroughs that not one single flyer gets stunned on level 100 regardless of how many stunning gems I have. Anyone else notice this or is it a fluke?

WGW - 2022-02-19 2:23:35.394201

Well, I don't know how it happened, but I lost at level 1063. I was on the phone, and when I looked back at the computer screen, I'd lost, though I hadn't leaked a single enemy for probably 200 levels. Oh well, at least it was a new top score. This does, however, increase the chances that I'll waste even more time trying again to top it, since I *know* it's entirely possible to get to level 1100. But for now. . . I think I'm done for a while!

WGW - 2022-02-18 5:56:44.079061

As usual at least one egregious mistake I need to correct in my prior comment. I wrote, "Basically, if I play with the GTD window not having the active focus, it's impossible for me to leak enemies after level 800-- even on the "no stun" levels." I meant the opposite-- that if I play with the GTD window HAVING the active focus, no enemies will ever leak. I always mistype something. Always.

WGW - 2022-02-18 5:52:29.188676

@mm5: Congrats on the new top score, demonstrating that I'm not the only person in the world insane enough to endure the tedium of playing GTD to so high a level. I'm sorry to tell you, though, that I already had a game in progress which is going to get me to level 1100, assuming there isn't a power failure or unexpected crash. Currently at level 1027, with plenty of room for more gems to reach level 1100: https://imgur.com/a/5dM75iC But who knows, I've lost so many games at high levels due to things like power failures, I may not get to post a high score for this run. Which will tick me off to no end. But I *should* have this score posted in a few hours (I started it five days ago. . . ) If you do see this comment, I'm curious-- since you're perhaps the only other person who has played the game past level 1000-- if you've experienced the late-level bugs I have. For one thing, enemy movement is glitched completely for me after level 800 or so. Enemies only move properly when the game window doesn't have the active focus, which makes the game slow to about 1/5 its normal speed (the timer counter slows down, too), but enables normal (though slowed) enemy movement. Otherwise, they get stuck in place, not due to stun effects, but due to glitched behavior. Basically, if I play with the GTD window not having the active focus, it's impossible for me to leak enemies after level 800-- even on the "no stun" levels. Also, I've had some rocks get frozen (become non-removable) in very late levels, post level 700 or so. This has only happened a few times, and I can't yet identify what may be triggering it. One of the two games I posted high scores for already, at level 950 and 1000, had two frozen rocks, the other had none (can't remember which was which). My current run, at level 1027, has one frozen rock. By virtue of optimizing play for building as many paraibas as possible, this game is going ridiculously slowly, ground levels now taking almost 7 minutes each. I've only been able to optimize for "space", so to speak (virtually ignoring overall attack power), because I got a very early great opal at level 55. My feeling is that 1100 is the highest level you can get to without running out of room for moves; there just isn't enough wiggle room to make it another 50 levels to level 1150. In any event, good show on the new (temporary) top score. :)

Lurpack - 2022-01-24 20:40:28.549958

Is there a way to have the game run faster? I find at higher levels I have to wait ages for the monsters to die. Many thanks.

s - 2022-01-07 3:27:32.652258

why is it no matter where i put my towers i basickly get the same effect for example if i put my towers in one spot it is the same as if i spreaded them out

WGW - 2021-12-31 22:37:31.716672

"four* separate high scores" * On closer inspection, three, actually.

WGW - 2021-12-31 22:35:34.558053

@scgmeister: Same thing happened to me-- that's why I have four separate high scores with the text "WGW Double phooey"!

scgmeister - 2021-12-30 17:07:09.531943

Strange any time I try to use autocomplete for my email address, it will ignore what I try to type in the 'name field' and instead submit whatever it was I had entered in the 'name field' on my previous submission. (using google chrome)

RaTG13 - 2021-12-25 11:39:45.905305

Merry Christmas GTD gang

216 - 2021-12-22 12:58:41.864085

Perfect is ok, need much luck for GO. Its more important where you place towers, mainly EGs/EEs (early EG>EE). I rarely fail with leak in 36/40.

Themidnightpanda - 2021-12-22 2:29:12.431629

Do you need Great opals, or is opals in general fine?

216 - 2021-12-21 12:05:13.246399

Assuming Red Crystal + opals it should be enough, try also BS, in place that range c2 + mid. You can make BO as well. Mb post screenshot if need more.

Themidnightpanda - 2021-12-21 5:16:05.137310

Hey guys, been trying to get pass my highest score of level 84 and can't seem to deal with flying after 28-32. been trying for malachites, jades, golds, and Dark Emeralds. Are these not the towers to go for or what is it im missing. -PK-

216 - 2021-12-19 2:54:11.465669

--->> @Peter: I found reason of speed issues: looking at code speed (lvl 41+) is 2.08(550/265), min speed 1.47, but before comparing, speed is multiplied x0.75 (less if slowed), while min speed in not, resulting max speed 1.55 and min speed 1.47 - only ~5% diff. Also instead actual speed that multipier is displayed. I dont understand what that units means, in flash it was half-tiles per sec.

216 - 2021-12-19 1:06:16.950740

Actually, nerfing jades won't solve late game problem - if you can kill all bats, gold doesn't matter. There are reasons for nerfing jades, but its about early-mid game balance (which is strange now - we leaking many bats due to speed bug and gain a lot of gold to buy lives), but not about late game (200+). -> We sugested some ideas, but before fixing speed issue discussion about exact changes is pointless. About jades: I think they will end at 2-4%.

RaTG13 - 2021-12-18 20:58:51.129364

The real question here is how does this game reflect Peter's true vision. Once you have a good maze locked in good gold generation etc, you virtually continue to whatever highscore you want until you are bored. The problem there is that you dont get much satisfaction in the game anymore since you cover your lives with gold production and stun to the point nothing is barely moving. This is why i agree with 216 on Jade nerfs, because lets be honest, this is so boring when you know gold isnt a problem and you are going to finish at whatever level your patience decides. To that effect, going passed level 200 on this version is already damn decent. At the end of the day, balancing a game that inherently runs on an RNG is exceptionally difficult, to the point where you will get some players who will say game is broken with the smallest of tweaks.

216 - 2021-12-16 19:05:38.682381

Merge bug - nothing new, we can exploit it to save perf. gems. Usefull for bad RNG. I also observed movement glitch, when was dev build here with fast enemies.

scgmeister - 2021-12-16 18:12:04.416679

I noticed another glitch (possible glitch) where I had 2 flawed sapphires, 2 normal opals, and 1 normal emerald. I selected one of the normal opals to fuse and instead of consuming a flawed sapphire and the normal emerald to make a jade, it consumed the second normal opal and the normal emerald instead, leaving both flawed sapphires untouched.

scgmeister - 2021-12-16 13:32:55.331669

I suppose I should mention a potential glitch if you're going to implement a speed up button. Basically I found that when I use a certain program in order to speed up this game, it eventually causes the enemies to sort of vibrate in place if I were to try to speed it up too far (aka 5x speed and they will start to vibrate in place occasionally by level 11 speeding it up any higher would cause the enemies to get stuck at the beginning. Eventually in later levels even going 2x speed will cause the enemies to vibrate in place while the towers continue shoot at them at the higher rate. I believe I also noticed that doing so would also cause the time to be unusually high compared to what others get. As for a jade nerf, I can see how that would be viable once the other towers correctly slow down the enemies at higher levels making them more useful.

216 - 2021-12-15 23:03:58.460545

@WGW: I run game on VERY old and slow laptop (with ubuntu and firefox) and i can't see slowdown that affect game. Leaked 7 in 44 (cause problem with opals even with 28 repicks used), I dont think that game is easier/harder on this. (I was suprised that game runs at all) About GOs: when i sayed they arent important? They are gamechanging, but i dont need it to make run stable in currecnt version. They are main luck factor in the game, its true. We should discuss about balancing it too, but for now need late game balance. More about jades: if they would get nerfed from 5% to 3%, that would means we can buy only 16% less lives. While fixing speed will have MAJOR impact on leaks (I recently did some simulations that confirm that), jade nerf will be needed. I'm not telling Peter to nerf jades now, but after fix i will.

216 - 2021-12-15 17:05:08.580239

In flash version i was able to do 10-12 repicks till lvl 44, now i do ~30. Because bats at lvl 44+ are op (even for me), someone can think that jades aren't op, but after fixing speed issue it will be WAY easier. Anyway, jades aren't most important to balance now, we talking about making game harder after 200. But i think that leaking 6 bats every time since 44 and getting saved by jades its not ok. We are supposed to preventing leaks, not buying 100s lives.

scgmeister - 2021-12-15 14:44:38.331296

I agree with WGW in that there is no need to nerf the jade. being able to reach level 100 is already really tough for the average player, especially when one isn't lucky enough to get a GO early on in the game. However, there are other options that could make the mid-late game more challenging without having to nerf the jade. a few potential options to make higher levels tougher: 1: You could bring back the leaking of enemies costing more lives the further you get into the game. Aka, each leaked enemy could cost 1 additional life every 50 levels resulting in the possibility that one could potentially lose all 50 lives in 1 round between levels 201 and 250 (like the original flash game but not as costly). 2: I do like 216's idea of adding additional enemies the further you get into the game. As in have 1 additional enemy every 20 levels. If pulled of correctly, I could see this becoming crazy fun later on seeing your towers trying to take down 20+ enemies, though I could see how performance could become more of a concern though. 3: There's also the option of upping the cost of each subsequent life purchased on a more exponential basis based on the level you're on (as in for every 100 levels the price increase per life bought doubles potentially resulting in it getting extremely expensive late game as a sort of counter measure against jade spam). Personally I like the first 2 options over this one and, implementing the first, second, or both of them to some extent would result in it becoming unnecessary to increase the cost of purchasing more lives. Also, fixing the speed bugs as 216 mentioned would also be big. Anyway, I'm up to 5 over 530 and will likely throw the game soon due to my patience running low and my needing to restart my browser in order to update it. (was going for only PTF for the last 50 rounds but probably won't continue if I'm not going to stick with it much longer anyway.) https://imgur.com/a2mIjME

216 - 2021-12-15 12:10:19.673831

@Peter: There are speed issues that needs to be fixed before we can suggest anything exact (more below ->). Can i also ask to fix 4-merge bug, which is just matter of change 1 number in code? (from 4 to 3, because combinenum function dont count selected gem). Someone can miss Uber Stone becasue of that. -> There is speed display bug AND minimum speed bug - after lvl 30 slowed enemies have ~same speed, which (even looking at code values) is not intentional. But generally idea is of making bats near lvl 44 slower and later wawes LITTLE faster. There are alternative options, for explample making wawes after 200 having 11 enemies instead 10, even later 12, so game will have end.

216 - 2021-12-15 11:47:28.279485

@WGW: The game WAS running differenly on slower PCs in 0.5.4, but there was HUGE change. Since you wont give me any screenshot/other evidence from 0.6.2, and i can see MAJOR mistakes in your runs, so i refuse to accept your theory. BUT definitelly i don't want to "ruin game for everyone else". By rebalancing i also mean to make lvl 44+ bats SLOWER. But jades DEFINITELLY need little nerf, since gold generation in early game is high. Anyway, congrats patience of getting to lvl 950! Btw, you mentioned some slowdown at lvl 800, but towers and enemies was slowed equally, right? Can you also check again how 0.6.2 runs on your old PC as i asked before ? ( i mean bunching up dwarves at lvl 1)

WGW - 2021-12-15 7:45:26.042987

Oops-- I took a screenshot of the WRONG GAME (I had two games going at the same time), and now it's too late to take a screenshot of the level 950 game. . . but here's a screenshot of it at level 869. There was really no change at level 950 except that more of the blank spaces were filled in by paraibas. https://imgur.com/a/3S5GvmC

WGW - 2021-12-15 7:37:14.819807

@Peter H: You're asking how to rebalance the game to the one guy in the entire world, @216, who thinks jades are overpowered and that great opals aren't all that important (which is a pure luck factor that shouldn't be as important as it is-- getting a great opal is still very nearly non-optional to get past level 150.) I respect @216's skill at the game and such, and certainly his having identified the cause of the memory leak, but he also has adamantly refused to accept my repeated assertion that the game plays differently on different systems based on specs. Rebalancing the game based on his suggestions is going to make it all but unplayable for literally everyone else, myself included. He's going to tell you to nerf the jades further, no doubt (as this has been a consistent theme in his recent comments)-- that would be a deeply misguided mistake for the reasons I've outlined to you previously. Before worrying about rebalancing any further, it seems to me that it's much, much, MUCH more important to ensure that the game plays the same way across all platforms, which it absolutely does not (@216 has never agreed to this, but he's just simply wrong-- the game plays drastically differently on faster systems, with enemies moving faster and far less damage being dealt to them.) You just can't properly reblanace a game that doesn't play consistently for players using more or less powerful PCs. I made a suggestion a while back that jades be scaled more to level, so that they start out earning less gold but eventually-- by level 100 or so--- would earn a lot more. This would make the early game more challenging while preventing the need to build nothing but jades for 50, 100, 150 turns. Or you can simply globally nerf them back to the way they were before the last update, as @216 would probably suggest, and completely ruin the game for everyone else. But of course it's your game to do with as you please.

WGW - 2021-12-15 7:32:03.865797

Well, I think I've just about maxed out how high a level you can get to in this game without running out of room for additional gems-- level 950. There was still a bit more room, but if I hadn't ended the game at level 950, I would have run out of spaces for moves before the next opportunity to leak enemies, at level 1,000. With a bit more optimization, It's probabluy possible to (very carefully) make it to level 1,000 before running out of room, but this would require planning for it from the early levels onwards (prioritizing paraibas and rejecting all single-turn special gems), and then continuing to play for another 50 hours. . . So I'm not expecting that anyone else will be obsessive enough to accomplish this anytime soon. In any event, I won't be at all surprised if Peter H. decides to modify the game again in a way which calls for archiving these high scores again, so I don't expect to be repeating this mind-numbingly dull, tedious, and time-wasting feat anytime soon. I wanted to see what happen if I filled in just about every space, I did it, and now I don't expect to ever do it again. . . Screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/g97R0i4 It's worth noting, I think, that the game started running in a very glitchy manner around level 800 or so, with enemy movement pretty messed up. The game also slows down considerably at very high levels when its window doesn't have the active focus, which also seems to smooth out the bizarre enemy movement glitches at very high levels. No idea what could be causing this, but it's probably not worth debugging for Peter since so few people will be insane enough to play the game to this high a level. There are other bugs much more worth investigating. I'm sure I'll keep playing (because I can't seem to stop), but having gotten to level 950, I can now die happy. Well, happier, anyway.

Peter Holko - 2021-12-15 5:29:10.634871

@216: Can you give me exact balancing changes you'd like to see? I'm open to suggestion. If the memory leak is gone I am open to implementing 2x speed-up button.

216 - 2021-12-13 17:02:46.958207

@rightstuff: At ~70 ,if i care about time score. GO is no needed in current version to "win", but game goes much slower. @scgmeister: I hope that game will be rebalanced, so that button wont be needed. Besides jade nerf, need rebalance speed of bats/giving them partial stun resistance in late game/ making there is >10 bats at some point. But speed units must be fixed first.

scgmeister - 2021-12-13 12:53:33.236847

hmm, maybe along with the option to be able to speed up the game, there could also maybe be a button that would allow you to 'surrender' and submit your score on the chance one would get soft locked dur to lack of room.

rightstuff - 2021-12-13 7:49:46.302403

Hey, at what lvl do you guys "check" if you have a GO, and if you dont, restart?

216 - 2021-12-13 1:32:56.108442

Near 960*, need 8 empty spaces for build paraiba. Possible problem at 900+: missclick that takes 2+ spaces may fail whole run (unable to click repick).

216 - 2021-12-13 1:01:01.820120

@WGW: Don't forget to remove POs (extra 10 turns) - You should run of space near 970 (need to have always 5 spaces free). Do You still leak sometimes 1-2 air? I can see 8-9 hard stunzones here and not enough dmg in the mid for 800K+ hp flyer to kill it fast enough. Having air leaks + keeping on 1-2 lives after 950 may make end game possible in 968(?), but RNG can fail this.

WGW - 2021-12-13 0:15:23.560289

@216: I've been building nothing but paraibas for the last ~200 levels. https://imgur.com/a/IfcC7Az

216 - 2021-12-12 23:19:44.034967

Did you remeber about builing paraibas and not taking 1-turn gems? Without speed up button i don't plan to beat this anyway.

WGW - 2021-12-12 23:06:07.964240

*"sock-lock" was supposed to be "soft-lock"!

WGW - 2021-12-12 23:05:08.280655

@scgmeister: Presumably the game will just sock-lock when you try to make a move with the error "You Cannot Build There" popping up anywhere you click. Which means you wouldn't even be able to post a high score. I'm on level 677 myself, and beginning to be very conscious of how much room there is left to place gems, to make sure I end the game before that happens. I'll probably have to end at level 750, maybe 800.

scgmeister - 2021-12-12 19:09:22.669475

Just curious, what happens if one were to manage to fill the map until there's no more room for available? just passed level 400 and still going strong thanks to an early, well placed go. https://imgur.com/yv7zymN

G - 2021-12-10 15:07:13.226643

@WGW: you gotta play on a laptop ;)

WGW - 2021-12-09 23:59:37.248263

@SAM: Ouch-- that weirdly makes me feel a bit better because that's even worse. Was this also due to using suspend/hibernation mode? I haven't tested it out after losing that last run. I have a good one going now, where I only got a great opal at level 140 and it couldn't have come at a later time. I ended up squeaking by level 152 with only one life to spare. Gold's finally stabilized now and I'm at level 233. But there's a snow storm expected tonight, so if the power goes out. . .

SAM - 2021-12-09 20:52:17.086749

Same - I lost a game at level 450ish... I was seeing if I could fill the map; probably a silly effort, but I got a perfectly placed GO.

WGW - 2021-12-08 21:55:14.018845

Well, I lost the whole run-- at level 380-something-- after putting my PC in suspend mode. When I woke it up today, the game had reset itself, which is not something that ever used to happen. 20+ hours over several days completely down the drain.

216 - 2021-12-08 15:08:55.501549

I think that game no longer runs diffently on slower systems, when i open some things on mine PC to slow game, towers slow down equally ,giving same results, but slower. Also i saw delta time in code, unlike in 0.5.4, where enemies could be bunched up at start of the wawe. @WGW : can you check again on your old PC if enemies are still bunched up? (make sure to load 0.6.2). Finished another stable run, used malachite strat, first time since long time. RNG was horrible at start - only 1 EE and 1 EG in lvl 44. But i didnt restart, wanted to see if op jades will save me, and they did. Again no GO. 11 jades, 150 repicks and 198 leaks, including: 9 in 100 4 in 150 10 in 200 Only lucky thing in this run was getting 2 GAs near lvl 80. I wont say that difference between out gamas in "GIGANTIC" - we both can survive without a GO. 30 jades instead of 11 allows to leak x1.4 more, but also casue to have less EE/EG amount. I need to know how your game look like around lvl 44, 60 ,80, 100 to see if you doing sometihng wrong/ not optimal. But surely 5% is too op for jades, 3-4 would be more balanced.

216 - 2021-12-08 3:52:26.477606

@WGW: Stoping leaks without a GO is hard. Need HUGE dmg near mid, to kill 1-2 enemies before later ones escape. so same gems can switch. And nearly 50 well located EEs. And mb still sometimes 1 leak. Minimum speed bug: enemies after wawe 30 are nearly unslowable. As i remember, speed of 41+ is 6.92 = 3.46 rocks/s , slowed enemies are moving with like ~3,2 maybe. min. speed in flash was 4,91= 2,45 rocks/s more later, its 4:52am mine time

WGW - 2021-12-08 3:06:12.879585

@216: Well, I finally got a great opal at level 310, so that ended the Great No Great Opal Experiment. I suppose I could have just discarded as you've done in past games, but I couldn't bear to do it. . . I want to see how high a level I can get to before running out room for new gems, and with a great opal, it won't take nearly as long. I'm already fairly satisfied that it's possible to continue the game indefinitely without a great opal after having gotten to level 310 without one. That said, building an obscene amount of jades to make up for the lack of a great opal appears to be non-optional, at least on my system. I still believe wholeheartedly that GTD is playing hugely differently for you on a much older PC. I'm STILL leaking air enemies, at a point where no new gems placed mean much of anything because so much of the layout is already filled up. I can never get anywhere NEAR not leaking air enemies at level 150. So if I had to guess what's going on here-- and it's just a guess-- I think it might have to do with what you've referred to as the minimum speed bug. But I confess I don't really know what you've meant by this, so if you could explain it further, I'd appreciate it. But since you've said that you think this bug affects the damage taken by air enemies, it would seem an obvious explanation for the gigantic-- and I mean truly gigantic-- disparity between your experience and mine with respect to killing air enemies. I can't think what else could possibly explain it-- maze layout is basically irrelevant to air enemy levels, and at level 150, there just hasn't been enough time in the game yet for differences in which special gems you build to make all that much of a difference. Also, the problem with air enemies continuing to escape for me, much later in the game, isn't at all about attack power-- air enemies simply glide through the checkpoints while other air enemies are stun-locked. With the whole layout covered by dark emeralds (and jades, whose stun effect is minor but not irrelevant). It wouldn't matter how much attack power was in play if 2 to 3 air enemies glide through all the checkpoints without ever getting stunned, and there's absolutely no part of their path which isn't generously peppered with multiple stun gems. Maybe with your explaining what you mean by the minimum speed bug I'll understand better where this gigantic-- again, GIGANTIC-- difference in results comes from. Otherwise, it's completely baffling to me.

216 - 2021-12-06 14:32:16.652611

@WGW: sometimes i leak 0 in 150 (even without GO), if i extend maze. Not upgraded BSs hels, rest do EGs ( I have more EG since i dont need 30 jades). v0.6.1 was hard, i didnt get over 100 without GO, but wasn't giving up, it could be possible. I liked it, because game lasted only 2-3 hors and i could push mine no-GO record. Mb to ~120, idk if 200(no-GO) was possible, but it was challengig (and some fun) at least and not forgiving mistakes. Now, game is too easy, we can go as far as we want even without GO, so it's boring. The only thing that can be fun is getting better lvl 200 times. But for that need early GO... which is matter of luck and need many attepts. I dont like fact that not so experienced players can get very high lvl with some luck (GO + spam jades + randomly located EEs/other towers+ absurd long maze possibly can work). Also, this game really needs speed up buton ( i suggest x2, x8 speed) - - - - In mine last (that ended in 201) run i even got 4 leaks before 44 (1 in 12 and 3 16). normally i reset game i, but now i wanted check 5% jades ( i had maxed 1 jade already at 12 - still leaked 1...). But untill lvl 120 i got FIVE 1-turn EGs(~0,0003% chance!, more likely to get 1 Uber Stone assuming fixed 4-merge bug). However that run was safe enough to guess that luck wasn't needed, with just 9 jades. I got very missplaced GO after lvl 140 ( becasue rushing with gems) Anyway, gold gengeration was high enough to have no doubt i can make stable no-GO run without that luck. - - - - 1 more thing: there are ways that increase gold generation, but they affect horrible on time. So even with 2% jades stable no-GO might be possible( by very skilled and patient player) Imagine making very long maze, no paraiba and low dmg stun zone with many jades + few EEs. enemies would struck here for long time making jades to generate more gold than ussual. i didn't try it, v0.6.1 existed too short.

WGW - 2021-12-06 7:09:23.223625

@216: Yes, the no-leak level at level 150 is what ultimately killed the run. But I also wasn't getting very good picks along the way (and of course, no great opal). I have another run going now with no great opal which is going much better, now at level 225, and *probably* sustainable even if I never get a great opal. Probably. This is only working because I've built a truly ungodly number of jades (more than 30) and made the maze very, very long (to prevent ground enemies from leaking). It's more of an experiment on no-great-opal runs than anything else, which so far indicates that a great opal is not absolutely necessary to get a sustainable run going, which is great. But I'll probably never want to do an extended no-great-opal run after this-- building almost nothing but jades for 100 turns is neither challenging nor interesting, and it's taking FOREVER. I'm only on level 225 and more than 48,000 seconds have elapsed already. It's a playable game again for me now, which makes me very happy. I really wasn't going to keep playing if the game remained so dependent on luck.

216 - 2021-12-05 21:27:54.333130

I dont see any problem with getting lvl 1000 now besides time that it would take. Mem.leak stop at lvl 100. Jades seems a bit op again for me, i can repick a lot in early game. I agree that 2% was mb a bit low, because too few repick (most gold went on lives) After fixing speed bugs, we will able to leak less flyers, then jades will definitely need nerfed to 3% at least ( minimum speed surely dont work propertly). @WGW: did you lose in 152 because ground leaks in 150?

RaTG13 - 2021-12-05 20:35:10.811477

@Peter: i think this is a solid version of the game. nothing stupidly long to level 500+ where you leave this up for days and days. Looks great here onwards!

WGW - 2021-12-05 18:26:02.951621

@Peter: I think the game is much, much better balanced now. I just finished a run without a great opal and got to level 152. With a little bit of better luck, I'd have been able to get further even continuing without a great opal. This wasn't really possible in the last version with the nerfed jades. And even if a great opal is still hugely important, now having the wiggle room to play 150 levels while trying to draw a great opal is a LOT better than having only 70 to 80 levels to get one before losing before this change. Thank you very much for listening to the feedback and making the change. For some reason the text for my high score at level 152 is blank, though I did submit text, of course. Not sure why that happened, since I see plenty of other high scores with text. Is there any sort of a hard limit to the text length that perhaps causes text to be rejected? The text I submitted wasn't overly long, just 43 characters, but I can't think of any other reason why the text wasn't accepted. @216: Great job testing for the memory leak-- now that Peter has disabled the display of critical hits over level 100, the memory leak does seem to be a lot more under control. My PC was using about 275MB when I lost at level 152, which is a lot lower than it used to be (the game was using about twice as much RAM at this point before the last update.)

Peter Holko - 2021-12-04 16:11:15.427855

@216 @RaTG13: My mistake, not sure how the Dev build was uploaded last night. I have bumped the version up to 0.6.2 because I also increased the Lucky Asian Jade back to 5%.

216 - 2021-12-04 15:25:36.680206

lvl 98 - 128 MB lvl 100 - 139 MB lvl 102 - 139 MB lvl 104 - 139 MB lvl 106 - 139 MB But pls fix speed bugs/units (speed: 0.75, minimum speed: 1.47 ( 5.20 now))

216 - 2021-12-04 14:18:28.697499

Looks like test version is uploaded here.. Something strange is going on with enemies since lvl ~30, retaled to high speed probably. Its not well visible on screenshot. With that 99% crit chance memory is leaking fast (80 MB at lvl 80), going to lvl 100 to check if it stop, but enemies are getting strucked sometimes due to that strage bug.

RaTG13 - 2021-12-04 13:35:15.479358

Woah, not sure why but im getting a start with unlimited gold and super fast walkers on survival? if i reset game lives/gold goes back to normal but they do race around and im using a 50Hz monitor.

Peter Holko - 2021-12-04 6:28:56.930522

@216: Thanks for your findings, I decided to temporarily remove the Crit and Bonus Gold texts after level 100, please let me know if that solves the memory leak.

SAM - 2021-11-29 23:55:36.175359

Silly request: maybe two different buttons to start survival mode: "Survival: Malachite" and "Survival: Silver". Oh, the time I would save not restarting over and over to get the right one.

216 - 2021-11-29 20:43:17.298907

@Peter: Gold texts casue memory leak as well. Its even more visible, because jades shots fast ( i set jade gold chance to 97%) - - - - - - - - - - btw, @WGW emerald stratey in flash verion was way more luck-based, i think nobody liked flyers stacking mechanic, which was only real way to lose in ~50-192 Need to admit, Your strat wasn't luck based at all (no mistake = 196, mb except extreme cases), but 196 was hard limit of this. - - - - - - - - - @WGW: just wanted to post commet, but noticed your new comment. . . 1. Jades scales with lvl quite well, because later wawes last longer in addition to normal jade formula lvl/2 +5. But it could be interesting if jades scales also with their lvl. Also faster jades scaling will broke late game repicks balance. I think the main reason of "skyrocket" live cost is absurb amount of leaks in 48, 52, 56... (how many you leak there?) , caused bu way too fast movemet speed of flyers , i wish that minimum speed was fixed 2. Huge gap between PO and GO makes it really hard to balance. Mb need game mechanic that allow you to force GO before lvl 100 or POs must be buffed a bit, to make game less luck based 3. Acces to code: press F12, click on sources, find game.js file.

WGW - 2021-11-29 20:20:11.768996

@216: Just an initial thought. . . Maybe a possible solution here would be to have the gold earned by jades start low, but scale up with level a lot more, so that they're not so overpowered in the beginning (as they were before they were nerfed), but earn a lot more gold later in the game when cost of lives starts to skyrocket. I don't know the formulas here, because I still don't know how to access the game code, and probably wouldn't be able to interpret it anyway, so I can't offer any specific suggestions on the math. But I think the general principle of having jades start low in gold earned but scale up a lot more with level could lessen the absolute need for a great opal-- eventually, jades will earn you enough gold to make up for the extra leaked enemies when you don't have a great opal, but in the earlier levels, jades aren't earning so much as to make the cost of maxing out gem chances and repicks meaningless. This is really a matter of Peter trying to address game balance, and I'm all for that, I just think that nerfing jades and forcing leaked enemies every 50 levels is a ham-fisted way at going about it, and that it only makes the game "harder" in that luck is so huge a factor now.

216 - 2021-11-29 19:10:43.524072

@Peter: https://imgur.com/ztDVGfZ - lvl 85 and ~30MB memory leaked I did same testing , but disabled crit text and was no leak (7MB) I will test bonus gold text now. @WGW: 1. I meant that high lives cost + high jade gold gain broke repicks/other things that cost gold balance, in flash version repicks cost was same. 2. The main RNG problem now is getting a GO, rest is 90% matter of strategy. I agree that trying many times to fail becasue no-GO its not so fun, thats why i stopped NJC attepms in 0.5.4 In general, not possibility to overcome VERY BAD RNG should be acceptable, but GO RNG is problem now, mb after fixing speed it wont.

WGW - 2021-11-29 18:20:38.819624

@Peter: All I can say, again, is how misguided it is to make changes to a longstanding strategy-based game which make luck MORE of a factor than it has ever been. The mechanics of this game could already be more than a bit frustrating before now, but by balancing gems for attack power with gems to earn back gold, you could generally overcome even terrible luck. That's what made this so good a game to me. Take that away, and I just have no interest left, none. Why would I want to play a game where I used to have control over how well I did, but which has now been changed so that good luck (and not just good, but *really* good luck) is indispensible to get past even level 100? As I said, it feels a complete waste of my time. The game is now a test of how lucky you can get, or of how willing you are to play run after run until get really lucky. That's not how GTD has played, in any version, after all these years, until now. I'm not suggesting, to be clear, that you or anyone else should care whether *I* want to keep playing the game! :) I'm just stating my very, very strong an very, very negative personal reaction. It takes a couple of hours to get far enough in survival mode to know if you've got a decent chance at a stable layout. Spending that time, over and over again, just to find that you haven't gotten lucky enough to, e.g., draw a great opal, is just no fun for me, at all. Regardless, I appreciate all the effort you've put in recently (including re-doing the game in the first place after Flash ended), and I've gotten more hours out of this game than any other I've ever played, no contest, so I'll always be grateful for what you've done. I'm just not interested in playing further if GTD remains this dominated by pure luck. @216: You throw out so many points to respond to in any given comment that if I replied to them all, my comments would be even longer than they already generally are. So I'll limit myself to one point: It doesn't matter, at all, how much gold is being earned by jades now versus in the Flash game, or in prior versions of the javascript game, what matters is how they function now, within THIS version of the game. And in this version of the game, yes, they're nerfed to the point of uselessness. If the cost of buying lives followed the same formula as the Flash version, then obviously jades wouldn't need to earn as much gold. If the formula for the cost of repicking scaled the way buying lives does, then they'd need to earn a lot more gold. Repeating my point ad nauseum, cause it's the only important point I'm trying to make here: You cannot earn enough gold now with jades to overcome RNG/luck. And there's no other, alternative way to be able to overcome RNG. Play enough runs, you'll eventually get lucky. That's not the game I've been playing all these years. Heads up that I'm going to be tied up with other things this week, so I probably won't be able to comment further for a while.

216 - 2021-11-29 17:52:22.880499

100 crits is not enough for noticeable leak, need 20-50 diamonds and several lvls for few MB

Peter Holko - 2021-11-29 17:41:21.478923

@216 I set all the diamond towers to 100% crit which created 100s of crit messages and it didn't seem to cause memory to leak.

216 - 2021-11-29 13:23:39.321772

@Peter: "in flash version it wasn't possible" - False, i got lvl 500 twice* and it could be almost every mine 200+ run (but it take so long). Flash / current version have been missing lvl 200+ balance. Linear hp growth, is slow at this point(but giving more hp is bad idea, killing enemies last already so long), same speed, same amount of enemies - every wawe is ~same hard. With properly located stunners, possible to stop all leaks (which was needed in Flash, 1 leak caused lose) -> no other way to lose than force ground units to walk around maze. *once i wasn't able to sumbit score, becasue over max integer value(?)

Peter Holko - 2021-11-29 5:04:29.926595

@WGW I'm open to changing stats but I never intended Jades + Stun to allow level 500. In that Flash version that wasn't possible. @216 Thanks for the suggestion, I'll look at crits as the cause of the memory leak!

216 - 2021-11-29 2:29:46.114383

How hard survival should be depends of Peter's vision of this game. Mb he wants lvl 200 to be near impossible to get? (no, i won't say that its now (on GO runs), i got it with some mistakes) - - - - - - Jades gold gain its ok imo, if everyone else thinks game it's too hard, better way is to make flyers easier. . . fixing speed bug will helps much. - - - - - - Beating 196 in flash GTD, took me 3-4 months* , with much analizing flying wawes (how to effective stun flyers). I WAS expecting it need very lucky RNG(something like <1%) to do that, but i was wrong, needed GO and a bit luck... at this point i was thinking that beating 196 without GO is "extremelly unlikely", but with more experience i managed to do it twice. Also Lement had a real chance to do this (only if he had better stun RNG in wawe 196, i was SIMULATING this, if you don't know). However, system specs was afecting GTD (in different way than now) that lowered his chances singificantly. With experience i was able to beat 196 every 2-3 run ( not counting resets/fails in early lvls), so saying it was near impossible not right. *I know this game since 2007 or 2008, but i had breaks and i wasn't trying emerald strat before 2019 (i didnt even know about scores/comments sections before 2019) --------- More about jades: They still make more gold than in flash version. I know lives are getting expesive after some leaks...but i fell you aren't supposed to leak 5+ every air wawe and not lose. It was ridiculous that i could upgrade jade early and get max chances before 19 ( mine record was max chances in 15). Also amount of repicks that i could make before lvl 30 was high ( and that just with 1-2 jades). It was a bit funny, but it didnt seems to be "serious", so completly disagre of nerf being "useless" (tbh i was suprised when i noticed 2% chance (expected 3-5), but 2% was value that i was thinking in january to be ok. No ,i didnt tell that value to Peter/anyone) ofc, it's only mine opinion.

WGW - 2021-11-29 0:05:26.618381

@216: How "hard" survival mode "should" be is of course a subjective thing. In the Flash GTD, it was near-impossible to get past level 196 (I never did, and only you and 2 or 3 other players managed it). But this was due to a quirk in the mathematics of buying lives, not an intentional game design decision. And I was resigned to the face that level 196 was the natural limit for the way I played the game. It still took a good amount of thought, and a bit of luck, to get to level 196. But these latest changes are completely intentional-- the intent here, very clearly, is to make your gold drain much, much harder (if not impossible) to earn back. There's no alternate strategy I can imagine to make up for the fact that you'll never (or almost never) have enough gold to overcome bad RNG. The result? A game in which good RNG is basically a requirement to do well-- including, as in your case, getting an early great opal (already a semi-requirement before the latest change, but now quite probably absolutely necessary). Intentional gameplay changes that make RNG ***MORE*** of a factor than before are, imo, the absolute worst possible gameplay changes to make in what is basically a pure strategy game. If jades remain nerfed (made useless) this way, I hope you're right that other changes will lessen the impact. As it stands now, it feels like I'm wasting my time if my "success" in any given run is now so completely at the mercy of factors I no longer have any real control over. Fingers crossed this is changed soon. . . I can't overstate how much I despise this change. I wasn't enthusiastic about The "no-stun" levels change, but this? I really hate it. :(

216 - 2021-11-28 23:14:59.886017

@WGW: i'm pretty sure i found that crits are MAIN reason of memory leak, i hope @Peter read this too. I agree, game is hard now, but survival SHOULD be hard, not like every run goes 200+. I got stable run in mine first try, but i was lucky with GO. I think that need to fix minimun speed/ speed units bug, after that game will be a bit easier.

WGW - 2021-11-28 22:59:15.209330

I hate to say, but gotta say, I absolutely hate the latest gameplay change. Jades are not just "nerfed" now, they're basically nullified. This, combined with the last major gameplay change (the no-stun levels every 50 levels) make getting past even level 100 without a great opal feel almost impossible. I don't know how much a great opal will even help get past, say, level 200, now without great luck. No offense intended to Peter, but I really, really, really hate it. RNG was always a factor in this game, but with good playing, you could almost always overcome bad RNG. The game now seems, to me, to require good RNG. That's not a good change at all. I really hope that this latest change to make jades all but useless is undone, or at the very least, that Peter decides to split the difference between how much gold they used to earn vs the pittance they earn now. (Also, the jade description really, really needs to incude text explaining that they earn gold-- I don't know how long it takes new players to figure this out without the explanation, but I'd guess a lot of new players just give up on the game entirely before ever figuring it out!)

WGW - 2021-11-28 22:58:01.341943

I did a little bit of testing in sandbox mode, but got distracted. I see @216 has this well in hand. I was doing the same sort of test, creating no maze, and no special gems, and not placing any opals, and got up to level 110 or so without seeing any memory leak. Since there were actually about 3 times as many gems (due to not making any special gems), it seems clear, at least, that the number of gems isn't the cause of the leak if they're not special gems or gems with auras. Not much help, unfortunately.

SAM - 2021-11-28 16:31:39.225692

Found a new defect. It seems you cannot enter your name for high score submission if using Safari. I downloaded a different browser and it worked. (You'll see two unnamed high scores - that's me. Damn it's a lot harder now)

216 - 2021-11-27 19:30:42.331357

Changed EG crit chance to 0. . . and leak is gone! Was 30MB before at this point. https://imgur.com/xUXIOfe (yes, BS dmg cheated too)

216 - 2021-11-27 17:09:56.005652

Critical strikes makes the most memory leak. Strange. Making maze (more crits) increase leak/lvl. Run with paraibas/opals had possible a bit leak.

216 - 2021-11-27 2:54:02.656781

I did sanbox run with no maze and mostly regural gems and there was absolutelly 0 leak (always ~7MB after collecting garbage, wawe 120+), untill i added towers that can crit ( 11 MB after 10 wawes, slowly growing up) After jade nerf, 0.6.1 is not so easy, i survived with 2 lives( no gold for more) after several lvls ( even wawe 200, leaked 9). After 200 run got stable, so ended. Bad RNG at start, but i got a GO in lvl 56 and still i could fail.

Peter Holko - 2021-11-26 22:25:21.221542

I tested dwarves and bats leaking they are not the cause of the memory leak. Honestly still don't have any idea of the root cause.

216 - 2021-11-26 0:09:27.994960

I guess that guy which filled map with Ubers didn't had any leaks :) so i think no. Dwarves rarely leak( mostly air leaks), so i would say 0, 0 and mb few (in lvl 250). If need, i can do more analisys by chrome dev tools in mine next run

Peter Holko - 2021-11-25 23:22:43.074939

@WGW @216 Could the memory leak be associated with the dwarves leaking? How many dwarves are leaking around level 100, 150 and 300?

216 - 2021-11-25 16:52:38.095913

What change, comments always have been resizeable, even in flash version, which STILL exist : http://45.55.255.26/comments/ About mine score: it was intentionaly no-GO run (I got GO near 180, but downgraded it instantly), link to album with i posted 3 day ago. In wawe 324 i finally got 0 leaks(~50 EEs) and dicided to end this slow, boring run (i got much better time in lvl 400 with GO). If there will be major changes, like jade nerf, i will try no-GO again to show if its possible. Fow now i will try to get high lvl with just 1 jade (but not without GO), since with no stun in lvl 100 NJC seems unreal ( in 0.5.4 i got lvl 100 with 0 jades, but only 2 GO atteptms, not much gold for repicks, so its low chance for GO). Thanks @WGW, but i dont celebrate thanksgiving in Poland :)

WGW - 2021-11-25 15:38:25.385505

BTW, for anyone (like me) who hadn't noticed yet, the comment boxes on this page are now re-sizable, via dragging the bottom right corner of the box. This is fantastic-- can't believe I didn't notice it until today-- in that you're no longer limited to a teeny little text box of just a few lines. Long comments (like mine usually are) were especially hard to read. I used to generally copy/paste them into a text editor. But now you can expand the boxes to a very large, very readable size. (Even in the input box for a new comment is re-sizable now). Great change. :)

WGW - 2021-11-25 15:32:49.206202

@216: Did you just post a new high score just below my most recent one, with same text complaining about not having a great opal? ("Without a great opal. . . Never again.") Pretty funny, that we both got that new high score, without a great opal, at just around the same time, and had the same reaction-- "never again"! :) More later, but for now I'll just say that I 100% agree with you that my row of dark emeralds at the bottom should be a half row higher, it's (in my view) the weakest part of the layout. But shifting it up will require a major revamp of the WHOLE rest of the maze. There's probably a better solution than what I've been using, maybe a 50/50 compromise so that I don't have to lose a whole row of gems in the middle of the maze. But I completely agree, that half step too far down for the dark emeralds is a weakness of my layout. Peter has updated sandbox mode, which I'll probably be trying at some point later today. In the meantime, happy thanksgiving, @216, and to anyone else who actually reads these ridiculously long comments. :)

216 - 2021-11-25 1:27:08.460012

I added few pics. Still leaking 1 in 320, 49 EEs @WGW: if your downline was 0.5 higher (so range c2-c3 path) it would work much better. Very good EEs in upper part of map (mb except leftmost one). 44-150 is most interesting part of run. Do you remeber leaks in 44 and 48? I wouldn't say that ABS full coverage is needed. GR is trash gem now. But i agree, never again long no-GO run in 0.6.0

WGW - 2021-11-24 18:17:54.748881

I finally got a high level high score without a great opal-- a thoroughly unpleasant, tedious affair that required building a truly obscene number of jades to compensate. Gold levels didn't start to really stabilize until level 200 or so, and this was only by building 25 or so jades. And I ended up needing to build even more jades later. Most of my other "requirements" for a good layout-- other than having a great opal-- were in place (complete coverage by golds, paraibas, and blood stones, with everything boosted by black opals, and sub-ideally by perfect opals). But all I could really do to prevent running out of gold was to keep building and building jades. It was boring, and slightly stressful, since I was on the edge of losing until well past level 200. Here's a screenshot about 10 levels before I gave up (I could have kept going another 20 or so levels, but it was getting SO boring): https://imgur.com/a/tMGEyFU Note that this end-game screenshot really doesn't represent the weird things I had to do along the way, particularly in levels 50-150. E.g., I ended up extending the maze to insure killing all ground troops, a path that I eventually was able to remove only very late-game. Also, I had far, far fewer dark emeralds-- particularly near the exit-- because I was focusing on gold by building jades (I maintain that this was a *necessary* strategy in a run without a great opal-- and I'll maintain that opinion until someone else can post a high score for an equally high level game without a great opal and without a truly absurd number of jades to make up for it!) I did this, basically, for experimental purposes. In the future (until, at least, the game is updated again), I don't expect I'll ever bother pursuing a GTD run without getting a great opal by level 100, latest. It's slow, it's boring, and it's no fun. I've proven (to myself, at least) that it's technically possible to get a very, very high score without a great opal, but man, oh, man, is it a DRAG doing so. But at least I've done it once, and in the words of the immortal Marge Simpson, "Now let's never speak of it again."

216 - 2021-11-22 1:07:57.065018

@WGW: Can you make screenshot just after 10th enemy apperas in any lvl 41+ ? Here is mine example no-GO run ( but i need to admit that RNG was on mine side): https://imgur.com/a/Rny83Rk I think that with bad stun RNG (like in 116) i would get 6-7 leaks in any 52-96 flying wawe. Also few 1-turn gems. Leaks: 44 1 48 5 50* 1 ( forgot about no stunning) 52 4 56 4 60 5 64 5 68 5 72 3 76 5 80 5 84 4 88 4 92 3 96 4 100 9 104 3 108 4 112 5 116 6 120 3 124 5 128 4 132 2 136 4 Currently in 138, maybe i will add few more pics later. Actually no matter what maze you use if you can put EEs in proper locations. Important thing is having many dmg gems (EGs mainly) in mid burst zone. Notice 1 more thing: jades amount scales bad with lives you can buy. to get 2x more lives need 8x more jades.

216 - 2021-11-21 14:48:30.474303

10k stating lives -> no need to click 1000 times, no possibily of accidental lose. I dont need explaination that someone want to play his own way :) But i want to see if its possible on your PC playing without so many jades/GO . you said you tried mine layont, but i think i should uplaod more pics, espec in in early (44-100) game. Also need decent RNG, i reset game quite often at start, espec if: - im forced to take junk gem - leaks before 44 - too bad gems and leaks amount in 44 i aim to have at least 3 EEs and 3 EGs in 44. Anyway i need to post screenshots before we can discuss, getting 200 without GO is hard now, some details can matter more than you think.

WGW - 2021-11-21 7:39:05.538344

@216: I did try your layout a few times, and saw only a slight improvement in leaks. Once again, I'm thoroughly convinced, via the evidence of my eyes seeing the game on two PCs years apart, that what's different between your experience and mine is the difference in how GTD plays on different systems, not your maze layout vs mine or any slight improvements/tweaks to strategy. Regardless, as I've said before, I have my own way of playing, which has been mostly the same for many years now, and I'm not interested in changing it, nor explaining in tedious detail why I do things the way I do. I also don't want to bury my comment for Peter below with a lot of comments that are irrelevant to what he's trying to fix (the memory leak). I don't see any reason why your solution to fixing sandbox mode (though yours would also work) is in any way "better" than mine. My suggestion would require changing ONE line of code, and will prevent losses. Your solution would work too, but I don't see how, on any level, it's "better". But I really don't want to get into another back and forth on this. If Peter wants me (or anyone else) to do a test run without special towers or gems with auras, then he has to make sandbox unlosable. He could also just turn off the trigger for the game ending, just remove it completely from the code. I don't really care how he does it. I was merely trying to suggest what I thought would be a very, very easy means of accomplishing the goal, which shouldn't require changing more than one line of code. But thanks.

216 - 2021-11-21 3:27:52.156942

There is better solution for sandbox- 10000 lives. @WGW: 1) Notice that if you are building jades instead EEs then you will leak more flyers, so wil need even more jades... so reducing leaks in early (44+) lvls is most critical. In mine last game starting from lvl 44 i had 4,4,5,6,6 leaks ( which wasnt very good, possible to get 0 in 44 even without GO, but hard, don't forget to make BO before 44). 2) Since when paraiba is "powerfull attack tower"? don't make more than 1-2 before stabilizing game. Its important gem for ground armor reduction, thats all. 3) you realized in lvl 150 that in lvl 180 you will have gold problems, so decided to spam jades? Strange choice, in 30 lvls possible to add 10 EEs that would reduce leaks enough (if you place them well). Don't regret gold for repicks. I know that adding jade just before flying wawe that would be lose its too late, but i play way more risky or "agressive". 4) Anyway main problem is amount of leaks. 4-7 near 150 seems way much, even without GO. How many EES did you had at this point? but probably enoguh ot make structures that neraly guarante at least 4-5 kills by stun lock. 5) I meant also comparision between ours PCs by making pic after 10th enemy appear. 6) Another reasons why i dont have 500+ score is lack of motivation (still far from v1.0, so scores will removed) and shutting down PC instaed hibertaning. Yes, that last lvl 200 no GO run was also closed by that. Maybe you should just try mine layout , i can make some screenshots every few lvls, if needed

WGW - 2021-11-20 23:46:04.825320

@Peter H: Longer explanation below if you're interested, but the tl;dr: Sandbox mode does work-- thanks-- but for the kind of test run you want, it will need to be adjusted. So rather than it just providing 100 million gold at the start, is it possible for you change the formula for buying lives so that it stays at just 1 gold? Otherwise, the price escalates so quickly that I end up "losing" around level 80 to 100, nowhere near high enough a level to monitor the memory leak (which, as @216 reiterated, doesn't start to really show itself until after level 100, and the game is not really leaking excessively until level 150 or so.) I'm more than happy to do this kind of testing, but I just can't do it in the current sandbox with the only change being the amount of gold at the start. A bit more explanation, if you're interested: I tried to do a sandbox run without building any special towers, and without any opals (because they have auras), as you asked, but under these playing restrictions, every enemy was escaping by level 40 or so. That means buying 10 lives per level, which means that the cost of buying lives escalates VERY quickly, eating up the 100 million gold entirely by level 80-ish. I figured I'd try bending the conditions just a bit, to build an Ancient Jade, put down one perfect Opal, and a cluster of Dark Emeralds in the center of the board, hoping to earn back at least a little gold (ends up not mattering with how much lives cost pretty soon), and at least stunlock and kill 1 or 2 enemies a level. But even this wasn't close to sustainable, and got me only to level 98 before I ran out of gold. Lives were costing almost 500,000 gold each at this point, so you can see how the 100 million gold isn't enough to create a true sandbox, i.e., where losing isn't possible. Losing is not only possible, it happens very quickly under these restrictions! Of course, if I were playing sandbox mode in a manner anywhere NEAR the way I play a normal run, the 100 million gold provided would be way, way, WAY more than enough to keep the game going forever, but since you're asking for a test run under strategically terrible play conditions, it's not enough close to enough gold. But rather than, say, bump the gold up to a billion-- which will still run out pretty quickly if every enemy is escaping-- I think the better solution for sandbox mode, if you can do this easily (and I would imagine it's an easy change), would be to change the formula for cost of buying lives so that it just stays forever at 1 gold. That, combined with the 100 million starting gold, would make escaped enemies meaningless, and let me continue the kind of test run you want without "losing". As it stands now, having only gotten to level 98, and only that high by "cheating" the play conditions, I can't offer any useful observations about the memory leak yet. But I remain more than happy to try it, if you can change sandbox mode to make it possible to do. Thanks!

WGW - 2021-11-20 23:44:09.833932

@216: I'm sorry to say I can't do any comparisons anymore looking at how GTD runs on my older computer, because-- you probably recall from comments I left a while back-- the game doesn't run properly at ALL on my PC anymore. I have no idea why, but it doesn't just run slower, it runs so slowly as to be totally unplayable. I posted a screenshot a while back of how bunched up the enemies are now on level one when I try to play GTD on my old PC. Same problem across three browsers, with a fourth browser exhibiting a completely different problem, where the game speed is noremal, but but the enemy movement is glitched, such that they all get stuck at the first checkpoint on the first level. I have no idea why this is happening, nor why the game is bugged differently on one specific browser (I think it was Firefox), but it's been this way for about a month-- starting well before the latest GTD update. Of course I've tried rebooting, and it had no effect. I guess I should try to clear the browser cache at some point, but I haven't gotten around to it. If GTD starts running "properly" on my old PC again, I'd be happy to compare notes with you, but I can't at the moment. I will say, though, about whether a great Opal is needed or not to get to the upper levels (>200), and about how many Jades are necessary: I've done at least another 15 runs without a great Opal on my new PC, all of which failed spectacularly as early as level 70, and none making it past level 140. The first run with a great Opal, I didn't get it until level 150 or so, and was about to lose otherwise, but the great Opal turned the whole game around and I ended up with another high score near level 500. I've had another couple of runs where I got a great Opal early-- between levels 50 and 70-- and each of those was incredibly easy to get high level high scores on, too. More to the point, though, is how much gold I was spending and how many Jades I had to build. In the run where I didn't get the great Opal until level 150, I was already building nothing but Jades for several dozen levels just to try to survive, so I already had at least 20. Once I got the great Opal, gold became an non-issue almost instantly because I already had more Jades than I would have wanted. In the two runs where I got a great Opal early, I tried to limit myself to just 5 or 6 Jades, and focus on Dark Emeralds and powerful attack towers (Blood Stones, Egyptian Golds, and Paraibas). Things seemed to be going well until around level 150. No ground enemies were escaping, ever, but I was still leaking anywhere from 4 to 7 air enemies. With the very fast increase in the cost of buying lives, even with a powerful layout with an early great Opal and no ground troops ever leaking, I would have run out of gold by level 180 or so had I not started furiously, and almost exclusively, building more Jades. I'm not sure yet how many I *really* need for my play style, but I estimate-- and again this is for a game WITH a great Opal-- around 17. Above 20 seems to be overkill. We may never be able to nail down specifically how GTD plays differently on your system versus mine versus @G's, or whoever's. And you may be right-- I think you probably are-- that your maze layout/strategy is a bit better, or more efficient, than mine. I'm also quite certain that the only reason you don't have a level 500+ high score is because you'd need a PC with a lot more RAM to get that far without a memory crash. But all that said, even if your layout/strategy is a bit better than mine, I just don't think it can even possibly account for the WILD, gigantic disparity in our experiences, both in terms of how many Jades are needed, and whether you need a great Opal to get to high levels. It's not as if you're saying, "you only need to build 6 or 7 Jades" and I'm saying I need to build 9 or 10. I'm saying I need to build THREE TIMES AS MANY, even when I have a great Opal (and a layout already boosted by a Black Opal, with Paraibas and Golds covering most of the maze, and at least a couple of Blood Stones). Since the last update, I can't get past level 150 without a great Opal no matter how good the layout is, nor how many Jades I build. In any event, I appreciate the discussion, as always. . . cheers!

216 - 2021-11-13 22:03:34.448021

@Peter: At lvl 120 there is already ~120MB : https://imgur.com/a/BYnAml5 lvl 162: ~270 MB . I can add more images if needed @WGW: I have an another idea for comparing game speed (look at 2nd pic from link above), at start of wawe enemies appear every 1s, right? So if game runs faster, the distance between enemies should be bigger. But i remember from flash, the speed of wawe 41+ is 6.92 half-tiles/s, so 3.46 rocks/s, it seems to be correct for me. Looking at your eariel pic from wawe 150, distance between enemies is same as for me (due to some speed bugs, slowing effects nearly no work). I can see enough mistakes in your games that would cause no-GO run to fail. I agree, no-GO runs aren't easy now, ~15 more total leaks would make me lose (using 5-6 jades). I was afraid lvl 150, but i made mine maze longer before it and i got 0 leaks ( was close to leak 1). 10 leaks in lvl 100, 1 enemy had 1% hp... I observing flyers carefully if there is any slowdown. i think i noticed that few times, but temporary and very little (like 5-10%) - they was too short to affect leaks amount. If your game runs faster, upload pic or something, but for now i would say that GO is no needed in 0.6.0, but requied a lot experience and decent RNG (yes, i would lose is enoguh bad RNG, no doubt) now im in 162, leaking 3-5 flyers, rather i dont afraid losing ( ready for -10 lives in lvl 200)

216 - 2021-11-12 20:00:58.076556

leak is noticeable near lvl 150 and accelerates quicly near lvl 300 ( over 1 GB at this point)

Peter HOlko - 2021-11-12 19:44:38.097661

I'm trying to reproduce the memory leak on my Macbook Pro and at level 38 I don't see any memory leak at all. See the screenshot here: https://imgur.com/a/HrMp7km Could someone open Chrome Dev Tools and click on the Memory tab and show me what it looks like when the memory leak is present?

Peter Holko - 2021-11-12 18:13:14.415374

Sorry, the sandbox is working now: http://45.55.255.26:10001/

Lucia - 2021-11-12 15:43:41.462801

@ Peter H: When the game is over and you can add your name and email to the leaderboard, the letter " R " is not excepted.

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-12 6:00:19.113512

Sheesh, can't spell, but you hopefully get the picture. I did try reading through the javascript around enemy processing and removal, but it's a difficult read, it was minified to mostly unhelpful variable names and pretty impenetrable with its !0 trues and !1 falses. Still have a hunch it has to do with projectiles that hit dead enemies.

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-12 5:41:19.468738

My idea around memory lead based on 216's one-godly-uber memory amount vs my own too-many-uber memory amount.. Is that it might have to do with the animations of attacks that hit enemies which have already been killed? From a code-sense perspective I can imagine removing an enemy and un-parenting targeting attacks in a memory-leaking way. Not about to try to diagnose whether that is happening in 50k lines of javascript but it does seem like that tracks with being less of an issue since 216's cheat game had fewer other towers able to attack the enemies that would be dying to uber.

WGW - 2021-11-12 1:00:10.859767

@Peter H: The link for sandbox mode doesn't appear to be working ("This site can�t be reached"). Just a heads up. Perhaps it's temporary, so I'll keep checking. @216: Will reply to your comment shortly, thanks. For now just wanted to post about the sandbox link not working. :)

216 - 2021-11-11 22:43:52.547691

@WGW: I thought there is a point where getting faster PC doesn't matter - where enemies are running at "normal" speed (same speed as in flash version). If i'm wrong, then i agree, no reson to compare our games. There are reasons why i think that mine PC is fast enough and i would get(on any fast PC) lvl 200 without GO and so much jades - but ok, i'm not sure You said that diffence is visible in wawe 1. Is possible to measure somehow that game is going faster on your PC? For example if build malachite (no gems on path) in c6+[1,1] position, im getting 41 time(41 real second too) after wawe 1. To make that position more clear: | #M ###----- (exit) (too lazy to upload pic) Tested it on laptop, also 41 I was suggesting that time affect memory leak - because from many obsvervations it seems to be true - less time in lave lvl give less memory in most cases. I never said its only factor. tbh i've never though that time affect leak directly - but by more projectiles shoted, longer ground walk or sometihng else. Ofc performace difference is major bug that make highscore list rather worthless. I observered many times slowdown, it even saved me from few leaks few times, but most often game runs in "normal" speed. that slowdown was often unexplainable, sometimes game was running so slow, then after some time (in same game) it got fixed. Hiberanting PC many times could be a reason. i often call that slowdon as lag too. I can imagine that happen at wawe 1 on slower PC, but i thought (i still think actually) mine game runs at "normal" speed. I know that even little slowdonw is helpfull, so i though i know what you are talking about (I read every your comment at least twice). When i was looking at your screenshots, i saw some things that could be done better. But since im not sure, ok, no reason to dicsuss about it

WGW - 2021-11-11 19:44:03.595089

@Peter H: I'll see what I can do testing-wise with the new sandbox mode-- thanks for putting that together. :) @216: I've tried to explain this before-- when I refer to performance differences in playing GTD on different PCs, I'm NOT talking about "lag", I'm talking about the entire game speed being GLOBALLY affected from level one. You couldn't know what this type of slowdown even looks like until you've seen how the game runs on a much faster system than yours. But you still generalize out your experience of playing the game without taking this into account, seemingly ever, not even as a possibility. I've seen the performance difference with my eyes, due to having upgraded PCs. I'm not lying. I'm not making it up. I know how to play the game very well. I was able to scrape by in runs without a great Opal when playing on my old PC, and I can't ever manage it on the new one. It's not due to bad RNG. It's not because I'm building too many Jades. What I wrote was that I start building tons of Jades **BECAUSE** I'm starting to lose ground every level on gold-- it's a REACTION to the game slipping away, not a DESIRE to build 20 Jades. I'm also not the only high-scoring player in these comments who has noted the exact same thing (@G, for one), that we're *forced* into building many more Jades than we would want to. It's actually no fun at all playing this way. I mean, I saw your level 300-something screenshot where you built-- what?-- three Jades total, but you were leaking basically nothing for hundreds of levels. Even when I have a great Opal, I still need to build at least 7 or 8 Jades. The game DOES NOT play this way on my PC. It just doesn't. Full stop. It's not even close. You've helped me understand a bunch of gameplay elements (most recently, what "aura" means) which I appreciate a lot. And you've corrected me on a number of things I've been outright wrong about-- I greatly appreciate that, too. So no hostility on my side, really. None at all. But it does feel rather pointless to keep going in circles about our different experiences playing the game, if you're going to reject completely that this could be due to playing on different systems. What's the alternative? Do you just think you're THAT much better at playing this game than I am? Along those lines, remember that I was proposing that the memory leak was probably mostly affected by the number of towers quite a while back (as opposed to your attributing the memory leak to how fast your run is going.) We went back on forth on this how many times? Glad you agree now. So maybe. . . just give me a little credit here for having some idea what I'm talking about. Sometimes I actually can be correct on these things, even despite all the things I mistype. ;) Best regards.

216 - 2021-11-11 17:02:36.753141

@Peter: Someone got 800 MB leak using only Uber Stones and few Opals, while i had only ~200 MB at pic on mine previous comment (we did override on game.js to allow get Uber). So looks like there is no specyfic tower that cause leaks, but generally more attacking towers - faster leak. Thanks for sandbox.

Peter Holko - 2021-11-11 16:26:57.402440

@WGW: As requested, I've setup a sandbox available here: Please let me know if you can determine which gems are causing the memory leak. http://45.55.255.26:10001/

216 - 2021-11-11 16:21:14.199420

I got over 1 milion crit dmg. Still small memory leak, 220 MB by chrome tab. https://imgur.com/DtpQQrT @WGW: i think making too many jades is one of mistakes that cause to lose no-GO runs. Need to place EEs and EGs in key locations quickly to reduce leaks. Notice that jades give way more in later wawes, no reason to make much of them early. I agree with rest things that you said about GOs, they are really gamechanging. I didnt do no-GO runs in 0.6.0 yet, but i dont think that few more leaks in lvl 100 would change it. I had 3-5 jades mb i will need a bit more. I rarely get lags that makes game easier

WGW - 2021-11-11 7:35:50.343471

The memory leak is of course the most critical problem, but it also only really affects the few players who play the game above level 200, 300, etc. Almost as critical, and this effects EVERYONE, is that the game plays entirely differently on different systems, as I've written about before many times. I don't mean that the more memory your computer has the more the game can leak memory before crashing-- I mean system specs affect the speed of enemy movement, tower fire, and amount of enemy damage, and this drastically changes how you have to play the game on faster PCs. Additionally, on the actual gameplay side (and again this is something that affects EVERYONE who plays this game, not just the ones playing to level 200+), I'm now of the mind that the bug with respect to combining gems "out of order" REALLY needs to get fixed at some point, too, because if you know how to exploit the bug, it COMPLETELY warps the game. Essentially, you never have to draw more than one perfect gem of any type per GAME, and can just keep creating special towers endlessly without ever consuming the perfect gem. Needless to say, having to only get one perfect gem of each type for an entire run fundamentally changes the game. @216: In my experience, a Great Opal is a necessity to get past, say, level 150-ish now. If I don't get a great Opal my runs are usually over by level 120 or so. Part of this, as I keep saying, may be due to the game playing very differently on your computer than it does on my new one. But I sure as heck know this game and know how to play it, and I sure as heck play enough runs (I pretty much always have one going), and I can no longer get past the low 100s unless I get a great Opal. Bear in mind, too, that you will now lose anywhere from 6 to 10 lives due to escaped enemies on "no stun" levels every 50 levels. This is a total non-issue in any run with a great Opal, but otherwise (at least on this computer) if I have no great Opal, then I'm forever scrambling to stay ahead of the increasing cost of buying lives and end up building nothing but Jades for 50, 60 70 straight levels because it's the only way to keep ahead. .. unless I have a great Opal. I'd prefer it if the great Opal gave you an advantage (e.g., faster levels), without it being a requirement to cross certain thresholds. Yeah, they're not all THAT uncommon, but you can easily play a half dozen runs in a row without getting one. This would like not being to kill any air enemies after level 150-- I mean none--- unles you had a great Amethyst. It places too way too much weight, with far too great a reward, on a completely random chance event that you can't count on happening in any individual run. Meanwhile, you get runs where the game keeps throwing great Opals at you left and right-- I had one run recently where I had FIVE of them by the end, and that's not counting the ones I didn't even keep. Great Opals are just way too important in the game-- even if you are able to work around not getting one. Again, it's one thing if getting a great Opal can cut down your time score; it's quite another thing for it to be next-to-impossible to get past level 150 without one. (This was never the case in the Flash version.) Bottom line for me is, we're not all really playing the same game if it doesn't play out the same way on different systems, so direct comparisons (such as, "No, you don't need a great Opal" just because GTD plays that way for you) may be truly impossible. When I see that @216 is able to stop ALL leaking air enemies very early in the game, whereas for me, in successful GTD runs with a great Opal and 10 other great gems, I'm still leaking 1 to 3 air enemies at level FIVE HUNDRED, at a point where there is literally nowhere left on the board to put a new gem where the new gem could even theoretically do anything useful. . . well, again, we're just not really playing the same game here. These three top issues (the memory leak, the variability in how the games plays depending on system specs, and the "combine special out of order" bug) are all conspiring together at this point to make virtually meaningless any distinction between a high score at level 200 versus one at 500. And bear in mind, I say this as the guy with the current highest score (both before and after this last update), and as one of only two people who got above level 500. If anyone should have a motive for the game staying unchanged, it's the guy with the top score. :) But I would much rather have some real competition with folks who also play the game well, rather than having the top score mainly because (a) I have a higher end PC now, and (b) I'm an obsessive compulsive lunatic who will play a game like this for 4 days straight just to get to a little bit higher.

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-11 2:13:55.964668

Oh you're doing it with a single uber that gets to insane level? That is smart, my layout looked more like this https://imgur.com/vVtDdhA (it wouldn't have made that much of a difference to be more efficient with the couple of gaps I did leave, at most 20-30 levels)

216 - 2021-11-11 0:58:45.450696

i did similar cheat to get uber, and im now in lvl 300 and there is almost no memory leak. I have towers with auras, so they rather aren't reason. funny to watch crits, everything die before c2. It can one hit any lvl flyer if good RNG (its getting ~99% of kills, so flyers never will have enoguh hp to survive strongest crit)

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-11 0:55:18.669376

Can only get to level ~300 using cheat game.js that always gives uberstones. Run out of room at that point because I can never convert a gem back to rock with special combine. At that point there is 800MB memory usage by my chrome tab, if someone else who gets to 300 regularly wants to compare numbers.

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-10 20:59:01.583560

Yeah I just used to be wrong and today I learned that fact. I don't know where much info about Uber Stones is communicated apart from game code which I wasn't able to read when it was a flash game. Great opal sure has a lot of influence on ability to play a deep game, even if it isn't strictly needed. I would say that at my skill level it is needed. Anyway maybe I can use local game.js mods to figure out this damn memory leak everyone is mad about and see whether I can enable the True end condition - no more room to place a gem.

216 - 2021-11-10 20:37:16.508154

Uber Stone always was from 4 perfects, now due to combine amount bug need probably 5. Late game is not balanced (in addition to memory leak/ performace problems) I don't think that GO is needed now to get 200+

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-10 20:21:25.112378

"A bored god plays gem tower defense" - https://imgur.com/uT12jad Easy to modify game.js with local override to make every random draw a perfect opal. As an added bonus, round 1 you only get 2 random draws so you get great opal, then every round afterward you get uber stone. I want to make clear, this is NOT what I did to get on the leaderboard, and I did not submit this game, I just wanted nice cathartic footage of the uber stone getting to exist in a map.

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-10 19:01:36.438601

Interesting, I always thought that the UberStone was special combine from all 8 greats like the infinity gauntlet of Gem TD. But looking at game code it is just the natural combination of 4 perfect gems of the same type on a draw. I am going to try to do some messing around with the javascript same as when I made the "9007199254740992 - It can be beaten" video (yes, same person hello), and get an uberstone or two.

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-10 18:13:43.372008

For anyone who cares, here was my maze https://imgur.com/84YWZBh, at least the last screenshot I took before I started to try to kill it.

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-10 17:58:19.315120

Yeah the "type gems here" got me twice at first and somehow I realized on my own it was a bot prevention measure and just typed gems. Anyway just did a game that went well enough to convince me the game isn't playable long term. I had lag bad enough that I mercy killed a run. Great opal from level 78, from there I was making more than I needed to spend to recover the 3-4 lives lost every flying wave. Starting with level 260 or so I tried spending all my money on repicks to get more greats and had 5/8 when I went bankrupt and wanted to stop playing. Fortunately I had easy ways to break my maze to let myself die. Would be interesting to see if the late game can be addressed.

SAM - 2021-11-10 16:03:37.906252

heh. I finally figured out how to comment on this. Where it says "Type gems here", you literally have to type the words "gems". Is that intentional? Poor man's captcha? Coincidence? I tried many times, and the comment didn't take until I did this.

SAM - 2021-11-10 16:00:53.004192

Is this this comment going to make it in?

biggiemac42 - 2021-11-08 20:43:05.979252

Hi there, thank you for continuing to keep the game alive, just re-discovered it. I found a couple bugs with buttons. Refresh browser (chrome for me), start a survival game, place one gem, reset, select yes, start a new survival game, reset without placing anything, select no. Now reset button disappears. Another: get to max gem chances, and then lose, your next game will say "Gem chances" (uninteractive) instead of "Upgrade chances", so it will be stuck at min chances until you refresh page.

WGW - 2021-11-06 11:55:00.306066

And now I see where the confusion came from, because I didn't realize I typed "upgraded" instead of "un-ungraded" in the comment you were answering, @216. I meant "un-upgraded bloodstones" do damage both by firing and area of effect. Sigh. Sorry for the confusion. It's gotten very, very late-- I was staying up just to finally finish off the run I've had going for 4 days. Time for bed, I think. . .

WGW - 2021-11-06 11:52:09.452570

And again with the typos-- "ungraded" and "upgraded" in the comment below should have been "un=upgraded", which I mistyped three times. . . .

WGW - 2021-11-06 11:50:22.815068

@216: I think you misunderstood me. I didn't say that ungraded bloodstone don't fire. I said, "An upgraded blood stone does fire, but it also does separate damage, per the description, to 'nearby enemies'". In other words, it does damage both by firing and by area of effect. I was going on the apparently incorrect notion that "aura" meant towers that do damage without firing (which ungraded bloodstone do, though they also do damage by firing.) Thanks for the explanation of what "aura" means!

216 - 2021-11-06 11:04:14.910541

@WGW: BS doesn't fire?? it have aoe dmg, as some other towers. Aura is an effect applied to towers/enemies within x range of object that have an aura. Since aura rage is displayed as green circle, its easier to know which gem have an aura( sometiems aura range is same as tower range so its less visible). +1 for sandbox mode.

WGW - 2021-11-06 4:29:57.804033

@Peter H: If there's still a sandbox mode available, like with the Flash GTD, I could do test runs that way, without having to worry about losing the game. It'll take a long time, to get to a high enough level for real testing, but I'm definitely willing to try it. I just can't find the sandbox mode on my own, if there is one.

WGW - 2021-11-06 4:27:45.106763

Yeah, I tried a couple of runs avoiding special gems and couldn't even get past level 15, even with having built ONE jade, just to earn some gold, I can't get anywhere in a run avoiding all specials. If I have to avoid simple opals, too, which aren't even special towers, forget it, it's just not possible to get even close to a high enough level to see the memory leak. I guess I don't understand fully what a gem with an "aura" means. I figured at first that it meant gems that do damage to enemies without firing any projectiles on the screen, which would apply to rubies, uranium, and un-upgraded blood stone. All three damage enemies without firing. (An upgraded blood stone does fire, but it also does separate damage, per the description, to "nearby enemies"). If all the gems you noted, @216, have "auras" (perhaps again you're going by the game code itself?), I really don't know what "aura" means at all. Regardless, you can't get very far in the game under these conditions.

216 - 2021-11-06 0:27:13.073215

BS/ABS doesn't have any aura, but opals, BO, paraiba and RC has aura, not only uranium/stars. I agree that is no way to get far without special gems, getting far without aura gems (so no opals) will be very hard too and will goes much slower than normal run. Unless with Uber Stone. Speed up button could help with such testing (assuming its possible at all).

WGW - 2021-11-06 0:02:25.755196

@Peter: I actually don't build any towers with special auras, assuming you mean specifically Star Rubies and Uraniums. I do build Blood Stones, but I've upgrade them all to Ancient Blood Stones, which don't have an aura, by level 100 latest (long before the memory leak really starts to grow). Here's a screenshot of my current game, memory leak at around 2.5GB (on par with last GTD version): https://imgur.com/a/9uyvPMG I can TRY to do a run without building any special towers at all, but there's no way I'd survive anywhere long enough in the game to be able to tell if that changes anything-- I don't really see the memory leak start to creep up until level 100 or so. By level 150, it's growing every level, and the rate of leak is itself growing. I doubt I'd be able to get past level 20 without any special gems at all, but I'll give it a shot. I really appreciate that you're still trying to nail this problem down!

Peter Holko - 2021-11-05 5:54:42.735770

@WGW Would you mind testing for me if you see the memory leak if you do not use any Special Towers or at least avoid using Towers with Auras. I'm trying to narrow down the exact cause of the memory leak.

WGW - 2021-11-01 1:28:19.478757

Just ended a game post level 500, which would have crashed due to the (still unfixed) memory leak in another dozen levels or so. The game as using just over 4GB of memory, which is on par with the memory leak in the prior version of GTD, ao it sweems clear that the leak isn't plugged yet. I would have liked to keep playing to the point of a crash to better judge when it's necessary to quit the game, but I just couldn't bear sacrificing a high score after four+ days of playing. Also, I know that the high scores will all be wiped (archived) if and when the game is updated again, so why push the limits. . . Suffice it to say, the game still needs to be fixed regarding the memory leak; and I'd add that the recent change to disable all stun effects every 50 levels is pretty pointless and unnecessary. But again, I don't want any of my comments to come off as complaining about a game that is 100% free and can only be updated when the developer, Peter H., has the time to look at it. I just hope to be able to give pointers to future updates, if and when they happen.

WGW - 2021-10-30 18:40:52.187034

Again, with the typos-- I meant "every 50 waves", of course, not 60.

WGW - 2021-10-30 18:40:08.584973

I was just about to post another comment confirming that this "no stun" thing is happening every 60 waves exactly. I suppose, @216, you've figured this out by looking at the game code, which I still don't know how to do no would I probably be able to interpret the code if I saw it. I don't know Javascript. It's an odd mechanic to introduce, especially without anyone having any indication that it exists from any game instructions/documentation. And because it barely has any actual effect on the game-- the worst it will do is to screw up someone's run who's not expecting a "no stun" round and loses either because they don't have enough lives bought, or because their "gold budget", so to speak, didn't allow for an extra 6-8 enemies to escape unexpectedly. It doesn't change one's strategy in any discernible I can see, other than to make sure you always have at least 11 lives bought (which is trivial), and enough Jades to earn a gold cushion for the extra leaked troops (also pretty trivial). Really a very odd game design choice. I don't really mind it, but I don't see what the point is. And it sure confused the heck out of me for the last 12-15 hours or so.

216 - 2021-10-30 17:29:11.926446

@WGW: its not bug, survival every 50 wawes have stun immunity now. I don't like this idea, partial stun resistance would makes more sense.

WGW - 2021-10-30 2:07:30.595989

"I just saw it happen again, on level 250"-- I meant to type on level 350, not 250.

WGW - 2021-10-30 2:05:51.523950

@Peter H: I've observed a new, and VERY strange bug, in which occasional levels (both air and ground levels) unfold without any stun effects working. I first noticed something strange somewhere around level 200, when a ground level leaked 7 enemies, well past the point in the game when there were no ground enemies leaking, ever. But I wasn't actually looking at the screen when it happened. It happened a couple more times, say every 50 levels or so-- once on air enemy level where I actually was looking at the screen, and saw that not a single enemy got stunned even for a moment, not even once. I just saw it happen again, on level 250, where I just leaked 6 ground enemies because not a single one got stunned. Ordinarily, almost all the ground troops are killed by the fourth, or maybe fifth checkpoint. When the stun effect of gems is working properly. I have no idea what could possibly be causing this, but it's sure happening. It doesn't greatly affect the game given how much gold is saved up already-- I can afford to leak extra enemies every 50 levels or so. But something is wrong, and this is not a bug I ever saw before the latest update. Very weird. Don't mean to pester with bug reports, but wanted to at least let you know!

WGW - 2021-10-30 0:59:20.106936

@Peter H: Here's a screenshot of my current run, at level 336. At this late stage, the game's leaking the same amount of memory it did in the last version, around 1.8GB. https://imgur.com/a/kc32EfX Though I'm completely unschooled in Javascript programming, my gut feeling is that it's the Javascript platform that's leaking the memory rather than anything that's wrong with the game code per se. I guess I'm just hardpressed to envision what the code itself could be doing to leak memory this way, as opposed to the game having triggered a memory leak problem in the platform itself. But I don't really know what the hell I'm talking about. I guess I'm just saying, I suspect that this is not going to be easy to fix, as I suspect it's not the result of something obviously amiss in the game's programming code itself. But again, I have no idea what I'm talking about. :)

WGW - 2021-10-30 0:55:10.502190

@216: I can confirm you're right about the "out of order" combine special bug, or at least I've now observed the same thing-- that the game consumes the wrong gems, rather than consuming an extra gem (at least in certain circumstances-- I could swear I've seen the game also consume an extra gem, but maybe not.) I had a perfect amethyst and two flawless amethysts on the board, and when I got a flawed diamond, I did a combine special on the second flawless amethyst (i.e., the one I placed second), and I got an Egyptian Gold which consumed the two flawless amethysts and the flawed diamond, leaving the perfect amethyst behind. s I wrote before, I don't experiment around a lot this way, but I'm far enough in my current run that I could afford to see what would happen, and it confirmed what you wrote.

WGW - 2021-10-27 17:53:45.534268

@216: You may be right, considering that I've only actually observed this bug a few times. I don't really spend time testing and experimenting in this game, I just play it, so naturally I've tried to make sure I don't trigger the bug and almost never do. At least now I understand that we are in fact talking about the same thing. I just realized that I ended my current run by accidentally shutting down the PC instead of going into suspend mode, dammit. So I'll have to start all over again, which I'm not terribly inclined to do today. I got far enough to see that the memory leak does not appear to be fixed yet, though.

216 - 2021-10-27 10:39:38.622238

@WGW: I've never observed case where 4 gems were consure instead 3, the problem was consumming wrong gems - that can cause to lose extra perfect gem INSTEAD other. It's importnat on which gem you click combine spsecial, only that part of special can be used twice - so combing on no perfect gem is safe. i noticed only first part of special can be saved. So, if you make PA before FA and fD, you can save. Some examples: PA FA PA fD [fD] -> PA - PA - EG fD PA [PA] FA -> fD - EG - PA FA fD [PA or FA or fD]-> PA - - EG PA PA fD fD fD [FA] -> - PA - fD fD EG (normally, becasue no extra FA to consume) The case of consuming 2x PA + FA happens often, because i almost always take early fDs. if i get PA after ,then another PA in good place for EG, shame to downgrade it (but worth, because this bug) ... or when i get FA is bad place, then PA in bad place and 2nd PA in good place for EG. Early fD are rarely well placed for EG.

WGW - 2021-10-26 23:54:36.915817

At level 150 now, memory used is 363MB, so it seems pretty clear that the memory leak hasn't yet been plugged. Screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/3mox8eJ @216: I'm not really clear on what you mean here. It is absolutely the case that making a special gem can sometimes consume an extra gem, depending on the order you combine them-- you're the very person who alerted me to this bug in the first place, which I hadn't even observed on my own. It seems like you're saying now that this doesn't happen? Huh? Or, if I interpret correctly, maybe you're talking about some other, separate very weird edge-case where combining two Perfect Amethysts and a Flawless Amethyst will create an Egyptian Gold? If that's the case, well, OK, news to me, but it's also completely new info and totally, totally, totally unrelated to anything I wrote about in the list of bugs I observed. I mean, TOTALLY unrelated. So how is this, even if true, a "correction" to anything I said? I'm very, very confused by your comment on this.

216 - 2021-10-26 20:28:23.706744

Im 99% sure that 4-combine bug is becasue selected gem in not couting for combine amount. Anyone can confirm that 5 chipped give normal now? Correction to WGW: there is no extra gems consumed, but EG can be made from PA+PA+FA for exaple (under some circumstances).I can exploit it to save perfect gems too. I can make list of bugs, but memory leak have prority.

WGW - 2021-10-26 19:31:29.078232

Correction: "(e.g., four normal gems combined gives you a perfect gem, when you should be getting a flawless.)" Strike that. Reverse it. "(e.g., four normal gems combined gives you a FLAWLESS gem, when you should be getting a PERFECT.)" I pretty much always mistype something that requires correction. Apologies!

WGW - 2021-10-26 19:23:18.598021

For what it's worth, here's a list of game bugs I'm aware of. This is only a list of bugs, with no requests for gameplay changes or new features. The memory leak is clearly the single most important thing, so I don't mean to bombard Peter with requests for changes. Just hoping this might be of some help, because keeping track of what's been discussed in the comments is. . . challenging. Minor: - "Upgrade Gem" button doesn't reset upon reseting or losing a game. If you've done all "Upgrade Chances", the button changes to "Gem Chances" and remains "Gem Chances" upon a new game, meaning you can't upgrade chances at all. A browser refresh resolves it. No real gameplay impact. - The gem recipes no longer have pop-up text. For veteran players, not an issue, but for folks new to the game, this will increase their learning curve a lot, since they can't see gem properties until they place them in an actual game. - Some pretty important info is missing from gem descriptions, most notably, there's no mention of Lucky Asian Jades earning gold, which new players really need to know. - No more multi-select of rocks possible as in prior version when holding down "shift". Useful feature from Flash version that would be nice to have back if possible. - "R" keystrokes are seemingly ignored out when entering high score text, presumably because the game is intercepting "R"s as if they were in-game keystrokes to remove rocks. Pasting text from elsewhere works around the issue. Major: - The game plays differently on different systems, and it's not related to display refresh rate. Per comments I've already left, the slower your system, the slower the enemy movement and tower fire. The in-game timer is unaffected. Even though everything seems globally slowed, enemies wind up receiving much more damage when the game is slowed. This is a separate issue from when the game is lagging momentarily in levels; this is a global phenomenon that starts on level one. This also is unrelated to display refresh rate, because in the comparisons I'm making between a new gaming PC (Win 10) versus a 6 to 7 year old one (Win 7), both systems are using a 60mHz refresh rate. - I love the new feature which allows more flexibility in creating special gems "out of order", so to speak, but there's something wrong with the code logic in that you will lose an extra gem under some circumstances. I think I understand what triggers it, but it would require a very long explanation and you're probably already aware, so I'll skip explaining. - As @216 has pointed out, combining four gems doesn't work properly-- you only get one level of upgrade when you should be getting two. (e.g., four normal gems combined gives you a perfect gem, when you should be getting a flawless.) I hope this is helpful, and if not, just ignore it. :)

WGW - 2021-10-26 18:53:48.110502

Hi, Peter-- Here's a screenshot where I left off yesterday: https://imgur.com/a/J0Bsetx The game's using 170MB of RAM at this point, which is on par with what I saw before the latest upgrade. But I didn't really start keeping track for any of those runs until level 150, so I won't really be able to compare until I get this run a bit further. If the game is using around 400MB of RAM at level 150, as in the prior version, then the leak is probably not plugged yet. I'll let you know. Resuming play. . . now. :)

Peter Holko - 2021-10-26 18:36:15.797803

@wgw Can you tell me how many towers do you have around level 100? And towers with auras such as uranium, blood star and others could be expansive, could you share how many special towers do you have?

WGW - 2021-10-26 4:14:48.894113

I've got a good run going (only at level 92 so far, but I already got a great opal around level 60 and things are looking good), will report in later (probably MUCH later) about any differences I observe compared to the last version of GTD. So far, it's looking like the memory leak hasn't been plugged yet, but I'll know much better after another 100 levels or so. Just want to say how much I appreciate the effort Peter H. keeps putting into this game after all these years, when it can't possibly be earning him even the smallest pittance for the time put in.

WGW - 2021-10-25 22:21:54.540461

I completely understand the logic if there are gameplay changes (even minor ones). And now that I see where the old scores are, no problem for me at all. :) Thanks, Peter and 216.

Peter Holko - 2021-10-25 21:32:14.738825

@wgw @216 There were a few small gameplay changes in the 0.6.0 release hence it is only fair to compare high scores at the same version. The old high scores are still stored but won't be displayed on the front page.

216 - 2021-10-25 21:27:57.852093

@WGW: i can see option "all" in high scores

WGW - 2021-10-25 21:14:23.116402

That is great news, Peter. Looking forward to the update. But. . . did you wipe the entire high score list? It sure looks that way, and honestly, I'll be pretty damned bummed out if that's the case after all the time I spent finally getting the top score. Cumulatively, hundreds of hours went into getting that high score. If it was unavoidable, then it was unavoidable (though I can't imagine why), but I sure wasn't expecting that and it will really bum me out if it's permanent. . . I don't even have a screenshot of it. :(

216 - 2021-10-25 20:17:02.936494

Great news! will 4-merge bug be fixed too? ( looks like it can be done by changing 1 number in code) WGW: Surely mouse wasnt main reason, but getting Great Opal instantly donwgraded was very frystrating. I'm also checking comments regulraly, even when im not playing. Btw, @frowny face was talking about uraniums (over 70 comment ago)

Peter Holko - 2021-10-25 16:22:35.645253

@wgw I finally have time to work on fixing the bugs in Gem Tower Javascript. I'm going to try to focus on the memory leak and the fixed time-step issue.

WGW - 2021-10-24 19:04:52.480205

@216: Yeah, I'm probably going to take a break for a while, too. It just takes too long and is too tedious to play games out to higher than level 500. It takes DAYS. And it's completely and totally boring after level 200. Maybe it'll be worth playing again when/if the memory leak is fixed, in which case the end-game state won't be averting a game crash, but running out of room for new gems. But even if that happens, it's only going to be MORE tedious and slow to play to the "end". It does seem surprising you're considering a break largely because of a broken mouse, though. A broken mouse would be a huge pain in more ways than just in screwing up GTD, right? They only cost a few bucks, but I mean no offense if money is so tight for you that you can't afford to replace a broken mouse. If not, though, just buy a new mouse, darnit. :) I'm not sure who else might have commented on uranium/star ruby, but I know I talked about it in an earlier comment-- I wanted to see if the display of the tower fire was part of the memory leak, and since uranium has no animation, I did a run building around 25 uranium, all in the lower left corner where they also weren't doing damage. Didn't help a bit. What does help (a bit)-- but makes the game even MORE tedious-- is keeping an eye on the cycling memory usage and when it hits the peak of the cycle, immediately minimize the browser. The memory jumps down to the lowest point in the cycle (say, 50MB lower than the peak), and if you leave the browser minimized for several minutes-- yes, MINUTES-- the memory usage will drop another 20MB or so. But as soon as you run the game again, of course, the memory usage resumes the cycle. I find that if you do this over and over again, you're more likely to end a level with the memory usage being nearer the low end than the high, and this seems to slow the rate of leak over time. Or, alternatively, I've just been wasting even more time doing this "minimizing" thing on some runs for no reason at all. If it really does work, it also makes an already too long game take FOREVER, and the benefit is marginal at best (possibly entirely imaginary, but I think it's a real effect). Anyhow, hope to see you back if you take a break. I'll at least be keeping an eye on comments even if I'm not playing for a while. Again, I really appreciate your suggestions and observations over the years. Cheers!

216 - 2021-10-24 18:33:13.758772

@WGW: (1) Yes, i didn't mean lvl and time are the only factors, but the main ones. Someone said that using uranium/start ruby helps. (2) I can stop leaking enemies(~60 hz monitor), even without lagging at all ( need more and propertly located EEs), but i focused on EGs ( some ABS after lvl 200 too). Surely, when flyers slows down by lag, kiling them is much easier. Anyway, I think im done with playing GTD for now, since i got downgrade click on GO ( because broken mouse double clicked). Need much time for hunting early GOs. Also im afraid to get 4 same perfect and being unable to make Uber Stone, cause 4-merge bug ( it would be very frustrating)

WGW - 2021-10-24 16:09:18.050060

Correction: In my last comment when I wrote "drawing lots of great opals" around level 240, I meant great gems. I already had two great opals, pretty early in the game.

WGW - 2021-10-24 14:44:09.200162

@216: Having played a few more long runs (several of which I lost to stupid things like power failures and Windows rebooting itself for an update), I can say the following with some confidence: (1) The memory leak is not as simple as time elapsed, nor time elapsed compared to what level you're on. It just isn't that straightfoward. My last run (level 509) I was consistently progressing faster than my best run (the current high score), but the memory leak-- which started out slower-- was still worse than the top scoring run starting around level 240 or so. That's around the point in the game that I started drawing lots of great opals. In keeping with other runs, I think the sourcce of the leak may be the number of gems placed on the board. Number of gems is of course going to increase as levels progress, but not in a 1 to 1 fashion, depending on how many great gems you get (saving two turns to build a special), special gems you can build in one turn (again saving two turns), and how many tourmelines you build (which take an extra turn). Initial observations would naturally point at elapsed time as the cause od the memory leak, but there's far too much variation in the runs I've played. I have not (yet) specifically kept track of how many gems I have on the board of these runs, and I think it would be exceptionally tedious to do so. (The game itself is tedious enough after level 200. . . ) But I think it's a pretty good guess. The more gems the game has to keep track of, the worse the memory leak gets. Again, that's closely aligned with elapsed time, but it's definitely not precisely the same thing. (2) The difference in how the game plays on older versus newer systems is actually quite huge. I have never had a run on the newer PC where I wasn't leaking air enemies all the way through the end of the game. There are ocassional levels where none leak, but usually I'm leaking at least one air enemy, sometimes as many as 3, all the way up to level 500 and higher, at which point there is simply no place left on the voard to place any meaningful gems, meaning you really can't strengthen your layout's attack power to any significant extent. Based on one your earlier posted screenshots, @216, you're not leaking air enemies at all. In almost all the runs I've played on my older PC, I was able to get the layout to point of killing all air enemies, too, though not as early in the game as you seem to manage. But on the new PC? It's just impossible. Because the game plays that differently. The enemies move faster, and take less damage. (3) I still can't play the game on my older PC anymore due to the bizarre total game slowdown that started only a little while for me. I'm guessing there must have been some sort of javascript update that's affecting how the game runs. Certainly the game itself hasn't been changed. But whatever the cause, the game remains unplayable for me except on the new PC. Which is just as well, since when playing on the old PC I can't get to anywhere near as high a level as on the new one, so why bother. But the game is substantially "easier" on the older system.

216 - 2021-10-12 9:40:59.512360

Mine PC is also 6 years old, but i dont observe more slowdown than it was always. It happens quite randomly, sometimes slows at lvl 50( but not as much as on pic), sometimes lvl 300+ is smooth. But as i noticed fire rate of towers is LESS afected by it. Timer aslo slows, but not much ( sometimes 1s last 1.5s, once i checked it counted 70s in 73s while enemies were like 3x slower). Less slowing fire rate of towers surely makes game easier, also aoe towers befinit much. That screenshot remind me v0.5.0 , where lag was extreme near lvl 100 and ABS was way overpowered aoe gem. Strange that game sometimes lags, while using only 2% of CPU. @WGW: I'm not suprised at all that same time on higher lvl has more memory leak. Surely lvl is main factor, then time. I tried to make similar statistic as you, finally i got a GO (in lvl 68), but because that lags, i was losing some time, also i was forgetting to write downs some values. Anyway i can paste it here if you are interested: lvl leaks EEs MB time 128 1 10 254 10083 132 1 10 287 10497 136 3 10 299 10917 140 2 10 310 11330 144 3 11 148 2 11 12160 152 4 11 363 12571 156 2 11 386 12993 160 2 11 422 13401 164 2 12 168 2 13 455 14265 172 1 13 467 14722 176 3 13 509 15145 180 3 13 529 15627 184 3 13 188 4 13 555 16553 192 3 13 580 16977 196 3 13 613 17440 200 2 14 204 3 14 18338 208 3 14 670 18851 212 3 14 720 19360 216 3 15 220 2 16 224 2 17 839 20802 228 2 17 855 21283 232 3 17 873 21791 236 2 17 240 1 17 905 22909 244 3 17 935 23421 248 2 17 252 2 17 24392 256 2 17 260 1 17 1120 25429 264 2 17 1104 25889 268 1 18 1180 26431 272 3 18 1181 26927 276 0 18 280 1 18 284 2 18 1258 28403 288 3 18 1316 28899 292 3 19 1333 29364 296 1 19 1403 29860 300 1 19 304 1 19 1481 30823 320 2 19 1602 32774 340 1 19 1894 35169 352 accidentaly closed game (values after flying lvl) i didnt make screenshot, it was new maze with a lot of space for EGs, i had over 50 of them. Anyway time wasn't best, about 2k slower at lvl 100, then lost some on lags. I think hibernating PC many times wasn't so good.

WGW - 2021-10-12 3:12:45.329450

Screenshot of the slowdown I mentioned last comment: https://imgur.com/a/0JEEgUC Look how bunched-up the enemies are-- that's cause they're marching at a snail's pace. And this is level ONE. By level 30 or so, it takes over 5 minutes to kill all ground enemies, even though they're all getting mowed down before reaching even the second checkpoint. Totally unplayable this way-- but it sure is EASY. (Because, for some reason, when the enemy movement gets slowed this way, the towers also do a lot more damage, despite the tower firing rate appearing to be slowed down just as much.) I wasn't going to plat GTD on the old PC much at this point anyway, but I kinda doubt I'm the only one seeing this massive slowdown all of a sudden on older PCs.

WGW - 2021-10-12 2:58:56.872797

Is GTD suddenly playing VERY slowly for anyone else? It runs fine on my newer PC, but on my 6 year old PC it's running at about a tenth the speed it used-- from the first level-- even though the in-game timer is still ticking off in real time seconds. I've tried several different browsers, and of course have rebooted, but no change. It makes the game essentially unplayable for me on the older PC. Meanwhile, I just lost a game on the new PC at level 430-something, solely due to a friggin 15 SECOND neighborhood power outage. And this run had a slower memory leak than usual, would have gotten to, I think, around level 550 before I'd have had to end it. Phooey. (Or some other more colorful word.)

AIG - 2021-10-11 22:34:22.363967

I would doubt that its the same guy, I am actually working on a bit of a knockoff myself tho! It's a 3D version played along the surface of a cube that you rotate around

TP - 2021-10-11 11:34:07.186843

Is this game same creaters product? https://store.steampowered.com/app/1677300/Gemstone_Defense/ or Pirated version?

WGW - 2021-10-06 4:11:15.443150

I, for one, do not want to know what "it" referred to in the prior comment. . .

JINGLES - 2021-10-05 2:52:40.294545

it got harder..

WGW - 2021-09-30 10:54:36.847280

I've uploaded a spreadsheet tracking the memory leak across 4 games for the very few who'd be interested: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1L-lZDQvIvHmsPV1EukQRsIMzu5jIrwP1xQq2gmY8ydo/edit?usp=sharing The first 4 tabs are just the data for the 4 runs. The last 2 tabs are an attempt at a simple analysis, may or not be easily decipherable (or sensible). The only consistent, noticeable trends I see across 4 games with a pretty wide range of time scores (1 run on the old Win7 PC, the other 3 on the new Win10 PC): (1) Not only is the memory leak cumulative, but the RATE of the leak slowly but continuously grows. (2) The rate of leak is tied to more than just elapsed time. The one game here with the slowest memory leak, by far, was the Win7 run (labeled "Win7 Old Layout, L344"), which was also the single SLOWEST run of the 4. I ended that run at level 344 at ~60,000 seconds, with the memory leak at ~2GB. The memory leaks for every other run at 60,000 seconds were all WELL above 2GB. In fact, my top scoring, fastest run so far (labeled "Win10, top score"), was already leaking over 3GB at 60,000 seconds. That's a full 50% higher than the Win 7 run's 2GB leak at the same elapsed time. Yet I was only at level 344 at 60,000 seconds in the Win 7 run, versus level ***440*** in my top scoring Win10 run. So the leak clearly is affected by more than time score. One of the variables would seem to be your OS/PC specs. Now, all that said, I think faster times DO slow down the leak compared to other runs *ON THE SAME SYSTEM*, but there's more than that going on here. I have more I could blather on about, but I'm sure this already 10 times too long!

WGW - 2021-09-26 22:03:19.513308

@216: I honestly on't remember ever having had the top score, even for a short while-- I guess that was right after Peter scrubbed the high score list of spammed fake scores; as I (vaguely) recall, it wasn't long after that when folks like a/aznist, you, etc, beat level 196 (which, for those who don't know, was a VERY difficult thing to do in the prior version of GTD). I really appreciate your tips, which have been very helpful. I'm in the process of compiling a bunch of info on around 5 runs of GTD (both on my old Win7 system and my new Win10 system), which I'll share soon. I'm not able to answer your question previously about the level of memory leak in an earlier run, because I wasn't keeping track. I now have a spreadsheet with data on 5 "successful" runs. I also want to point out-- and might make a separate comment about this because it's so important-- that GTD DOES, in fact, run very differently on PCs with different specs. The timer is not affected (until very late in the game)-- it ticks off secondes in real time. But the movement of enemies, and the rate of tower firing, can get significantly slowed depending on system resources, which actually makes the game much easier. You'd think that if that the whole game is getting slowed down-- both enemy speed and tower firing rate-- that you wouldn't have any actual ADVANTAGE, but just that levels would take longer (in real time, not according to the game timer). But no, it appears, just as in the Flash version of GTD, that different system specs greatly affect how the game plays out. Basically, from what I can discern so far, it's much easier to play GTD on an older system to the point of "sustainability", where you're earning enough gold to not have any concern about running out. But getting the fastest timer score possible is greatly aided by having a higher-end system. Just a preliminary analysis-- will post more soon. I want to finish another couple of runs first, which are already in-progress.

216 - 2021-09-26 12:07:29.408629

@WGW: Nice score, funny GAq to take at the end. There was some when you had top score: http://web-old.archive.org/web/20200122183658/http://www.gemtowerdefense.com/highscore/ About "R" key: shift+ r stil removes rocks and type "R" in highscore text. Recently i lost GO run to no-memory raleted error (was some webGL errors in console), and since few days i have no luck to GOs (i reset games around lvl 70 if i dont have a GO, becasue best time scores requies early GO)

WGW - 2021-09-26 3:10:14.179882

I should have posted a screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/tmxWKxj

WGW - 2021-09-26 2:51:16.850526

@G: I completely agree-- keep that in mind when you see that I've just (finally) snagged the top high score. Even in the prior version of GTD, even before a few folks had managed to crack level 196, I never, ever, ever had the top high score because of jerks spamming the high score list (the stats for those runs were very obvious signs that the scores were fake). But I only got this far due to playing on a massively overpowered PC for what a game like GTD should ever require. The game should really be rewarding skill, not how powerful your PC is (nor how high your tolerance for boring gameplay, after level 200 or so, is). All that said, I'm going to enjoy the brief moment in time where I have the top score, until someone with a better PC decides to beat me. :) I will post some more info soon-- I've been keeping track of the memory leak and elapsed time of two games (one still running). I should also note that the "exploit" I mentioned in an earlier comment, where running two instances of GTD will slow the game down to the point that you can kill a lot more air troops (levels 40-100 or so), does NOT work on my new PC. It would seem that this only works when you're somewhat straining resources (even though a game like GTD shouldn't strain the resources of a 10 year old PC). None of this meant to be interpreted as complaining about a free game. I just don't feel great about having the top score largely because I just spent $1500 on a new gaming PC. . . :)

G - 2021-09-21 18:34:01.947899

@WCW: Getting the high score is the only thing motivating me honestly. It's as much a test of your perseverance as it is your computer's RAM.

WGW - 2021-09-21 13:22:09.725629

@216: I think I hae a good idea why the high score text boxes ignore "R" keystrokes-- "R" is the only shortcut keystroke Im aware of in GTD, to "remove" rocks. If there are any other keyboard shortcuts, I don't know what they are (none of this is documented as far as I can tell). So what's probably happening is that the GTD program is "intercepting" "R" keystrokes in the high score text boxes and registering them as requiests to remove rocks, whereas if you paste text from elsewhere that has an "R" in it, there's no problem because there's no actual "R" keystroke involved (within GTD). More soon-- working on re-creating my prior high score (currently at level 270). Thanks for all the tips. As I've said previously, being ble to get to higher levels is a product (in some combination) of your systemm's RAM, processor, etc, rather than my really deserving any credit. For what it's worth, I did not upgrade my PC just to get a higher score in GTD, but because of a a few other games I've wanted to play for a while which require Win10 and much better specs than my old machine. :) Here's hoping I quit my current run before the game crashes.

Martijn - 2021-09-21 9:51:30.349362

Somehow the game has stopped working for me after lvl 50 twice now. The lvl 51 enemies just never spawn? Weird.

216 - 2021-09-20 20:19:43.039674

@G: I can understand that need more jades if bad start, but you built 30(!) of them.. it takes 90 turns (-2 per each 1-turn jade). Also i reseting game if start is bad. @WGW: Do you remember memory usage near lvl 400? I think you should keep reducing times of your runs, in case of over 500 run, optimizing can save DAYS ( for me it took 2 days or less to get lvl 400). You made 50 EEs, while i had 21 ( at lvl 400). In fact i was leaking 0-3 flyers, but since it don't casue game over i accepted that. Making not too much EEs is a key to get better times. The places that you should NOT make an EE: - left side of map (that doesn't range c5-c6 road) - mid zone (exception for 1-2 of them) - left/mid part of "old" downline - that was great place in flash version, but here it no range c2-c3 road(right part can role as post c6 stunzone) - outside of GO range (but its obvious) Other notes on your 516 pic: -nice placed 4 GAq -good placed RCs and BOs out of mid zone( ussually i make them on mid to boosts lvl 100 time, i make 2nd BO in late game) - however, extra space on/near mid was used mostly for EEs , jades and 2nd malachite (what is for, 1-turn in lvl 2?)... wait there is even 3rd one. It's better to make an uranium than extra malachite. -lack of EGs near mid, which is great place for 100+ kills EGs (ABSs also not bad here, but kills should goes for EGs) You can try to optimize maze for more space near mid (i know, its not so easy) The importang thing for time score is getting GO quite early, do you remember when you got 1st GO? Anyway, congrats of getting higher lvl than i actually have even gotten! ############## Good that old comments are not removing as it was before. here is already over 100 comments (IMO 100 comment limit was too low).

WGW - 2021-09-20 17:26:18.254522

Well, I had the highest score game ever going on my new PC, level 541-- no major change in strategy, just getting further due to having a lot more RAM. Game was running smoothly until ultimately it crashed on level 541, using around 4GB of RAM (on a system with 32GB of RAM total). So I lost the best scoring game ever after playing for around 3 DAYS. At least I took a screenshot about 20 levels before the crash: https://imgur.com/a/bAo88kp The memory leak behaves the same on a much better PC running Win10. Having more RAM does, in fact, let you play the game longer before the memory leak causes a crash, but no matter how much RAM you have, the browser is going to crash long before you've gotten even close actually running out of memory. Most unfortunately, that there's no sign in-game that a crash is going to happen soon. The game was running smooth as silk for 540 levels, then it just choked. If I'd at least seen some slowdown happening, I might have ended the game on purpose, but no such warning. Congrats to Jason Sill, the guy who just posted a level 528 score-- the very same day I was about to post a 500+ level high score. But then the damned browser crashed!!! Is it really worth my spending another 3 or 4 days trying to get above level 500 again? No, it's not. But I'm sure I'll try anyway. . .

WGW - 2021-09-18 12:25:08.148276

@216: Yes, that is very weird about the game stripping out out the "r" character for high scores-- I noticed that myself when I was posting my first few high scores in the new version, that the website/game was just simply ignoring any keystrokes for "r"-- but at least there's a workaround-- pasting the text back to the GTD website from somewhere (anywhere) else. You can see that "r"'s are being stripped as you try to post a new high score-- the stripped "r"'s are all visibly stripped from the onscreen text before you hit the final "Submit" button (or whatever it's called now). Definitely a problem to be addressed, but issues #1 and #2 as far as I've seen are: (1) Plug the memory leak, and (2) make sure the game runs the same across all system specs. Better that GTD crashes "early" for users with very outdated systems than that the game would give an EDGE to people (like me, now), who have high-powered gaming PCs. This just ain't that kind of game-- which is part of why I love it so much.

WGW - 2021-09-18 12:06:06.220363

@G: First of all, I want the Uberstone BAD, too. So bad. :) I've had much the same experiences playing the new GTD as you-- most particularly with respect to the need for lots of Lucky Ancient Jades. It's true that the game is overall more "forgiving" than it was in the Flash version, but not with respect to the need for gold. You need a lot more gold to perservere now, but you're also a lot more able to earn it if you build lots of Lucky Asian Jades. And all the above said, I believe I've now observed a couple of instances (so far) of the game playing very differently depending on your system specs (at least within a Windows environment). This parallels some effects I was aware of in the prior Flash version, but is most certainly not analagous. E.g. In the Flash version, your processor speed (and maybe, secondarily, other system specs like total RAM) directly affected how GTD ran, to the extent that (as I've previously noted), when I upgraded my PC around 2015, I was able to shave the elapsed time for the same GTD runs I'd been doing for years at that point, by about 25%, with no change in strategy or maze whatsoever. Well, I just upgraded PCs after many years of resistance, this time to a fairly over-powered game machine, and i find (so far) that GTD doesn't run much differently on this new machine 10000x more powerful than the last PC on which I used to play this game, BUT-- I should (conceivably) have enough RAM to allow playing the game out well beyond where it crashed on my last PC. We'll see (at level 169 now). I'd be pretty surprised if the new PC crashes GTD at the same memory leak level-- around 2.3GB-- when this PC has 4 times the RAM. But we'll see! (and I will update). One other effect I've noticed, which is actually quite significant, I think, is that you can sort of "handicap" yourself by having the game run much slower if you run more than one instance of it-- at least in MY case, running the game on Chrome on Win 7, with one of two games I was playing simultaneously already at least advanced to around the 100 level before I observed the exploit. What this does-- at least on "slow enough" systems, is to allow you to slow the progression of a game to a crawl just by having two instances of GTD running (in Chrome, at least, in Win 7 at least, and with low enough system specs, at least), with the result that you can avoid leaking literally DOZENS of air enemies from levels, say, around 44 to 92 that would have otherwise leaked and cost a lot of gold (cumulatively). So I have more to say on this (not that I'd expect anyone to want to read more on this), but I think the tl;dr is, "System specs still affect how GTD plays, though not the same way as they used in the old Flash version". And I think that that the wildly varying experience between the experiences (so far) of an undebatedly very experienced/serious/successful player like @216 and my own (and @G's, and perhaps others') is more down to our varying system specs/platforms than anything else. I don't mean this, truly, to be be dismissive or condescending; I just happen to have had the rare "opportunity" to have done a major PC upgrade in the midst of both the development of the new GTD, and the last one (a few years back). This new PC is a (supposedly) gamer's PC, , so I expect to at least squeeze a few more dozen levels out of my vurrent run than I have so far. We'll see. :)

G - 2021-09-16 18:13:59.995190

@216: bad RNG early -> leaking more air units -> need more jade

216 - 2021-09-16 15:11:08.052292

Strange that i need to copy paste to write letter "r" in highscore text (but i can write "R" normally). I got better time in lvl 400 than expected, but a bit more memory leak than last time (2.1 GB at the end). It might be caused by amount of flamestrikes. @G: Why did you build so many jades? for me 3-4 are enough. The only reason that could be of that is leaking ground for better time, but still i would make less of them for that(I didnt leak grounds for purpose).

G - 2021-09-15 18:00:56.509217

Here's my latest one at lvl 400: https://imgur.com/WlSLRSj I got bored and suicided at 412. Things were definitely getting laggy by that point. Honestly this game becomes a game of chicken with the memory leak once you reach a certain point. I get really frustrated when I don't get to record my score, so I end up suiciding once I get bored. With that in mind, playing for shortest time makes sense if I want to get to a higher level.

216 - 2021-09-15 14:02:34.459500

Beat this lvl 200 time: https://imgur.com/dZVIM69 Funny that the fastest way to max chances is to make jade early. I got GT in lvl 18 this way. Leaked 0 in lvl 200 and 204.

G - 2021-09-15 2:26:09.187193

I want that Uberstone.

216 - 2021-09-13 16:04:17.993344

@WGW: 1. Aparently there was many things that you are missing form mine comments(espec from 2020). That "wall of EEs" was called a downline, which was mine first idea how i should play emeralds runs - the problems was how to force EEs to hit different targets, so i wanted to place them as away as possible(from c2-c3 road) to reduce their range. In this version downline needs to be placed 0.5 gems higher that in flash version. 2. ABS vs EG comparision: Its not so easy to compare them, because flamestrikes and kills change their balance. Assuming 0 kills, GO+BO (x2.8), pink weakness and 5 armor ther (average)shoot DPS is: EG: 180*1.3/0.75*2.8*1.75*0.769 = 1175.6 ABS: 200*1.3/0.8*2.8*1*0.769 = 699.8 Assuming target is stunlocked and ABS will cast flamestrike every 10 hits(4s), there will be 2.5 flamestrike avg active(1250 DPS), so 1950 DPS total from ABS But flamestrike dont benefit from kills, assuming 100 kills: EG 2351 DPS ABS 2650 DPS with 200 kills: EG 3527 DPS ABS 3349 DPS So ABS shouldn't take kills. Also it take some time to proc flamestrikes - ABS do less dmg in first few s. I tend to make them after lvl ~150 3. I'm thinking what you meant by "gems with a lot more dmg", lets compare DPS of some others with same assumptions: ABS: 1950 GAq: 1723 GA: 1413* EG: 1176 GPD: 1126 GD: 1009 PAq: 676 EE: 669 PTF: 592 + nova DPS (50 because mana?) U238:560 PA: 546* GT: 538 RQC: 529* GE: 484 (+25 from posion) GS: 431 GR: 402 LAJ: 389 GO: 388 MM: 277 YS: 215 MBO: 77 so only 3 gems can have better dmg than EG.. wait 4, Uber Stone 19789 DPS, but we can forget about it with 4-merge bug. Chance for 5 same perfects is 1:409600000 dmg of some gems is a joke in this version , GR,GE really sucks. * Flyers can have 4 armor, bt for comparision used 5

WGW - 2021-09-10 6:05:12.706888

@G: I only just now saw your comment saying you caught the Seinfeld reference. Glad someone got it! Otherwise, so far I've only used the high score text to complain about the memory leak. . . :)

WGW - 2021-09-10 5:39:19.124737

@216: Thanks for reposting the link to the screenshot-- I must have missed it in the earlier comment. Very interesting how you created a wall of Dark Emeralds on the bottom, which must create a nearly impenetrable barrier without having to completely flood the map with DE's like I do. And I'm surprised how many Egyptian Golds you build, too; I've been of the mind that they're mostly important for armor reduction, since there are gems that deal a lot more hitpoint damage. As soon as I've got enough EG's to consistently keep enemy armor down, I generally don't prioritize them. I think the upgraded Blood Stone is the most powerful now? It's hard for me to make these comparisons since the stats are only visible while you're playing and I'm too lazy to make a list of it all.) Maybe my current maze would work faster if I tried prioritizing the special gems differently, without having to change the layout. I'll give it a try. Regarding leaking enemies, I wasn't suggesting that you could leak every enemy on every level. That's obviously going to end the game eventually. And once you've got a strong enough layout to kill all air enemies, you CAN'T leak them, no matter what you do. You can only leak the ground enemies. In the old GTD, I would do an easy calculation of how much gold I needed to start leaking enemies at what level, so that I would basically end every run leaking everything for the last 30-50 levels. It shaved a good 25% off the time. But that was with my playing only to get to level 196, knowing I'd always lose at that point. In the new game, I just have the maze set up so that it only takes a switch in 3 rocks to flip from leaking ground enemies to killing them all. When gold starts to run low, I just close the maze up for a while to build gold back up. I also meant to mention, regarding my earlier comment that Jades seemed to earn gold even when upgraded only once, I must have been drunk when I saw that happening, cause you're right, it doesn't. I'm guessing what happened is that I had an only-once-upgraded Jade in that game, and saw my gold going up without seeing enemies dying, but that I was only not seeing the enemies die because some of them were doubled up (overlapping). My mistake!

216 - 2021-09-10 0:25:23.639993

@WGW: No way to leaking grounds every wawe (X^2+10 life cost) ... but mb it's not as bad idea to leak in some lvls after 300. In that run i surely didnt leak for purpose. Well, no posted score, but i made a screenshot at 324: https://imgur.com/zFP34ZH (link is also in mine comment from 19-07). I think the cost of life is enough proof. It wasnt ultra-fast run, i posted lvl 201 with 21k time(with very late GO) and 5,6k time lvl 100 NJC (this was VERY fast run, but stil possible to do better) Surely high amount of EGs(with kills) near mid is important. Early GO also helped here. Notice i made only 3 jades and still 2M gold. 29 EE were enough to leak 0 flyers in ~90% cases. In late game ABS have better dmg on stunlocked enemy. GAq overdmg EG singificantly (since its cd is now 350 instead 500), but getting great gems is question of luck. Note that dmg from EE is much lower than it was, cause green x1.5 multiplier(as well as others colors) is not implemented yet (while pink x1.75 is, idk why). Generally having too many EEs have bad impact on time scores, havning low-dmg hard stunzones is one of reasons. - - - - - - - About mazes/layout - yes, its important(but hard) to find better and better. But it have less impact in very late game. - - - - - - - HP of enemies is growing linear 4500*(lvl-30), x0.3333 on flying. But yes, it's fast, ground wawes in late game takes at least 150-200s, no matter how good start was (from 300 to 324 it took me ~3400s, assuming that 18 ground wawes lasted 3000s its 166s/lvl ) Seems like only way to reduce it would be Uber Stone, but 4-merge bug dont giwe me hope for that. to kill 10 enemies at lvl ~300 in 200s, while they have over 1000000 HP, need about 50k DPS in burst zone.. or at least total PDS from towers. lvl 0 EG buffed by BO+GO have 1175 DPS on 5 armor amethyst weak enemy. but having 30+ EGs with some kills at this point is not hard at all( in addition to other dmg gems) - resulting less than 200s. i think i saw an enemy losing near 50k hp per second, but not sure it it was in this run. So Its possible to get enough attack power to even better time, problems is towers cant waste their attack time. In mid game(100-150) wawes goes MUCH faster , near 100s or less , while first 50 wawes can be done in less than 3k s thanks to BS(s) ####### About Windowns and RAM i think i need to read more, but @SMS said that its more likely reason than browser( comment from 23-03) ####### Recently i noticed interesting bug: while i have all EE part i can click comine special on.. malachite. Accidentally clicked once and tranformed it into EE(with all malachite kills, but rather no worth anyway).

WGW - 2021-09-09 21:50:00.373931

@216: There's really no possibility whatsoever that Windows is limiting the RAM usage of processes when there's plenty of RAM free. GTD crashes for me when it gets to around 2.3GB of RAM usage-- just look at the minimum requirements for any semi-modern game. Newer games often REQUIRE 8GB or more to run. So no, it's not Windows itself dictating that the browser can only use 2.3GB of RAM, or no modern game with real graphics would ever run on Windows. Back in the olden days when RAM was much more limited, Windows would offload memory usage onto your system hard drive if usage exceeded capacity. That feature still exists (at least in Windows 7, which I'm still using), and it would make no sense for it to have been created in the first place if Windows was just globally limiting all processes to a fraction of available RAM. Regardless, there's obviously something wrong with GTD as it currently exists-- there's no reason whatsoever for a game like this to be using 2GB of RAM, of course. So we could go back and forth on whether elapsed time affects the memory leak, or what platforms folks are using, but the bottom line is, the memory leak just needs to get fixed (whenever Peter H. has the time to do it-- I'm not complaining. The game is free, after all.) As for comparing our respective time scores, well, obviously I couldn't compare to yours since it's not a posted high score. . . Not that I'm doubting you, but obviously, I couldn't compare my scores to a score that isn't there. :) As I said earlier, I think I could probably shave a bit more time off my runs with some really good luck and some minor tweaks to playing style E.g., making sure to leave a cleaner path for leaking ground enemies mostly outside the range of dark emeralds, so that leaking enemies makes a level go quicker. Otherwise, the ones that get stunlocked take FOREVER to kill and the levels where you leak can actually take even longer than not leaking. But I'd expect to maybe at best shave off another 10-15% in time score. Doing any better than that would, I think, require me to entirely change my maze layout, which I'm not too interested in doing at this point. It would require a lot of frustrating experimentation just to get to the point where I'd be doing about as well as with my current layout, let alone doing any better. That's not to say there aren't better layouts (yours, apparently), but I like mine. It works. And it's faster than (just about) anyone else's, which is good enough for me. :) I'm assuming that in the run you mentioned with that ultra-fast time score you were also leaking ground enemies intentionally? I can't see how you could possibly build enough attack power for a run that fast if you were killing all enemies on every level. Their hitpoints just get too high as the game goes on.

216 - 2021-09-08 13:12:17.315143

@WGW: 1. Your time score is better than others, but compare to mine at ~364 (when i accidentally turned off PC) - it was ~39k and 1.6 GB RAM 2. You complain about 3GB remaining - Windows limits RAM for proceses (as @SMS said), so im 99% sure that all pll that posted highscores were using Linux or other system. 3. Yes, in flash verion game was slowing so much in later wawes. note that mine best 196 yime in flash verios was near 20k, here i can do ~17, while enemies have more armor, so lag was slowing game, here it seems to be ok (at least untill some point).

WGW - 2021-09-08 8:25:21.474967

Also worth noting that in the Flash version of GTD, processor speed DID affect how the game ran. I know because I upgraded PCs at one point and was able to get much, much faster runs without changing strategy in any way. I don't know if the current GTD would be affected the same way by PC specs, but I do see a good deal of intermittent slowdown starting in the upper 200 levels or so.

WGW - 2021-09-08 8:19:15.845880

Doing pretty well now-- though it is frustrating to have to watch out for the memory leak and make sure to end the game before the browser crashes. In my case, it seems to crash when the leak gets to around 2.3GB (frustratingly, that's with 3GB more RAM still completely free). The last few levels end up really nail-biting, not because of anything actually happening IN the game, but because of the increasing risk of a memory leak-related crash the longer you play. There was some earlier speculation here (by @216, I think) that the memory leak might be correlated with the elapsed in-game time, and that, therefore, faster run times might allow you to get to higher levels before a browser crash becomes a threat. My recent experience sorta bears this out, in a very unscientifically, purely anecdotally, teeny sample sort of way. I've been focusing on reducing elapsed run times, and have been able to get to higher levels accordingly. My last run I had to finally end (biting my nails) at level 377, with 2.1GB RAM leaking. Elaped time this run and the times for the other runs I've posted high scores for recently are all far, far below the other high scores. I might still be able to winnow down the run time a teeny bit more, but not much-- the only motivation to even try being to hopefully squeeze a few more levels out of the game before purposely ending it to head off a crash. . . Frustrating. But I'll keep playing. And I might be buying a new PC soon, if so, presumably that will help work around the memory leak (my current PC is over 6 years old.) For anyone interested, here's the layout just before I opened a few gaps to end the game on the next level (377): https://imgur.com/mMNFHT2 Crazy how many great gems I was getting late in the game, when there was nowhere good to place them. I believe I had 10 great gems and 44 or so dark emeralds (which is too many, really).

216 - 2021-09-08 1:32:16.060613

I think i found a way to exploit emeralds in 0.5.4: 1. Dont make fT and FS before PE 2. After PE make rest parts( they can be random placed), but dont click combine special 3. After 3rd part make another fT/FS in good place for EE 4. make 1 more any EE part (fT/FS/PE) 5 click combine special on prevoius ( that well placed) gem. PE wont be consumed this way (even if step 4 PE). It should increase chance to get far in NJC ( but probably need GO to get any high lvl) That exploit should work when placed some gem more than once, but imporant is to combine special on gem next after placing 3rd part and having PE as fist part. for exaple: PE, PE, fT, fT, FS, [FS], fT - clicking combine special on marked FS should consume both FSs and 1 fT. i'm not 100% sure how it work yet.

German - 2021-09-04 10:39:06.189434

i think its the same bug as Chr3y, because it didnt consume my flawed sapphire.

German - 2021-09-04 9:30:06.116749

Loving this game so far! keeps me from being bored at work :) I found a small bug just now, i was combining a jade and it ate both my normal opals when i combined it on my second opal tower.

216 - 2021-09-02 1:47:18.956635

Naturally worth to make a BO as soon as you have 2 POs( but dont click combine special on PO, recenty i lost both by that). @Chr3t: It doesn't looks like it's always take last 3 ones. I didn't observed any case, where 3 same gems was taken. I'm trying to figure out how it works, exploiting this bug would help me in NJC. Bad news: I probably found (in code) a reason of 4-combine bug: it's counting other that selected gem for same-gems amount, so need 5 same gems(?). So getting uber stone in even more extremelly unlikely now. @WGW: acess to code? just open console in browser(F12 in chrome) and find game.js file. ( then i click "pretty print" to make it more readable, idk what is first ~50000 lines for, look like all game mechanic is near end)

Chr3y - 2021-09-01 6:09:48.872486

I also mailed a bug, where, when you DO NOT combine a tower immediately, and choose a different one from the last one, the game uses the last 3 ones, but not the right combination. (I cant remember the names, I'm sorry) f.e. you want a stun tower. if I start with a Green one, then get a blue one and get a yellow one. Do not combine. Build 2 other yellow ones, mark the second yellow one, and you get a stun tower, but with 3 yellow stones. Already mailed the bug with pictures of the stuff. Just wanted to be smart once.

WGW - 2021-09-01 1:28:31.627238

Crap almighty, I did it AGAIN, pasting a whole bunch of old text along with my comment. I will try to more careful about this, really. Here's the actual NEW comment I meant to add: @216: Since I don't have the knowledge/experience to acess the game code, and I don't have any record of the properties of gems in the old Flash GTD, I can't make the sort of detailed comparisons you've outlined. I only notice the really huge changes, like the elimination of the opal bug(s), the increased gold earnings of Jades, that sort of thing. I never even tried to play anything other than survival mode, so I'd also never notice changes in other modes. But one thing in particular that you pointed out, which I had not noticed but really should have, I think has proved to be KEY to why I was doing so badly for so many runs. I expect bad RNG every now and then, but not to the extent I was losing, and so badly, and so early, and so often, and I think the reason is the bug you described with respect to combining gems "out of order" (so to speak) sometimes consuming extra gems-- I saw it happen myself after I started looking for it, thanks to your heads-up, and I suspect I was losing a lot of perfect gems in a lot of runs without even noticing it, because once I "discovered" that you could do a "combine special" on any gem in the recipe, I started really abusing that feature. . . and likely lost a lot of gems along the way. In my current run, which again is without a Great Opal, I'm well into the "safe zone" (currently level 162) where it's clear I'm not going to run out of gold. I haven't been able to create a single great gem, nor any special gems on a single turn, and yet this run has gone 10 times better than my last 5 or 6. So I think-- though time will tell-- this is mostly down to not wasting gems through combining them out of order, and possibly also due to having built a Black Opal very early on, around level 40. I believe my first half dozen very succesful runs also had an early Black Opal, so it seems that building one early is a lot more important now than it was in the old version. Especially since the damage buff works properly now, rather than only affecting gems already on the board as in the prior version. You put a single BO down early in the game near the middle, and basically every gem you place after that is 40% more powerful. It didn't used to work this way! Thanks for all the additional info, most especially making me aware of the new bug with respect to combining gems out of order.

WGW - 2021-09-01 1:25:42.051398

There is many diffences bettwen flash GTD (list below) @WGW: 1. i didn't observe any gold gain from Asian Jades. Also checked in code, only maxed has a bonus gold chance. 2. It's possible to lose before 100 with very bad RNG (lack of EGs/EEs). But when builing more jades and not repicking as much it shouldn't happen... especially if you got a GO! How many leaks you had? I quite like that combinig special on any gem, but it makes game much easier - geting last EE piece in good position was a part of strategy, Now you can put early fT or FS and reserve that place it for EE. Also now worth to place fD early to farm kills, then make EG. Sometimes merging comsume 2 same gems, as some ppl noticed, so better not cliking combine special on perfect gem. List of other (than jades/combining) differences bettwen flash version and 0.5.4: -lives mechanic -towers/ enemies center point got changed, so towers range diffent positions -star ruby/ uranium burn dmg doesn't ignore armor now(strange), but possible it benefit from opals (need more testing) -aqua gems and malachite have now 350 cd (was 500) -some great gems got nerfed, so they sucks even more -dmg table doesn't work for other than pink dmg -gold form kills is not rounded down (also 2 more gold per lvl) -displayed minimum dmg is 1 less* than actual -aura rage in now displayed (thanks) -flamestrike last 2x longer (good idea imo) -4 more armor on survival -minimum speed bugs -wrong speed display -better displayed hp update -some display bugs with buttons -no-survival dificulties have 50 lvls instead 41 -strange disability to place gem near exit than would leave 1 half-tile space bettwen -less lag (but more memory leak) -no opal bugs, except SYS aura bugs -SYS same stats as YS bug ( it cause it really useless) -some reset game bugs *2 for EE, which have double dice roll(1-51) @216: Since I don't have the knowledge/experience to acess the game code, and I don't have any record of the properties of gems in the old Flash GTD, I can't make the sort of detailed comparisons you've outlined. I only notice the really huge changes, like the elimination of the opal bug(s), the increased gold earnings of Jades, that sort of thing. I never even tried to play anything other than survival mode, so I'd also never notice changes in other modes. But one thing in particular that you pointed out, which I had not noticed but really should have, I think has proved to be KEY to why I was doing so badly for so many runs. I expect bad RNG every now and then, but not to the extent I was losing, and so badly, and so early, and so often, and I think the reason is the bug you described with respect to combining gems "out of order" (so to speak) sometimes consuming extra gems-- I saw it happen myself after I started looking for it, thanks to your heads-up, and I suspect I was losing a lot of perfect gems in a lot of runs without even noticing it, because once I "discovered" that you could do a "combine special" on any gem in the recipe, I started really abusing that feature. . . and likely lost a lot of gems along the way. In my current run, which again is without a Great Opal, I'm well into the "safe zone" (currently level 162) where it's clear I'm not going to run out of gold. I haven't been able to create a single great gem, nor any special gems on a single turn, and yet this run has gone 10 times better than my last 5 or 6. So I think-- though time will tell-- this is mostly down to not wasting gems through combining them out of order, and possibly also due to having built a Black Opal very early on, around level 40. I believe my first half dozen very succesful runs also had an early Black Opal, so it seems that building one early is a lot more important now than it was in the old version. Especially since the damage buff works properly now, rather than only affecting gems already on the board as in the prior version. You put a single BO down early in the game near the middle, and basically every gem you place after that is 40% more powerful. It didn't used to work this way! Thanks for all the additional info, most especially making me aware of the new bug with respect to combining gems out of order.

216 - 2021-08-31 15:25:29.122389

Another bug found: combined 4 chipped ruby into flawed ruby.

216 - 2021-08-30 15:02:44.935531

There is many diffences bettwen flash GTD (list below) @WGW: 1. i didn't observe any gold gain from Asian Jades. Also checked in code, only maxed has a bonus gold chance. 2. It's possible to lose before 100 with very bad RNG (lack of EGs/EEs). But when builing more jades and not repicking as much it shouldn't happen... especially if you got a GO! How many leaks you had? I quite like that combinig special on any gem, but it makes game much easier - geting last EE piece in good position was a part of strategy, Now you can put early fT or FS and reserve that place it for EE. Also now worth to place fD early to farm kills, then make EG. Sometimes merging comsume 2 same gems, as some ppl noticed, so better not cliking combine special on perfect gem. List of other (than jades/combining) differences bettwen flash version and 0.5.4: -lives mechanic -towers/ enemies center point got changed, so towers range diffent positions -star ruby/ uranium burn dmg doesn't ignore armor now(strange), but possible it benefit from opals (need more testing) -aqua gems and malachite have now 350 cd (was 500) -some great gems got nerfed, so they sucks even more -dmg table doesn't work for other than pink dmg -gold form kills is not rounded down (also 2 more gold per lvl) -displayed minimum dmg is 1 less* than actual -aura rage in now displayed (thanks) -flamestrike last 2x longer (good idea imo) -4 more armor on survival -minimum speed bugs -wrong speed display -better displayed hp update -some display bugs with buttons -no-survival dificulties have 50 lvls instead 41 -strange disability to place gem near exit than would leave 1 half-tile space bettwen -less lag (but more memory leak) -no opal bugs, except SYS aura bugs -SYS same stats as YS bug ( it cause it really useless) -some reset game bugs *2 for EE, which have double dice roll(1-51)

WGW - 2021-08-30 5:51:21.148350

AAARGH!!!! Again I made a very dumb error in copying and pasting the below comment, which included text from a much earlier comment. Here's all I meant to post (apologies!): A couple more things I've only just noticed to be different than the Flash version of GTD (I'm sure this is all old news to everyone who's been playing the new version a while, like @216 and @G): - You can do a "Combine Special" on ANY individual gem on the board that's part of the recipe. In the old version, you were 100% restricted to building special gems using component gems in the order they were laid down. You still don't have 100% control over which gems are used to build a special when there are multiple possibilities on the board, but you have a lot MORE control now than used to be the case. I like it. - Jades upgraded only once now earn gold, too. Used to be that you had to fully upgrade (2 upgrades for 295 total gold) for Jades to earn any gold (and of course, even the fully upgraded Lucky Asian Jades in the Flash version earned far less gold than they do now). I was so locked in to expecting that I had to fully upgrade (2x) Jades for them to produce gold, that I never even *tried* to upgrade any of them just once-- I had just been waiting for enough gold to upgrade them completely. I was shocked to see one earning gold-- without kills, of course-- when only upgraded once. Even more surprising when you consider that nowhere in the official text description for the Jade does it say anything about it earning gold, at ANY level of upgrade.

WGW - 2021-08-30 5:49:42.996651

Well, well, well. . . I'm back to playing GTD, and couldn't be happier about it. I just posted the (current) highest score for the game, which I had to end intentionally due to system resource drainage, rather than actually "losing". In finally returning to this game since the original Flash version was involuntarily retired, I have to say I'm very pleased at the changes I see. I had tried to play the new post-Flash game when Peter first released it, but saw tons of bugs and ended up focusing on other things for a while, figuring plenty of other people would do the job of reporting the errors. But I just fired up the game again a few days ago, and to my delight, I was able to post the highest score yet. The main issue with the game at this point seems, to me, to be that advancing into really high levels becomes a huge drain on system resources, so rather than a strategic challenge, after level 200 or so, GTD becomes a "Manage your system resources" game to prevent a crash due to memory requirements, rather than anything IN-GAME limiting your progress. In my case, I had to shut down basically every program and background service that I didn't absolutely need to be running, in order to keep my PC from running out of RAM due to GTD's increasing requirements as you progress. Otherwise, I think the changes Peter made with respect to how gold/lives/escaping enemies work are a tremendous benefit to the game-- the original version devolved into "can you click fast enough to regain lives" after level 140 or so, and at level 196, a SINGLE escaping air troop enemy would immediately end a game you'd invested 10-15 hours into playing. The new system is much, much more forgiving, without breaking the essential game systems otherwise. It's maybe a BIT too easy now, but I say this as someone who has already invested literally years of my life into this game; I don't think (based on the existing high scores) that too many other people would find that these changes really make the game too easy. But from my perspective, the game (in survival mode at least) is now a matter of how many Lucky Asian Jades you can build early on (to earn gold), and how many Enchanted Emeralds you can build once your gold levels are consistently increasing. All other considerations, while not irrelevant, have become at the least *secondary*, to the primary goal of simply keeping your gold level high enough to withstand leaks. And if you focus on gold levels for the first 50 levels or so, repicks become basically free, making the actual survival mode GTD somewhat akin to the "sandbox" mode, in that you can feel free to repick and repick and repick until you get exactly the result you want. The original game required extreme care in repicks, which meant actively needing to balance optimal outcomes (ideal gem placement) against recourse cost (skyrocketing repick costs against earned gold levels-- gold accumlation was MUCH slower in the original version). But the real problem, to me, seems to be a matter of resource usage, in that the game uses more and more memory the further you progress. Once I hit level 150 or so, my concern was no longer that I would actually lose the game, but that my whole system would crash due to the increased memory demands with every level gained. The game itself was essentially unloseable by that point, but I had a lot of worries whether my whole PC would cry uncle before I was able to post a high score. I've also seen comments from others here regarding the game playing very differently depending on what monitor refresh rate you're using (i.e., using 120MHz makes the enemies move 2x as fast and makes the game unplayable). These issues are clearly not intended; no one intentionally designs a game so that losing the game is due more to your system specs than how you're actually playing the game. But I also expect (due to my own meager programming background) that these are MUCH more difficult issues to sort out than out-and-out bugs are ("bugs" meaning instances where the game is explcitly malfunctioning). All in all, I'm genuinely thrilled with this new revision of the game. I've only encountered 2 or 3 bugs at this point, all of which are very minor. The user interface is, imo, a bit more clunky now than it was in the Flash version. Otherwise, I think this is a much-improved game, and I heartily commend Peter Holko for re-releasing, re-developing, and re-thinking it. There's been a real hole in my life due to not playing GTD in the background literally ALL the time, as I had for a decade before the end of Flash. That hole is now filled. :) I still say, though, the fact that a few people had managed to beat level 196 in the original version continues to leave me humbled, since I was never able to come even CLOSE. I posted dozens and dozens of L195 high scores, but despite countless hours trying the so-called "emerald strategy" to get past L196, I never managed it, even with abundant help from the folks who did. So while I got past level 196 and way beyond in this revised version of the game, I will never lose my admiration for those who bested my best in the original version. I'm quite sure that any of you (a/aznst, 216, mmkay) could do just as well or even better assuming your computer specs are good enough to avoid crashes at higher levels. But that said, it still feels good to have the current highest score again, at least temporarily! My PC is almost 10 years old and has only 8GB of RAM, so I'm sure someone, somewhere will do better. But if Peter is ever able to revise the game so that system resources are no longer an issue (without changing any other essential elements of the gameplay). . . I don't think anyone can do better than with my strategy. :) It would be very interesting to see what kind of balancing/adjustments are possible to make the current game more challenging for very experienced players. For those who are interested (and if you weren't, you surely wouldn't have read this far to begin with), here's my maze layout: A couple more things I've only just notived to be different than the Flash version of GTD (I'm sure this is all old news to everyone who's been playing the new version a while, like @216 and @G): - You can do a "Combine Special" on ANY individual gem on the board that's part of the recipe. In the old version, you were 100% restricted to building special gems using component gems in the order they were laid down. You still don't have 100% control over which gems are used to build a special when there are multiple possibilities on the board, but you have a lot MORE control now than used to be the case. I like it. - Jades upgraded only once now earn gold, too. Used to be that you had to fully upgrade (2 upgrades for 295 total gold) for Jades to earn any gold (and of course, even the fully upgraded Lucky Asian Jades in the Flash version earned far less gold than they do now). I was so locked in to expecting that I had to fully upgrade (2x) Jades for them to produce gold, that I never even *tried* to upgrade any of them just once-- I had just been waiting for enough gold to upgrade them completely. I was shocked to see one earning gold-- without kills, of course-- when only upgraded once. Even more surprising when you consider that nowhere in the official text description for the Jade does it say anything about it earning gold, at ANY level of upgrade.

WGW - 2021-08-30 5:25:33.406736

Yeah, I don't understand what I've been doing so wrong the last few runs, but I can't seem to break level 100 anymore! The first four consecutive runs I played of this new version I lost two games post-level-300 due to the memory leak crashing the browser, then posted two actual high scores above level 300 (intentionally ening both before getting another memory leak crash), and ever since then-- at least 6 runs later-- I keep losing well before level 100. With no great changes to my strategy, and certainly not to the maze layout. Maybe I just got really great RNG results those games. . . ? But I don't think so because I didn't even have a great opal in at least two of them and still did FAR, FAR better than I'm doing now. Oh well, I'll keep plugging away. Makes it more interesting than if every game was a foregone conclusion, I guess. . . Good to know, per @216, that the ever-elusive uberstone DOES still exist in this version of the game. Thanks for the info. :)

216 - 2021-08-29 22:10:30.828310

The problem with space for gems will start at lvl 800-1000 (if maze if reasonable long), so untill memory leak fix/ speed up button let say that problem doesn't exist.

G - 2021-08-29 16:24:47.551548

@WGW: I just noticed your Seinfeld reference on the high scores lol @216: I disagree, but only for long-term play. I try to be intentional with the great gems because they take up three times the space as other towers (after you combine them). So you'll end up filling up the board faster. That said, I wouldn't call it a major mistake either.

216 - 2021-08-26 21:55:39.986215

If you focus on time score, ingroging GA makes a sense. For flyers GA worth. Taking any Great gem is not a major mistake (even useless Diamond), they are rare enough and 1 turn.

G - 2021-08-26 14:43:58.992345

@216: I think you've just convinced me not to use Great Sapphire anymore, but I'm still unconvinced about using Great Amethyst. Also, I just realized I left Lucky Asian Jade out of my list of towers previously. These are obviously essential if you want to make it to the top of the highscore list.

216 - 2021-08-26 0:23:45.299676

GS tend to steal much kills, its way better if kills goes to EGs! GA have 3.28x more dmg than GS (x1.75 from pink dmg works in htis version, other colors not), its a bit stronger than EG and have good range.

G - 2021-08-25 13:19:46.127397

@216: I like Great Sapphire because it has a massive range and can rack up kills if you get it early enough in the game, but I never put down more than 1 or 2. I don't find Great Amethyst to be very helpful after the early game as it barely puts a dent air units after a certain point. I also don't find Great Topaz to do enough so I tend not to build them. I do like a uranium if I happen to get it in a single turn, but I don't really look out for it.

216 - 2021-08-24 23:17:57.869525

In early game surely BS>ABS. Later i left 1-3 BS (with kills) unupgraged, if they are in good place for aoe. ABS only works well if there is enough EE for stun. I build only 2-3 BO, it covers all important towers. But what is so good in GS? Great gems that i like(besides GO): GA, GAq, GT. I tend to make 1 uranium, but its less important, because min. speed bugs

G - 2021-08-24 20:45:51.558468

@216: Do you prefer Blood Stone or Ancient Blood Stone? I find Blood Stone has advantages but they're only good if you get a high kill count. The towers I tend to build intentionally are: -Great Opal (1+) -Great Aquamarine -Great Sapphire (1-2) -Enchanted Emerald -Mystic Black Opal (4-8) -Rose Quartz Crystal (2-3) -Paraiba Tourmaline Facet -Ancient Blood Stone -Egyptian Gold -Mighty Malachite (1 to start the game) I tend to build perfect opals while waiting for a great opal, then I turn them into my mystic black opals.

216 - 2021-08-21 18:12:40.325040

Game got frustrating for me, because mine broken mouse often makes a double click - downgrade after combining... @WGW: 1) Nerfing Jades is not only thing to fix, late game when you can stun all flyers will be endless anyway, SYS is broken*, some great gems are not so great( GR, GE, GS imo sucks), someting is wrong with minimum speed in lvls 30+ 2) Maybe you can't get way better times, but mine times were x1.5 better (and probably possible to get better), so you can improve a lot. some important things: -Maze shouldn't be too long -worth to build more EGs, BSs/ABSs ( best dmg towers, maybe besides GAq) -dmg towers should target something most of time -try to avoid low-dmg stun zones (but sometiems they help for killing flyers) -in early game(60-) worth to optimize maze around BS(s) for good aoe (later it matter less) -kills on EGs/BS also matter 3) Chance for getting uberstone was also motivating me to play. I saw in code, it exist and have REALLY OP stats ( only minimum dmg is lower than in flash version). But it's ~1500x harder to get than GO... * upgraded version have same dmg as not upgraded, it overwrite 40% BO aura when gem was placed later than BO gem (gem that you click combine special counts)

WGW - 2021-08-21 5:06:25.920469

@216: It's hard for me to imagine doing much better in "time score", so to speak, than I've been doing (still only on about my 5th run)-- Maybe just a bit faster with truly exceptional luck, but I know my current time scores are pretty fast compared to posted high scores (even for the runs which I've lost due to crashes), and compared to my time scores in the Flash version. Without having to work around the restrictions of the prior version of GTD, levels go by much faster than in the old version, at least until you get to the really high levels, above 200 or so. I mean, you could VERY easily be correct that elapsed time is related to the amount of memory leak, it's just not something that, even if true, can really be taken advantage of in a major way. The memory leak just needs to get fixed (and, I would hope, the game mechanics rebalanced a bit). I'm in the midst of a game now at level 259 that's only taken (in seconds) 38,756-- which would have been one of my better (not all time best) time scores in prior GTD for all the games I lost at level 196, and this one has already gone 65 levels further. We'll see if Peter H has the time and energy to address this stuff in a future update, but regardless, for now, I'm just enjoying being able to again play GTD again in the background while I do other things. . . it sure would be great, though, if the memory leak were fixed and the game rebalanced (which might just not require anything more than nerfing the gold earned from Lucky Asian Jades). Meanwhile, I remembered one reason to keep me motivated to play even in the absence of updates: Maybe one day, MAYBE, I'll finally get an uberstone (assuming they still exist in this version of GTD)! It won't change anything, game-wise, even if I do, if the game is already constricted by the memory leak problem. An uberstone isn't going to stop the game from crashing. But it would feel good, after all these years, to finally, FINALLY get one! Oh, and one more thing-- without getting into the math on the probability of getting a great opal, at this point I accept that you're correct that they're a lot more common than I'd perceived in the past. Every run I've done in the new GTD, except that first one, got me at least one GO, and usually several. I've gotten FOUR GO's in this run just so far. :)

216 - 2021-08-16 23:27:07.380638

Because mine runs had less memory leaks, i think that time affect it. Getting better time scores might be a way to limit memory leaks. I didnt lose run to crash yet, but its because i dont even trying to get 400+ - its too slow without speed up button ( in adition to being pointless/boring). But the NJC is interesting for me, submited lvl 100 best so far( but look at the time!), it was with early (lvl ~25) GO and BS in lvl 15. Unfortunatelly EE luck was below average, so i was leaking ~3 flyers. Also leaked 3 in 44, which is bad, especially with GO. ~40 total leaks before lvl 100 means death in NJC.

WGW - 2021-08-16 22:17:27.000537

@G: I'm with you in finding the memory leak problem to be enough to almost-- almost-- kill my long-term interest in this game. It seems to me that without this extra-game limitation, there are probably at LEAST a dozen of us who would be able to play the survival mode out until the point where there are no places left to put new gems/rocks, which means: (a) The game is too easy in current form, mostly because of overpowered Jades, and (b) If the memory leak is fixed without any other tweaks to the game, there will be no meaningful distinction between high scores over, say, level 200, since any decently compentent player will be able to easily get to that level. I found some interesting (though not potent) effects experimenting around along the lines that you summarized, and perhaps more, including reducing towers-- my last build, the one where I finally posted a high score (at level 301) involved my building 20+ Uranium in the lower left corner of the map, to see if that would slow down the memory leak-- but I found that, as you noted, there's really no effective way (that I've discovered) to limit the memory leak. I also tried things like minimizing the browser tab, which apparently halted the game completely, where in the prior Flash version, minimized tabs massively slowed but didn't HALT the game. Putting the PC into suspend mode would temporarily reduce memory usage to minimal levels, but as soon as you let the game run again, it would reach the same level of RAM leaks within 20-30 seconds. So it seems to me that the game is currently permanently limited by the memory leak problem, which may be very, very, very difficult to solve from a programming perspective. Or not. But I can certainly see how it might be quite difficult to resolve. In any event, good to see people (like you, and @216) still engaged in the game after all these years. I think it's a testament, more than anything, to how great the basic design of this game is, that we remain interested and committed even when it's not really working as it should be. :)

G - 2021-08-16 18:48:46.174611

@WGW: I'm usually playing on a macbook pro, running catalina, with the game itself in chrome. I've never been able to break 500 without crashing, but honestly it seems almost random once you pass 200. I've tried several things like closing other programs/tabs and reducing number of towers, but haven't really found anything that works. In all honesty, it's a big downer and nearly ruins the experience for me, but I really want to break 500.

WGW - 2021-08-13 2:23:34.476710

So it's the long high score text that has messed up the formatting of the high score page? That's a real shame. Seems to me that there's a gigantic area of compromise between allowing high score text to be so long that it messes up the whole page, and limiting high score to just 32 characters (as in the prior Flash version of the game). I haven't posted a single new high score yet, but that's exclusively a result of browser crashes due to the memory leak. . . Speaking of which, @G: I'm curious, since you're one of the few who has posted high scores above level 400, what your system specs are? Does having more memory than I do even help? I ask because every game I've played has crashed due to an "out of memory" error from the browser even though I had around 3GB of RAM still free. So I'm wondering if it even matters to have more RAM, since I never really even came close to actually running out of RAM, or whether there's some sort of browser-specific memory limit that will crash the page even if you have plenty of RAM left (as I have had at each crash so far). @216: The "No Jade" challenge sounds pretty damned challenging, all right. . . As you noted, I think it would take some pretty good RNG luck to make much progress without upgraded Jades. Now that I've played 4-5 runs of the new version of the game, I'm convinced that (in keeping with my prior comments) building and upgrading as many Jades as possible early on essentially makes survival mode a cakewalk-- I'd go as far as to say it breaks the game. I haven't "lost" a run of the new version for any reason other than a browser crash (due to the memory leak). Other than restarting if I don't get a malachite on the first turn, every run I've played has been "winnable" (meaning, self-sustaining, increasing gold levels until the browser crashes), which was not the case with the Flash version. So yeah, I see now how much easier the game has gotten, at least if you exploit how overpowered the Jades are now!

G - 2021-08-12 22:04:00.031004

@216: I agree, the name field on the high score entry form needs to be character limited. Or the high score table page can be fixed with normal CSS. Half the time I end up going into dev tools and deleting the offending row from the table.

216 - 2021-08-09 11:06:33.030738

No reason to have 11+ lives, limiting them (to 50) in this version is also pointless. I think that late wawes enemies should cost more lives, even when life cost depend of lives bought (10+x^2 ,if someone didn't notice) I like idea with "end game" button, but balancing late game sounds better. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - I found idea to keep current game interesting: "No Jade Challenge" ( you can actually build jade, but not upgrade it). I did 2 attempt so far, lvl 68 and 76, both with huge mistakes( removing rock and leaking some grounds for example), GOless, but quite good luck with EE/EG. it will be very hard to get far in "NJC", because very limited repick and leaks. But i believe 200+ is possible with some luck. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Folowing GO chance discussion i made table with chances for specific amount of GOs ( or other specyfic Great gem) in longer runs: \ lvls + repicks: GOs \ 200 500 1000 1500 2000 0 73,6% 46,4% 21,5% 10,0% 4,6% 1 22,6% 35,7% 33,1% 23% 14,3% 2 3,5% 13,7% 25,3% 26,5% 21,9% 3 0,35% 3,5% 13% 20,4% 22,4% 4 0,03% 0,6% 5% 11,7% 17,2% 5 0,002% 0,1% 1,5% 5,4% 10,5% #################### Correction to last mine comment: i was near 360 not 260. RAM usage was ~1,6GB #################### About score text limit: well it should be limited...now score page looks destroyed by 1 long "name".

WGW - 2021-08-09 6:01:55.094133

Here's another ridiculously LONG comment for the very few, the comparably obsessed, who would have any possible interest in reading. ;) So. . . on what was exactly my second runthrough of GTD since the Flash version ended, I did far better than last time but AGAIN did not manage to get on the high score list due to the broswer crashing (at level 340). Here's the maze layout just before the crash: https://imgur.com/a/g2lVI9Z A few items of possible note for anyoe with the interest and patience to read these absurdly long ass comments: (1) I now realize that there's absolutely no reason to ever have more than 11 lives stored up (you're allowed to bank up to 50). You always lose only one life per escaping enemy now, and with 10 enemies per level, as long as you have 11 lives banked, even if every enemy escapes you'll still have one life left, and can simply replenish lives on the next turn. (2) It's now an actual consideration to make sure to leave yourself a way to end the game by leaking enemies. Otherwise, the inevitable outcome, once your layout is so fleshed out that no enemy, ground or air, ever escapes, is that eventually you run out of spaces on the board to place new gems, and the game will (presumably) simply become deadlocked. I planned ahead to make sure I would be able to self-destructevenutally, ensuring the maze would still have removable rocks to provide an escape path for enemies even with the board overstuffed with Enchanted Emeralds. Here's the "base" maze with 4 key rocks removed to allow for ground troop leaking: https://imgur.com/a/dpBzgg1 Curiously, by level 275 or so, intentionally allowing ground troops to leak per the above modified maze actually made the levels take LONGER than they did normally, defeating the whole purpose aside from being able to end a game intentionally. (In the Flash version I used to leak enemies on purpose late-game in order to shave down the time the late levels took.) A suggestion to Peter to address this, which should be very easy to implement on a programming level: Let's have a new option to explicitly END a game-- as distinct from the existing "Reset Game" option-- which will allow players to claim their earned score thus far for a place on the high score list, without our being forced to find a way to intentionally preserve an "escape valve" so as to allow for eventually self-destructing a game. Maybe call it something like "Resign", or "Retire"? (3) I played this latest game in MS Edge rather than Chrome, but found that Edge handled the game about the same overallthough it did somewhat outlast Chrome in terms of when the memory leak became unsustainable. Chrome ended my first game at level 330 when i still had 3GB of RAM free, popping up an error saying, "Oh Snap! You ran out of memory" (or something close to that), when in fact I was nowhere near having yet run out of memory. Using Edge for this second runthrough, the memory leak increased at apparently the same rate, but Edge didn't "prematurely" crash the tab for running out memory until level 341 this time, though that may have had more to do with the specific maze layout than the browser. In any event, once again (as with Chrome), Edge crashed the game with an "out of memory" error when I still had almost 3GB of RAM free (which I don't understand), but the game was still running smoothly until the very level, so there was really no sign of a crash in sight when the crash happened (Chrome had been running the game sluggishly for a few levels before the crash). Strangely, Edge used consistently les processor time (30-50% in Chrome vs 5-15% in Edge). Bottom line, I think the memory leak issue here is very clearly the most serious drawback of this otherwise brilliantly revised game. I can imagine this being potentially very, very difficult to fix, but it would be wonderful if it could be. In the meantime, based on my limited experience so far, I'd recommend that anyone on a PC try playing the game on MS Edge rather than Chrome. (4) I love the high score text's longer character limit (what is the limit now, anyhow???), and that it now accepts punctuation. :) (5) I also want to specifically commend Peter for fixing the longstanding "Opal bugs" from the prior Flash version. :) I'm still getting used to not having to worry about the opal bugs in the current version, as it's become so automatic to me by this point from the Flash version to be careful with Opals! (6) Following up prior discussion with @216, where in the last game I could not get a Great Opal no matter how many times I repicked for one, in this run I ended up getting THREE of them! (7) Some elements of the maze may understandably look very strange or counter-productive to eagle-eyed folks like 216. There are reasons for everything, but I think it's already an epic-length enough comment as it is, so I'll defer preemptively explaining, e.g., why there are so many Black Opals and Quartz gems. But there ARE reasons. :) MASSIVE SLOWDOWN at level 340, 2.3 GB RAM used with 2.8 GB still free (of 8GB).

WGW - 2021-08-07 22:52:09.485488

@216: By "gold level" I just meant the amount of gold you have banked. As for how many Jades to build, and how early, well, bear in mind I've only played exactly one run of the new game so far, so I haven't played around with it nearly enough to make a solid judgment on this, but I personally find that having tons of excess gold is so important-- mainly in freeing up the ability to repick at will-- that it's worth building a ton of them. With a more refined strategy, I can see that it might not be strictly necessary to build so many, but it sure didn't hurt. And yes, it was extremely frsutrating not to have picked a great opal after all that time-- starting around the mid 200s level I was repicking a dozen times each turn in the hopes of getting a great opal, but it never happened. That's why I still had some spaces left open in the middle of the maze, so there would be someplace to put the great opal if I got one. (Also perhaps worth noting: the Uranium and the Star Ruby gems were not there by my choice, but rather due to bad picks early on of chipped gems that I just wanted to clear off the board.) I've never found Great Opals to be as common to get as you have, as we've discussed before. I can't do the probability calc, it's too complicated for me, but I know that I consider it a huge stroke of luck to ever get one, whereas you seem to find it not all that rare at all. All I can tell you is I wanted one, was trying to get one, and repicked hundreds of times in hope of getting one, but it never happened. I guess it wouldn't have mattered in the end since the browser would have crashed anyhow! I'm currently trying the game out in MS Edge rather than Chrome, and so far no apparent memory leaks-- but I'm only at level 60. We'll see! Good to see you're still around. :)

216 - 2021-08-07 21:47:18.306422

@WGW: What did you mean by "gold levels"? Jade gold gain is based on game level( but i though you know that), no reason to build many jades early. Yes, now game is really easy(despite slighty harder enemies) , mostly because 10x higher jade gold chance and all leaks costing only 1 life. It's still possible to lose with very bad RNG that dont give you single important gem( EG, EE, BS, opals), especialy if you spend much gold on repick to trying to get it. Leaking 8+ on early-mid (44 - ~100) flying wawes is very possible with bad luck. I was quite suprised that you didn't get GO in 210 lvls ( and problably many repicks),but assuming 500 repicks its 28,8% chance for 0 GOs. btw, I lost mine run before submiting, becase i accidentaly turn off mine PC instead hibernate... but it was only lvl 260, i wasn't patient enough to go over 500 anyway.

WGW - 2021-08-07 18:58:55.434989

Crap-- when I wrote "I was able to post the highest score yet", that was before the whole browser crashed on me, hours before I really expected it to. I pre-wrote the comment to be posted after posting a new high score, and then, lo and behold, the broswer crashed and I didn't get to post anything, but neglected to fully edit my pre-written comment. Apologies!

WGW - 2021-08-07 18:56:14.284555

Well, well, well. . . I'm back to playing GTD, and couldn't be happier about it. I SHOULD have been able to post the (current) highest score for the game, but Chrome crashed due to memory overusage around level 330, at which poit I sactiely tryig to lose lives to give myself an escae hatch, because otherwise the game was never going to end until I just ran out of spaces to place new gems. Oh well. It was satisfying doing so well, even if there's no record of it for posterity. . . In finally returning to this game since the original Flash version was involuntarily retired, I have to say I'm very pleased at the changes I see. I had tried to play the new post-Flash game when Peter first released it, but saw tons of bugs and ended up focusing on other things for a while, figuring plenty of other people would do the job of reporting the errors. But I just fired up the game again a few days ago, and to my delight, I was able to post the highest score yet. The main issue with the game at this point seems, to me, to be that advancing into really high levels becomes a huge drain on system resources, so rather than a strategic challenge, after level 200 or so, GTD becomes a "Manage your system resources" game to prevent a crash due to memory requirements, rather than anything IN-GAME limiting your progress. In my case, I had to shut down basically every program and background service that I didn't absolutely need to be running, in order to keep my PC from running out of RAM due to GTD's increasing requirements as you progress. Otherwise, I think the changes Peter made with respect to how gold/lives/escaping enemies work are a tremendous benefit to the game-- the original version devolved into "can you click fast enough to regain lives" after level 140 or so, and at level 196, a SINGLE escaping air troop enemy would immediately end a game you'd invested 10-15 hours into playing. The new system is much, much more forgiving, without breaking the essential game systems otherwise. It's maybe a BIT too easy now, but I say this as someone who has already invested literally years of my life into this game; I don't think (based on the existing high scores) that too many other people would find that these changes really make the game too easy. But from my perspective, the game (in survival mode at least) is now a matter of how many Lucky Asian Jades you can build early on (to earn gold), and how many Enchanted Emeralds you can build once your gold levels are consistently increasing. All other considerations, while not irrelevant, have become at the least *secondary*, to the primary goal of simply keeping your gold level high enough to withstand leaks. And if you focus on gold levels for the first 50 levels or so, repicks become basically free, making the actual survival mode GTD somewhat akin to the "sandbox" mode, in that you can feel free to repick and repick and repick until you get exactly the result you want. The original game required extreme care in repicks, which meant actively needing to balance optimal outcomes (ideal gem placement) against recourse cost (skyrocketing repick costs against earned gold levels-- gold accumlation was MUCH slower in the original version). But the real problem, to me, seems to be resource usage, in that the game uses more and more memory the further you progress. Once I hit level 150 or so, my concern was no longer that I would actually lose the game, but that my whole system would crash due to the increased memory demands with every level gained. The game itself was essentially unloseable by that point, but I had a lot of worries whether my whole PC would cry uncle before I was able to post a high score. I've also seen comments from others here regarding the game playing very differently depending on what monitor refresh rate you're using (i.e., using 120MHz makes the enemies move 2x as fast and makes the game unplayable). These issues are clearly not intended; no one intentionally designs a game so that losing the game is due more to your system specs than how you're actually playing the game. But I also expect (due to my own meager programming background) that these are MUCH more difficult issues to sort out than out-and-out bugs are ("bugs" meaning instances where the game is explcitly malfunctioning). All in all, I'm genuinely thrilled with this new revision of the game. I've only encountered 2 or 3 bugs at this point, all of which are very minor. The user interface is, imo, a bit more clunky now than it was in the Flash version. Otherwise, I think this is a much-improved game, and I heartily commend Peter Holko for re-releasing, re-developing, and re-thinking it. There's been a real hole in my life due to not playing GTD in the background literally ALL the time, as I had for a decade before the end of Flash. That hole is now filled. :) I still say, though, the fact that a few people had managed to beat level 196 in the original version continues to leave me humbled, since I was never able to come even CLOSE. I posted dozens and dozens of L195 high scores, but despite countless hours trying the so-called "emerald strategy" to get past L196, I never managed it, even with abundant help from the folks who did. So while I got past level 196 and way beyond in this revised version of the game, I will never lose my admiration for those who bested my best in the original version. I'm quite sure that any of you (a/aznst, 216, mmkay) could do just as well or even better assuming your computer specs are good enough to avoid crashes at higher levels. But that said, it still feels good to know I can still play this game well, even with some pretty major changes. :) It would be very interesting to see what kind of balancing/adjustments are possible to make the current game more challenging for very experienced players. For those who are interested (and if you weren't, you surely wouldn't have read this far to begin with), here's my maze layout, which ended up crashing the game about 20 levels later: https://imgur.com/a/POOMgJA

216 - 2021-07-19 21:39:50.548253

Read older comments, there is a bug with it, need 60 Hz to play normally. On 120 Hz enemies are 2x faster.

kira - 2021-07-19 21:21:37.725369

@216 it is currently set to 120Hertz I play on my laptop I don't know if that makes a difference.

216 - 2021-07-19 12:39:04.008345

@kira: What's the refresh rate of your monitor? I decided to do 1 more 200+ run and got GO in wawe 38, so time was quite good, i pay attention also on RAM usage: lvl time RAM 100 ~6500 100-200 MB 200 ~17500 ~600MB 300 ~30600 ~1,1GB https://imgur.com/zFP34ZH As you can see i'm far way from running out of space, so getting 1000 is possible, but i dont have as much patience to do that, i will end this run soon

kira - 2021-07-18 22:46:03.757891

I can't even get to lvl 100. I feel like the mobs are moving too fast. Every once in a while after restarting the game, the mobs will start out much slower but that doesn't happen too often.

frowny face - 2021-07-15 22:20:20.866516

Yes, it did take days, anytime you get over 200 basically, and I put the browser/computer to sleep multiple times. If I were in a different browser it may not crash so much. I'll probably try again on a better computer some time. The only glitch that really annoys me is the merge inaccuracies, where it doesn't merge one of each component, but randomly grabs from the bag of available parts, two of one thing, sometimes I lose an extra perfect gem that way and it makes me mad. So yeah, updates will be good.

216 - 2021-07-15 18:28:09.369999

Are you challenging me? :) I got past 500 twice in flash version ( where leaking 1 unit at lvl 196+ was instant lose) Currently(0.5.4 version) is no point of going playing after ~200, since you get enough EE to stunlock enemies and even if something leak, you have much gold for lives from overpowered jades (10x more gold procs than in flash verion). The only difficulty is running out of space, which can happen before wawe 600 with longest mazes and no paraiba. The map is 40x40 half-tiles (20x20 gems), but its not possble to fill full map, lets say 300 gems is possible with medium maze. Most specials are from 3 gems, but paraiba is from 4( takes 4 lvls to build), so lvl 900-1200 should be possible. Anyway, congrats of patience to getting 500. The problems are possible chrome crashes( at lvl 200 it wasn't using so much RAM for me, but someone said on lvl 500 it take 6 GB) and no option to speed up game, so getting to 500 take days :( I haven't play this game since months, i'm waiting for updates. btw, (temporary) old website still exist, here are mine scores: http://45.55.255.26/highscore/ (it's also on web archieve) On web archieve you can also find mine comment with lvl 500 pic.

frowny face - 2021-07-15 16:31:00.240822

mkay, smarta##, then beat 510 :P

216 - 2021-07-15 11:08:28.055163

lvl 510 is away from current game limit, shorter maze and some paraiba gems allows to get near 1000... but without speedup button i won't try to do that. Having no paraiba at lvl 500 is strange, because it reduce armor of ground units - speeds up game a bit. Also dmg from multiple uraniums doesn't stack( at least that was in flash verion). @Themidnightpanda: Your monitor have ~60Hz or more?

frowny face - 2021-07-15 1:24:30.696124

screenshot of maze for the other dude https://ibb.co/b33rkQv

frowny face - 2021-07-15 1:18:50.926663

chrome crashed around lvl 510... not sure I want to do that again to get the record lolz, but reduced crashing and freezing by over-investing in the non-firing towers, seemed to work better that way, but I could tell that I would run out of locations to place gems at some point so there's a game limit... As for getting past level 40, it helped me a lot to read a lot of these comments, and invest more in the towers described by others, easily got past the lower levels after that, get the green tower to boost gold and the large green emerald one to freeze the baddies for easier kill, much easier progress with those two tower types

Themidnightpanda - 2021-07-11 20:41:10.231511

Anyone have a youtube video guide on their mazes? doing the 7x walkthrough strat but seem to be losing lives way to early Level 40 and on.

what - 2021-07-02 21:02:34.037875

chrome crashed around lvl 200

Peter Holko - 2021-06-07 23:45:00.039316

Sorry I've been very busy with moving, I'll look to try to resolve all the bugs reported for the next few weeks.

G - 2021-04-27 16:08:56.466045

I just encountered an interesting bug. I had 2 Flawed Amethysts and 2 Normal Rubies on the board. When I got a Flawless Emerald, I was able to "combine special" on any of those 5 gems. I selected the second Normal Ruby, which promptly turned into a Red Crystal. Now here's the bug: the other Normal Ruby and the Flawless Emerald disappeared while the 2 Flawed Amethysts remained on the board, meaning both the Normal Rubies and the Flawless Emerald were consumed to create the Red Crystal.

malacus - 2021-04-23 1:03:07.632746

Hey hope you're doing well @Peter! Any timeline updates for fixing issues? Thanks, -malacus

G - 2021-04-02 21:51:08.306837

@Peter: Thank you for your time, we all really appreciate the work you've put into this!

N N W - 2021-03-31 1:00:58.923268

What is the word count on this I wonder..>>

SMS - 2021-03-23 12:21:17.551737

@G It is more likely to do with your operating system. Windows limits individual process' RAM. I'm not sure what Mac does, but it's probably similar to linux (what I'm using) where the processes are free to use as much ram as they want but if you run out of system ram, the computer will just crash or freeze up. Towards the end, it took 8-10 seconds of real time to process 1 second of game-time. That really shows how bogged down it was.

Peter Holko - 2021-03-19 23:23:47.605271

My apologies to all Gem TD fans, I've been so busy that I haven't had time to work on fixing the issues in Gem TD. I will try to get them to over the next few weeks. Thank you for understanding.

G - 2021-03-19 19:41:04.228508

@SMS: well I'm impressed you were 1) able to play a single game for that long without dying of boredom and 2) able to finish almost 500 levels without having the tab crash on you. What browser are you using?

SMS - 2021-03-18 19:23:28.386561

I had to quit at 499 because the tab was using 6GB of ram...

N N W - 2021-03-18 11:19:44.146697

a comment

elf - 2021-03-12 11:01:07.012990

Re previous comment, I think it may be the gems for EgyptianGold being available, and that one also shows CombinedSpecial

elf - 2021-03-12 10:04:17.610977

Rosequartzcrystal is coming up that they can be Combined Special

G - 2021-02-20 0:35:17.910765

@mikis: I also had the game crash around that point, probably 420-430 area. Definitely seems to be a memory leak, or just an overflow once we push things that far.

mikis - 2021-02-14 21:08:09.084885

I got to 386 level with over 60 emeralds, 10 jades and 30-40 golds, still had 50 lives, and then the game crashed on me... "memory error". Not sure if it's my machine's fault or is there something wrong with the code

216 - 2021-02-07 18:28:38.116165

@G: You need remove some rocks to leak ground units (as I said in early comments. I also needed that in flash GTD). Game is very unbalanced now. Btw, wawe 216 never was a milestone (196 was first wawe with 50 lives cost). Speedhack bug is probably related to that refresh frequency bug. I hope for speed up button(s), if bug will be fixed.

G - 2021-02-07 15:40:36.953979

Re: speedhack bug That's a shame. At least in this version of the game, you don't break it until you're able to stop all flyers with enchanted emeralds, or at least enough lucky asian jades to have income out pace thee rate of growth of the cost of new lives. I've now reached that point with two games I'm playing simultaneously. I'm starting to wonder if I'll ever be able to lose and record my high scores now.

Speedhack bug - 2021-02-06 20:23:01.827084

In the flash version I was using CheatEngine to speed the game up (because I did not want to play for hours just waiting; also I could slow it down when flyers came to ease buying lives). However when I use the same speedhack now, it only accelerates the shooting of towers, not the movement of creeps, so the gameplay is destroyed - it is awfully easy to play :(

G - 2021-02-05 19:05:47.130860

Finally able to pass level 216! Still going on this game, but that milestone makes me so happy and wanted to share.

216 - 2021-01-29 15:16:22.702763

Speed is bugged, but that 0.75 is display issue. Looks like speed is same as in flash in all wawes (on 60Hz monitor). But poison slows nothing above wawe ~30. Ofc getting to wawe 200 (and later) is way easier now.

Big Lighthouse - 2021-01-29 14:45:10.548477

@216 - I wouldnt say there is too much lag. But its not perfect - example: I typically play on a seperate virtual desktop to hide easily from work haha.When I win+tab to go back to my main desktop things are quite unresponsive. I noticed memory usage creeping a little, but in task manager currently all my Firefox windows are below 500mb Movement "feels" slow, but I think thats because the speed is bugged at 0.75 right? I know my maze is very sub-optimal, so I think the threshold for "never ending games" has dropped significantly since the flash version. I have very much the same as I would fool around with in that, and I never got much beyond 170s with it before with GO.

216 - 2021-01-29 14:13:52.540013

@Big Lighthouse: Is there any lag/ high memory usage at lvl 400+? (at 200 wasn't, but memory usage was increasing, over 500 MB). Congrats for getting as far, i didn't have as much patience (i got over 500 in flash). In flash version at lvl 500 had literally 1 FPS (at end of wawes) For me the flash version didn't have end either, if i had a GO, (flying) wawes near 120 was quite risky(possibly to stack), but with GO i often could kill 9 (or 10) flyers.

Big Lighthouse - 2021-01-29 9:23:59.839530

@216: Yeah, I'm currently trying to leak so I can post score - racked up 25million gold and level 405. At first it was fun to see how far it could be pushed, its now just tiresome. The old system of "1 leak and its over" brought a degree of excitement. As did, frustrating as it was, the risk of overlapping flyers if you hit with a sapphire/emerald. The game is now lacking an "end" to play for.

216 - 2021-01-28 18:30:32.749115

@G: No need to make as big maze, i separate start ,c2, c4, c6 from end, c1, c3, c5 and make maze around initial malachite (or a bit larger), so enemies walk 7x through it. @Big Lighthouse: In late game (200+) lives cost doesn't matter, if you can stun and kill all flyers. Because jades gold generation in so high, you can leak almost all in flying wawes around 50 and just buying lives (if you have at least 2-3 jades).

G - 2021-01-28 17:51:15.745725

Question for anyone: what does your maze construction look like? I've been playing with a bunch of different layouts but I tend to create lines diagonally from top left to bottom right, all while attempting to keep the odd / even numbered landing pads on different "sides" of the maze

Big Lighthouse - 2021-01-26 13:07:07.800063

The game is in a weird situation right now. Quite an agressive difficulty spike "early" in survival, around turns 40-50ish, but then difficulty plummets if you can get passed this. Need something to close the late game out effectively like the high life cost of flyers used to.

Themidnightpanda - 2021-01-26 3:51:39.317063

@216 I had made 2 jades, but been trying to make the emeralds stunners.

wactical - 2021-01-25 23:05:57.631014

I'll email you - where's best?

216 - 2021-01-25 21:55:13.561578

@Wactical: What is the refresh rate on your monitor? The wawe 1 speed should be 3.33 half-tiles /s (so 1.67 rocks/s, at least that was in flash version).

wactical - 2021-01-25 20:32:52.826357

I was playnig this game over the last couple of days on survival mode, and was surprised at how hard a lot of the early levels were, particularly because of how fast the enemies moved - they were 5-6 tiles apart on just level 1. then, I reloaded today and they are super slow? is this an update? was one of these two extremes a bug, or the other? I'm confused.

wactical - 2021-01-24 18:47:04.836132

almost certainly a low priority bug to fix, but clicking "reset game" and then "no" removes the reset button

Peter Holko - 2021-01-23 6:10:19.559496

Nevermind that attempt to fix it didn't work, I believe I know how to correct it now. It will take a week or more because it is a large change.

Peter Holko - 2021-01-23 0:42:01.556411

@216 I added some code to keep the rendering at a fixed frame rate. Give it a try and let me know if that solved the issue.

216 - 2021-01-21 21:52:57.109361

If game had a function/method that update whole game (game timer, enemies, towers and projectiles) by delta time, that problem wouldn't exist. Without that, implementing "speed up" button will be much harder, i think. Flyers are hard about wawe 50, because bug with speed units, which make enemies unslowable. @YeWay: i said about that in mine 5th comment here.

Peter Holko - 2021-01-21 20:22:25.725475

@malacus I'll take a look, I think I have an idea what the issue. I'll "retire" the highscores once I fix this issue.

malacus - 2021-01-21 17:45:49.313974

@peter I was thinking by just playing on my monitor with a 60hz refresh rate that the game would work right but I'm not able to alt tab or interact with any other windows I have it seems. Game still gets too hard around level 50 as mobs are just flying by. Hard to pinpoint when they change speed but if I change focus of windows the speed of the mobs will adjust slightly.

YeWay - 2021-01-20 4:36:35.890126

Dont make a Star Yellow Sapphire when you already have a Mystical Black Opal. It will overwrite the 40% damage boost to 5% and will mess up the game. Currently on survival lvl 51, Wish me luck

malacus - 2021-01-20 0:27:47.249223

@216 They are supppper fast ha! I couldn't get past 50-60 and that was with stacking jades for as much money as possible just to buy lives.

216 - 2021-01-19 23:09:30.307270

Tested it on laptop, where i could set 48Hz and 60Hz. On 48Hz enemies were slower(so also closer to each other), while tower cooldowns seems to be same. So at lvl 3 on 48Hz (vivid) malachite could kill enemies before c2, while (same located) on 60Hz couldn't (needed 1 more hit). Time better on 60Hz, because less waiting time fro enemies come to malachite range. So movement of enemies is not related to measured delta time, but tower CDs are? That issue is serious!! How fast enemies are on 144 Hz?

malacus - 2021-01-19 22:12:56.706955

@216 @peter ah yeah I did mean 10 and 11, my b. I was looking at the level at the end of the turn. My ~60hz monitor plays the game so much slower/better/manageable lolol What a weird issue.

216 - 2021-01-19 22:10:21.948478

Mine have ~60hz. Lvl 12 is flying, so i guess you meant 10 and 11.

malacus - 2021-01-19 21:51:31.153678

@peter ok here's a weird issue i'm running into. Essentially monitors with different refresh rates are having different outcomes with mobs killed/time. https://forum.babylonjs.com/t/fps-affects-game-speed-framerate-independence/2419/2 https://stackoverflow.com/questions/19764018/controlling-fps-with-requestanimationframe I did level 11 on my left monitor that has ~144hrz refresh rate and it took a total of 19 seconds. I did level 12 on my right monitor that has ~60hrz refresh rate and made sure not to add any gems that could attack ground and it should add I'm guessing maybe 5 seconds max given different resistances/difficulty, and it ended up being 43 whole seconds! The mobs also died at different spots and vastly different rates. 19 seconds for level 11 on ~144hrz monitor 43 seconds for level 12 on ~60hrz monitor This explains why I'm having such a hard time getting past early levels. @216 do you know the refresh rate on your monitor?

216 - 2021-01-19 11:51:27.380624

@ruby: Jade is not only reason why game can goes "forever" (untill run out of space). In flash version i needed often to lose intentionally, while i was able to safety kill all flyers. Now it's a bit harded, but i managed to kill all in wawe 200 (and 192). How many jades did you biuld? (i had 7) @Themidnightpanda: Red Crystal and special combination(s) (EG/BS/uranium in mid/EE). If start from malachite, max upgrage it may be enough for wawe 24.

ruby - 2021-01-19 6:45:31.925544

game just goes forever due to overpowered jade. i had 4 million gold and had to intentionally lose to end the game

Themidnightpanda - 2021-01-19 3:15:58.314598

What should I be building to deal with flying past level 24? cant seem to take them out fast enough without losing live.

216 - 2021-01-18 23:04:31.942751

@malacus: Main dmg come from BS's and EG's. Don't underestimate malachite with 200+ kills and maze aroud it. Because dmg table in unfinished(x1 on all but pink dmg), green dmg don't have x1.5 multipier like on flash version, but malachite shoots faster. Jade dmg never was high, its gem for gold+stun+ *assuming the speed issue is solved* slow. I'm waiting for jade nerf, now it's easy to get 200+ lvl

malacus - 2021-01-18 21:40:46.157100

Having issues getting past level 40-50 even starting to leak ground units. Trying to stack jades/ee's but just don't seem to be doing enough damage.

aratogep - 2021-01-17 19:33:32.921015

Keep up good work!

robert - 2021-01-17 7:36:01.532267

wow this is unbelievable! thank you SO SO much Peter! you're a gem. next up, fast forward function please?? :)

G - 2021-01-17 2:50:48.767906

216: Thanks, seemed to be a glitch on my end, as I am seeing them now. Peter: I did notice that if you upgrade gem chances all the way up and then lose/reset the game, you cannot upgrade gem chances when starting a new game. This is because the "gem chances" button does not turn back.

216 - 2021-01-17 1:18:20.346108

Thanks Peter for "r" shortcut. Will speed up option be added? (it would also help with testing late game balance) - - - - - @G I can see special combination list below game. - - - - - Does people know about that (upgraded) jades gives gold? (it's not written in descryption). I'm suprised that nobody else submit 200+ lvl score yet (maybe they just can't lose, so closing game without submiting). i'm 99% sure that Peter will nerf jade gold chance, which is 10% now(was 1% in flash, now need more gold, but 10x more is just too OP). For me 7 jades was enough for lives, while i was leaking at least 4-5 flyers untill 176 (got a GO after). Before 50 i made maybe 3, and was leaking a lot (because problem with opals).

G - 2021-01-16 23:40:46.600313

@Peter Holko: I want to express my eminent appreciation for your porting this game over to js! Quick question (for anyone): where can I find the list of gem combinations? It no longer appears on the main "play" page.

malacus - 2021-01-14 3:28:38.231672

@Peter Holko Lag seems solved now thanks!!

Peter Holko - 2021-01-14 0:35:18.158980

@216: Fixed the restart game and added the ability to hold "r" and click on Rocks to remove them quickly

216 - 2021-01-13 22:34:18.204200

Looks like main lag problem is definitelly solved, CPU usage is low enough (but noticed some strange behaviour and 600+ MB RAM used near wawe 200). But survival need balance now(and some bug fixing). Min. speed/slowing is still bugged, displayed speed(0.75 in all wawes) too, so i leaked many flyers (7+, then 4-6 after BO). But gold generation of jades was so high, enoguh for buying lives, which were getting expesive quickly. I got GO in wawe 178, after that was still leaking 1-2 (0 in 192 and 200), but EE gain was quite bad. Life cost was 28k, 300 repicks used, you can see how much gold left. Reset game is completly bugged (by button as well as after subming). Also, after clicking "no" reset button disapears. One more thing: that shift-cliking feature to remove rocks was very usefull.

malacus - 2021-01-13 2:17:40.086205

@216 Ha maybe it was someone else and maybe it was only a temporary bug �\_(&#12484;)_/� Either way I admire your drive in this game ha. Did you ever play the Blizzard original mods of the game?

216 - 2021-01-13 2:05:31.308406

@malacus: Idk what extractly you meant, but i'm checking displayed towers dmg reagulary (and more important, amount of kills). I also sometimes looking at hp decrease of enemies (if only 1 tower is attacking). Your question reminded me that dmg table currently works only for pink dmg , rest is x1. Also uranium dmg wasn't ingoring armor when i tested it.

malacus - 2021-01-13 1:35:38.134786

@216 What do you do to figure out tower damages and such? I found out through you during the flash version that the mystic black opal would only apply the damage buff once to the towers in its range and you had to make multiple. Are you just watching damage numbers closely? I enjoy the game but have issues min/maxing ha and you seem to do it so well. I'm at 370,671 and currently leaking to submit a score. Taking forever (:

216 - 2021-01-13 1:27:36.030217

I forgot to say it eariel, Don't make SYS now, it has bugs(can overwrite 40% dmg buff to 5% and has wrong stats). @malacus: i don't think that you will able to lose now, if you are so far with GO (how much gold you have?). Jade gold chance is 10x higher than in flash version (bug?), so you should be able to buy lives(even for 10000+ gold each) for long time, even if you don't have enough stunners(eventually you will). There is no 196 wall anymore, and with lag leveling will last forever. Only you can do is leak ground units intentionally to submit score, like i was always doing. Auto-clicker "requiement" was stupid( but it was needed more before 100 than ater), but that lives mechanic change completly changed game balance. Btw, funny that comment times are precise to 0.000001s :) (but harder to read hour)

malacus - 2021-01-13 0:45:45.914666

@216 ah yeah it is 25 now. I haven't refreshed the game since the one game I'm on is taking so long to lose haha Agreed on talking game balance, but it is super nice to not have to use an auto clicker past the 100+s. I think we can all agree that's a good change.

216 - 2021-01-13 0:02:27.608741

I noticed that base repick cost in 25 now. Lags are probably related to heavy RAM usage (was over 2GB in 128). I didn't have a GO in 128 game so i don't think it matters(as well as console longs) All types of higher difficulties are welcome (or making existing harded), I like survival idea(no max lvl) the most, sometimes i make speed run on other diff. Buffing sub-100 survival wawes is rather no needed , hp of enemies just after 40 is growing up linear, but fast. I always have been leaking some flyers before 100, because not enough towers. But completly other no-max lvl difficutly that makes also sub-100 ground wawes much harded may be interesting. But for that "speed" button is rather very needed (very long mazes). Ofc, late survival wawes (200+) needs some balance, because with property located stunners(and enough of them) game was unloseable. It can be done in many ways: -faster enemies (but enemies are quite fast) -more enemies (11th flyer could kill me in many games, adding few more definitelly will force leaks). -partial stun resistance (based of stun time for example). But before talking about balance, lags needs to be fixed (I'm really curious what cause that lags!) Idk how hard is to kill all flyers now(4 more armor and min. speed bugged), so maybe is too early for talking about game balance.

malacus - 2021-01-12 22:29:24.001124

@peter I see a lot of console logs which should probably be removed in production, they can cause lag but I'm sure it's probably something else. I've never developed a Javascript game but have done some Javascript web development at work. Good luck!

malacus - 2021-01-12 21:58:55.422743

Had my previous comment removed but there was a lot of spam no worries :) @Peter thanks a ton for rewriting this, the first 1-50 waves are much smoother than before but it definitely drops off. I also sent you an email with some screenshots. The cost to reroll your gems I think is too low. I do like that it changed but it makes it too easy to get gem combinations you want. I'm currently at level 140 but it takes about 20-30 minutes per level to finish. Using Windows 10, and chrome. I got a great opal and it seems the lag started then. Like @216 said the lag starts even before the projectiles fire so the bug is probably related to something with how many towers you have. A new version of this game would be super cool I'd love an update. I do think the replay ability is great in this game I've been playing it for way too long ha.

Peter Holko - 2021-01-12 21:38:57.220447

@216: Thank you for the information, I'll look to reproduce the issue. On other note, would you be open to another difficulty level with the goal of aiming to be much harder at low levels like sub 100?

216 - 2021-01-12 17:34:28.757095

I have written comment about in in old comment page few days ago, lags seems to scaling only with lvl (they occurs at start of wawe with 0 projectiles too). Before wawe 50 in does not happen at all (i noticed small lags in 44 or 48 maybe). As i noticed, the amount of projectiles didn't increse lag at all (and it shouldn't, even with 1000 of them). I'm using Chrome and Windows. Btw, one comment from not a spammed was removed here (from @malacus)

Peter Holko - 2021-01-12 17:05:24.811044

@216: Could you please provide some details on any pattern you notice in regards to the slowdown? I honestly haven't seen it but I am not playing past level 40 often. For example, does the slowdown appear related to lots of towers firing? If anyone is experiencing performance issues, please send an email with the following details: 1. Game Level where the performance dropped 2. Browser (chrome, firefox, safari) 3. Device (Windows, Mac, iPad, etc...)

216 - 2021-01-12 16:16:44.713941

@Tonic: Check old comment page (link to flash version still exist), i posted pic with lagged flyers at wawe 92, if you meant maze for survival(which is unplayable now).I often make some (minor ussually) changes to my maze.

Tonic - 2021-01-12 16:02:53.505989

@216 What Maze do you use? btw i was a big fan of your comments before the reset.

216 - 2021-01-12 15:35:31.212564

@malacus I mentioned lags in my few last comments in old comment page, i hope that dev know about it... Yes, survival practically no exist now. to which level you get? So many spammers are here :(

Peter Holko - 2021-01-12 0:54:29.882999

Comment section is now online.

Created by Peter Holko. Graphics by Dorian Cox.