@LesserLeaf that's rough, been there. Keep at it! I know you're going to make it to the 1200 club soon 🙌

This time lost at 776 - even one more flying wawe later. The recent changes works; this run was much more optimized, GO was build eariel and got another 2 of them. Sadly at this lvl i had problems with space. As mentioned in previous comment the stun resist growth shouldn't slow at 300 (maybe 20%/42%/64% and cap of 80..or 85% to be sure). Its hard to balance both GO and GOless runs, but since runs without GO have around lvl 300 potential, i believe that merciless growth after that point is way to go. Despite i said to avoid changes in first 250 lvls to protect no-GO runs I have nice idea, that could be apllied NOT only to legendary diff: - reduce speed of lvl 44 by 20-25%, then lvl 48, 52, .. by little less and less... untill somewhere around 80, BUT - In compensation nerf jades gold chance 5% -> 4% , and - Reduce starting lives (assuming reduced speed will save ~20 lives anyway) - Some detail for end-of-space enjoyers - explained below Those changes would have many advantages: - reduce 40 -> 44 jump that many players were complaining - befenit mostly to no-GO runs, in GO runs i leak 0 or 1 in post -40 flying lvls, in no-GO 3-5 - little healther economy At this point @_G_ and @scgmeister could disagree - those changes would force to build 3-4 more jades (intead paraiba), resulting 3-4 lvl less. Solution: >>Reduce restriced build area near path end/start from 2x2 to 1x2 tiles (like it was in flash version). That extra gem (near the end) will give back that 4 lvls and every1 should be happy. Thanks for legendary diff, regardless (temporary i hope) balance issues! Btw, what means "Games already running keep their original rules and version" .. if there is no save/resume to load new version?

While I did have 1 small missclick in this run which resulted in me not being able to reach level 1260 in my most recent attempt, this is still my best scoring game yet. https://imgur.com/a/5LJWN76. There is one small adjustment I may try making in my maze which may help push my final score higher if I get a strong early start, though at this point it's a bit of a gamble on on when to find the best time to switch to only paraibas while still being able to afford the inevitable lives lost when it comes time to have to shorten the maze to make more room. Also, big thanks for added feature of holding shift to repick gems. That is a huge time saver late game. Legendary also looks intriguing. I might have to give that a few runs once I have some time.

@LesserLeaf Its not a bug, its a feature (there was a crash bug, causing scores to be lost) Meanwhile i'm near 300 (on legendary) ,well going GO run - after 200 olny one leak in 220 and in 288 EDIT: Seems like I underestimated needed post-300 stun resistance values. Around 450 stuns are 1.5x shorter than at 300, but its natural to have 1.5x more EEs at that point. Perfectly balanced? If the goal was to reach lvl, let say 600 to win, then i would say yes. But we want contantly growing difficulty to force end eventually, right? So i think at 400 stun resist should be above 60% The first 250 - 300 lvls are well balanced, though! Very challenging without GO. So avoid major changes to those lvls, though stun resist may be little raised, reaching let say 42% at 300 ( to reduce sharp increase later) Sorry for bad estimations before, the low effect of speed increase also suprised me - leaking only ocassionally near 600 ( or maybe i just playing it too serious :)

I got this crazy idea for a change to classic mode: expand the playfield in all directions by some space. (I suggest 1/2 gem width only! ...muahaha) Would definitely allow different maze geometries. Would lend to a totally different max level!

@WGW @scgmeister @TTJ New score to beat is 1256. I know the 1260s are possible, so who's gonna do it first?

Lost at 772. I won't say it was easy with such late GO, but i think lvls 700+ should be not reachable. I suggest some adjustments: - (very) slowly increase to movement speed past 100 (no initial jump), maybe excluding stun immune lvls - 1 more armor should be acceptable ( slows game by few %, but with unstable stuns it matter on leaks. Also the beging could be not identical to survival) - litle more stun resistance (few more % at 200-400) Also, stun resistance for ground enemies can grow much faster, with cap of 90%. It rather won't cause them to leak , but will prevent negleting maze too much. And important - every player that ever reached 201 (even in season) should be able to play it. its not aphla, its good difficulty, just need some small adjusments And always forgetting - nerf the Uber Stone before someone get it. the suggested nerfs in s2 (before it got removed) weren't related to s2 ( besides fact in s2 i could get it sometimes). A gem over 17x stronger than EG just break game balance, after getting some kills.

Didn't have enough time/luck yet to test it with GO, but its generally nice, challenging without it. Not sure if hard enough to be "legendary", though. The most important thing is working - game ends because leaks, not by space for gems. The balance could be better - i think with early GO i will get far, likely past 500. The important question is which level we are supposed to reach, with and without GO. i'd prefer if lvl 400 was very hard to reach with it - game just last too long. I've just rolled a GO in lvl 313 - lost 250 lives already, but will see Edit 1: at lvl 456 finally a regular flyers started to leak (getting a GO, with over 50EEs which i had after 300 stopped leaks) Edit 2: "started to leak" was said too fast - leaks were occasionally, though when happened it was sometimes 2. Around 67% resist leaks become more common, however it stopped growing amost at all (slowly aproaching 70%). I though leaks are inevitable with ~60% stun resist, but i underestimated amount of EEs that i have at that point, so i got some space issues, started buiding paraibas. But 7 lives leaks are doing their job, likely i lose before 800

@216 Thoughts on new Legendary for Classic?

@Peter Begining similar to survival, could be 1-2 more armor (but that is not the point - it might add more early resets than actual late game difficulty). Initial lives may be reduced ( I think they should be reduced on all diff, explained some time ago) lvl 101 (might be later, but before 200) stun resistance slowly start to grow from 0% ( no initial jump or after-stun immunity period like in s3) Leaks: 2 lives from 201, 1 more every 100 or 50 lvls (Lvls 300, 400 might take little less per leak) Optional: movement speed balance - gradually increase after lvl 100, similary to s3 , but reduced on (olny) air lvls 44,48,..., ~80. This speed reduce is for giving more chance on worse early RNG and giving little more time to get a GO before many lives are lost just due to lack of it (Also because some ppl, including @WGW were complaining for too much jump 40 ->44) Aproximate stun resistance values (assuming no extra enemies) : 10-20% around lvl 200. 30-40% around 300 45-55% around 400. Note that it rather should not grow linearlly, since change 0->1% is much less significant than 50->51% Alternative: extra enemies ( 1 every 50-100 lvls) . then stun resistance can grow much slower(or even not at all). But i think 10 enemies every lvl is more "classic", thought more enemies might be little more fun. Optional, but players will ask for it: Some kind of anti bad luck mechanic for first Great Opal. I have some ideas, but thats for separate comment (Unless such mechanics are not an option for Classic?)

@216 I will add another difficult level to Classic. What exactly do you propose for it?

Whatever that difficulty mode will be named, its really needed! I'd say current mode do not deserve to be named "survival"... but untill serious difficulty without level cap exist that discussion is pointless.(also new mode will need test before if it is for future survival replacement) Please just add it, no matter if it ever replace "survival" or no.

@WGW I just ended a run where I got GO at level 20. Kinda squandered it because I only got to 1248, but see if you can beat that.

@216 old-style_original_classic_survival_mode.final.final.final3.min.js Jokes aside, I'd rather classic survival remain the same aside from bug fixes and QoL additions. However I'm all for adding new game modes to classic. Impossible mode? Insane mode?

@Peter we really need rebalanced survival mode that is not about space for gems. The current survival can be saved as saparate mode, but not as MAIN survival difficulty (maybe rename to old-style survival?) Only 2 things are really needed to make game quite balanced: 1. multiple lives per late leaks 2. extra enemies OR stun resistance (both might be better, but just one required) (things such as speed increase can help balacing game, but are not striclty needed) Those mechanings are already in seasons and they works (quite) well (s3 not balanced yet). While seasons are fun , i think the stable survival mode, which will be about breaking record by one/few more air level (after months/years ) is very important here. ------ Also, Hi @_mmkay ! Uber just needs nerf, though idk if anyone got it without cheat.

Set seed run: Hi folks :) I thought it would be a fun idea to try a set-seed run. Years ago I was interested in doing a no-maze challenge, where you are not allowed to place any gems on the path. I think for regular play, I was able to get to level 30 or something, but it's very luck-dependent. Instead, I searched all the seeds to try find a good one. With this one, I was able to survive enough of the early game to get a stable setup. The Uber eats all the kills. When enemies go out of range of the Uber, I put Jades to farm money. With set-seeds, you could come up with an optimal strategy and try to beat the game as fast as possible, for example. Obviously I won't submit this run because it's cheating, but I thought it was a fun idea. https://imgur.com/a/w0INsxZ

@Peter Noticed a bug with the shift+click repick: the button will occasionally remain disabled after the delay period, but becomes activated again when you interact with a gem or rock. Not a big deal since there is a quick and easy workaround, but figured I'd surface it in case it's an easy fix.

@Peter the shift+click works wonderfully, thank you!

@Peter Is possible to add more difficulties to Classic? The problem with current survival mode is no challenge after lvl 200 besides limited space for gems. I don't really like playing as far as lvl 1000+ , but some ppl do. Since @WGW also have enough of building only paraibas for 800 lvls, we started some disscusion about rebalancing survival mode (should be little easier at 44-80 and harder later) However, i think we should keep (maybe rename) current survival mode for those who like play to end of space for highest lvls, which means 6th diffucty button fells needed. I don't know what was idea of "legendary" diff, but i'm not aganist to have 7 (or even more!) difficulty modes in Classic. Easy should be kept for new players.

@WGW You can check when GO was build by clicking on score (no, it wasn't 150-200..). In that run you had over 1040 leaks (determined form score), costing 370+ milion gold. Assuming olny 180 milion gold available for lives it means 220 less of them - i guess more was lost by too late GO than extra bought due to more jades.

@216 @_G_ Good idea, I've implemented in the latest version: Hold Shift and click Repick Gems to instantly replace all five untouched gems in their current positions.

Oh, and I want to doff my cap to you, @_G_, cause no joke, you currently have the top score in v1.0.3, which has me beat by FIFTY LEVELS!!! :) I suspect you had to build a lot more than the 25 jades I built (which I already considered excessive) or possibly that your final maze wasn't as optimized for space, which means fewer leaked ground enemies even without the old enemy movement glitch. If you have a screenshot, I'd love to see it. But regardless, you got me beat! Not an easy score to best, to say the least.

Oh, and I also like @_G_ 's idea of placing repicks in the same location, but only as an *option*. E.g., if you're still trying to get a great opal, you really can't use it or you can end up drawing one in a terrible position. When you're still seeking a GO, once you pick a single PO earlier than pick #5, all subsequent picks should go where you'd want the GO to be if you get lucky. But that stops being important after you place a GO. @216 I really don't remember how this run started off, which was like two weeks ago. I know I didn't get the GO particularly early, I think sometime around level 150-200, so yes, I had lots of air leaks and overbuilt the jades. But the overbuilt jades are what ended up "saving" me at the end, cause I almost 200 million gold banked up for ground leaks once I started shortening the maze. If I'd gotten the GO earlier, I wouldn't have built nearly as many jades, and probably would have run out of gold even earlier! So without the late game enemy movement glitch, essentially, you need to overbuild jades regardless now.

@_G_ My run crapped out at level 1194! So that means I had room for about 30 more levels. With the old movement glitch, which used to start on my PC around level 800, I'd have ended this run with over 200 million gold, massively overbuilt Jades (25 of them, far more than the old version would have needed), but now, forget it! :)

Maybe more simple: shift-click repick button automaticlly replace 5 gems with new ones almost instantly ? (small delay to prevent missclick repick again) @G @WGW I think LAJ/EE balance wasn't an issue in that WGW's run, just huge amount of early leaks caused by very late GO (and some missing good EE positions/lack of middle EGs) Also, recent change will have significant impact on your runs, while you both use extremelly few EGs , so part of total damage coming from EEs is huge

@Peter I really appreciate your reluctance to make any changes to classic! If I were to ask for one new feature in classic though, it would be to create an option to repick gems while retaining their positions. So you would see two options after placing 5 gems: "repick" (new functionality) and "reposition" (current functionality). I'm not sure if I'm explaining that well enough, so let me know if it makes sense. It's probably more trouble than it's worth to implement, but it would drastically reduce the amount of clicking it takes to bring a classic game to the end stage.

@WGW I'm sure it won't be hard for you to beat 1244 once you figure out the right balance of lucky asian jade and enchanted emerald

@Peter Thanks, but.. [already fixed] Why "Legendary" difficulty means removing Easy, the 6th button is unacceptable? Things to disscus: -Malachite interval nerf (i'm not saying it must be exacly same as in Flash version) [done already] -Initial amount of lives -Early game anti-frustration mechanics (such as start gem preference)

@WGW Yes that's why I have been avoiding making any changes to Classic. I did just fix the Armor types and Damage as per @216's request. One other change I was considering is adding "Legendary" difficulty and removing Easy.

@216 and @Peter, I think we should be wary of modifying classic game mode mechanics piecemeal, quite seriously. But that's just my two cents. . . I don't want the old Flash version back unless it's as a separate mode (which would be great, but I'm really not asking for that!) I don't want the old opal buff bug back, e.g.! :)

@G, if you see this. . . I'm nearing the end of the best run I've had with v1.0.3, which I believe (maybe I'm wrong) is when Peter fixed the late game enemy movement glitch. That glitch is what made it basically impossible, in past versions, to leak ground enemies in very late levels regardless of how much you have to shorten the maze to squeeze in more blocks. But now, with the exponentially rising cost of buying lives, and consistently leaking ground enemies once I start shortening the maze (after level 1,000 or so I have no choice--no room left anywhere else!), gold is a real problem. By my calculations, I can only afford to buy enough lives to compensate for just under 2 leaks average per ground level, and I know I will be leaking more than that by the end. (Currently at level 1069.) So I'm dying of curiosity--how did you manage to get to level 1244 in v1.0.3??? I'm extremely impressed, and even more baffled. Maybe it has to do with having a different maze layout? You must be heavily building only paraibas to get that far, but otherwise, I don't know quite how you managed this. But since your run ended with 187 million+ gold, clearly your issue was not leaks, but running out of space! Screenshot, fwiw (the missing header row with stats like level, gold, etc, is a weird glitch that happened this run, no idea why): https://imgur.com/a/BbXZIto

Yes. Wasn't it intended since begining, but forgotten?

@216 To be 100% clear, the S2 armor weakness is what you want for Classic now?

@Peter, I remember quite well Flash mechanics. I didn't refer to amethyst weakness after lvl 40 , but to pink damage color, which is the only one that respect weakness (in s2,s3 it works correctly for all colors) And, no, we didn't ask to make everything exacly like in Flash version, lives mechanics obviously needed change

@216 To answer your question, I just checked because I couldn't remember: Past level 40, Flash Insane and current Classic Survival both use Pink armor on every wave, including flying waves.

@216 @wgw I still have the source code of the Flash version, I can compare the exact mechanics if you want. Do you want it exactly like the Flash version?

@Peter Topic of your last comment is not classic (and its visible not to everyone). Please add weakness to Classic first - I don't believe it was intentional to make it *works* olny on pink dmg Also extreme (easier diffs too) runs with no leaks(10300 score) should receive a small time based bonus. Adding weakness modifiers will have little negative effect on speedrun times , but lack of it is like a bug

Short answer for now, @216, just to clarify, I didn't mean "increase the flyer HPs". The opposite. When I wrote "A change to the increase in hit points of flyers", I wasn't clear enough. The change I meant would be to REDUCE the increase in hit points of flyers so that they don't jump in difficulty to kill so abruptly at level 40/44. That would make the GO a lot less critical, since you absolutely don't need a GO to reliably kill all ground enemies. If the flyer HP increase wasn't so steep, you could reliably kill more flyers through higher levels without a GO. I think. I don't really know the formulas/stats like you do, really at all. I go mostly by observing the game/kill patterns/gem kill counts, etc. than knowing the underlying math. And there's a sure a steep cliff in air enemies becoming a huge problem by level 48 (without a GO). :)

1. I should be more clear, sorry. By "early" game i meant actualy first 100 or 150 lvls(rather mid game). When imagining PD earning lives, the "best" strat seems to be making low-dmg stun zones near them and killing enemies as slow as possible. Similary can be done with jades now, but to buy 2x more lifes needs not x2, but ~8x gold. So balacing such mechanic would require additionaly limits... but even 1 life per lvl per tower is too much. Possible to find some unclear formulas for chance to get 1 life depending of hits, but i don't like this idea. 2.Removing lives and direct gold cost on leak - hmm, maybe just auto-buy (if 1 life) on leaks? So you still can buy lives if want to (leaks count, preventing form spending gold) 3. Stun immune wawes - i've never liked air stun immune lvls. Once i managed to kill 3 in lvl 100. But i deal with ground stun immine wawes, untill 450 or 550. The reason is difference of amount of EGs that we use.(naturally playing to end of space requires limiting them) 4. color/weakness You shocked me a bit by ignoring that mechanic - the x1.75 on pink dmg is not that You want to ignore. That's why some middle EGs are needed to effective kill flyers. Maybe that, with unstable stun zones explain 7 leaks without GO The damage type is same as Perfect gem or..also projectile color. Flash version/s2 has colored damage text also, so no doubt what type of dmg gem is. 5. life/repick balance Such values occurs olny in very late game. Even if life cost 1 milion gold, the 50k for repick is not nothing - compare value of repick and life in terms of surviving ( not being limited by space) - at lvl 1000 you can't basicly add anythng usefull . and repicking 20 times (if little unlucky) to get PAq cost You actually 1 life then. Too cheap? Being able to repick a lot is kind of privilege of reaching very late game and i like it. But when we add difficulty around lvl 200 thing will be different... 6. GO balance it wasn't needed to reach lvl 195. Now its also not needed to reach 195 or even ~1200. Early GO was crittically needed to improve time scores on lvl 195 . Now early GO is critticlly need to limit non-paraiba towers to push some more lvl past 1200. In 2020 I managed to beat 196 without GO - but it wasn't fully stable run. Btw, *almost* first no-GO succes was made by lement, not me. However the PC spec were matter - laggy, slower projectilles reduces the chance of succes too much (I did some simulations) GO power always have been insane, it wasnt "needed" cause You played untill target lvl and accepted slower times scores too. If s1 boss 500 (basicly unbeatable) was in classic then we would play to 500 without "need" of GO (in s1 playing without GO cause problems to get few 0-leaks air lvls for boss 250, almost managed to do it) If pushing limits (imagine balanced game),GO its absolutely needed. The olny reasonable change that would make them less crittical is buffing PO - which would have big impact on easier difficulties. Maybe we just need accept it, we can discuss about mechanics that helps to get first GO in survival. (You suggested combining 2 POs, i have few other ideas) You said sometihng about increasing flyers hp - the GO is x1.3 more attack power AND x1.3 stun power (compared to PO). So i don't think its the way to balance it.

Ah, and I forgot to mention the single biggest change since the Flash game-- the no stun levels. If that remains in the game, then you're guaranteed to leak 10 (or at least 8 or 9) lives every 50 levels. There's no strategy around it. And with the way life cost skyrockets, that's a fundamental, core change to the game which requires building enough Jades to survive it. There is no strategy that will prevent you from leaking ALL air enemies (or at least 9) on no stun levels past level 100. And leaking ALL ground troops (except maybe one) on no stun levels past level 350.

@216 I always use the same build. I've been using the same build forever. Even going back to the Flash game, it was essentially the same maze, just emphasized a stunlock region in the lower left out of range of flyers. The only variance from run to run is what gems I get, not the maze layout or my intended gem placement (though I did, as I've mentioned, partially adopt your strategy of creating a horizontal row of EEs. On gem color weakness, it's just not something I ever paid much attention to having played the Flash game forever, which made gem color irrelevant starting with level 40. If this becomes a major game factor, then it has to be made clear somehow what special towers map to what gem color weaknesses. It's not clear now, and never was. I'm guessing tht towers with a perfect gem are counted as the same color as the perfect gem in the recipe, but there are towers that don't use a perfect gem at all, where the recipe doesn't even have one gem at a higher level than the others (basically every tower that doesn't require a perfect). Not sure why you'd say great opal imbalance is unfixable. It wasn't necessary at ALL in the Flash version of the game. It just sped the game up so you'd get to the hard gate at level 196 sooner. Which would boost scores at the same level reached, because of the lower time score. But it was a minor effect. You absolutely did not need a great opal in the old game. A change to the increase in hit points of flyers would do wonders. Level 44 is generally the last level you can count on killing most flyers without exceptionally good RNG, like an early GO. Again, not sure why you'd think that early game balance would be ruined by a tower that earns lives. It depends, first of all, what rate the lives are generated at, which is a tweakable formula. But you shouldn't be leaking any enemies, air or ground, until at least level 40. So earning lives early game really has no effect. It's just one idea. The point I was trying to make (per old discussions) is that the game has to be rethought. There's simply no reason for lives to need to be purchased with gold. Even if you want to preserve gold as affecting both repick ability, and how many enemies you can afford to leak, there's still no reason, really none, why we need a separate stat for lives. Leaked enemies should just reduce gold directly. What's the point of the extra step of having to click a button manually to buy lives for a fixed (increasing) cost when the game end condition can simply be redefined as "running out of gold"? It would change literally nothing except to eliminate the silly process of replenishing lives manually. At least in the Flash version, whether intentional or not, needing to click to buy lives is what made level 196 almost impossible to beat, because one leaked enemy cost your full maximum of 50 lives. But now? Escaped enemies always only cost 1 life. So leaked enemies should simply deduct directly from your gold. Again, changes nothing about gameplay or strategy. But I still say, you can't balance gold for both purposes. When you have 10 million in gold, and repicks (after tons of repicks due to the combine special bug not being exploitable anymore) cost like 25,000, you're simply not constrained in any way by gold cost from repicking almost endlessly. And the gold had to scale up that fast to match the increase in cost of escaped enemies. The scales are just wildly off-- by end game, escaped enemies can cost over 1 million gold, while repicks still cost like 40k to 50k max. At the very least, the scaling of repick costs has to be tweaked so that the scale of increase isn't so wildly divergent from how quickly the cost of lives skyrockets. The current Javascript version is, while superficially very similar, in many ways a completely different game now. Remember how much effort you and other folks into the emerald strat to get past level 195? That's not a thing anymore. Great opals were nice to have but thoroughly unnecessary in the Flash version. I'm sure they helped a lot with the emerald strat, but that strat was always highly RNG dependent already. In the Flash version, I was basically guaranteed that I could make any run work well enough to get to level 196. In the current game? I have maybe one run in 20 that's worth playing past level 100. Lives work different, gold scales differently, it's already not the old game. We're talking about rebalancing *this* game, right? Not making it more like the old Flash game. (I wouldn't mind having the old Flash version of the game back, for the record-- it was a lot less frustrating, and runs only lasted 10 hours or so, even for the few folks like you who got past level 196!)

@WGW I use the "PA" as abbreviation of Perfect Amethyst, not Aqua (PAq i use. Alternative is PQ). You didn't comment about weakness - i think it should be added asap. It looks obviously not intentional being apllied olny for pink damage, more like something "to finish later" then Peter forgot about... It wasn't a prority when we had a crash bug - i didn't insist to add it, then Peter suddenly started S1 - so was too late for changes such adding weakness - Gold for both lives and repick - hard to balance, but actually... current repick/lives balance is not as bad, assuming multive lives leak cost will be added. Tower that generate lives - years ago i also had such idea,for useless Pink Diamonds. But: - it would ruin early game balance - i think its intentional for gold to be used for lives, not olny for repicks - the mechanic its too far from classic flash game; we have seasons now to test such mechanics - i don't actually think it would be as fun If any doubt about how game-breaking is Uber Stone, check Raine's s1 top score, look at time and realize it was even without GO (s1 is basicly classic survival, just boss in lvl 250 and 500) Great Opal is game-changing (always have been), no good way to fix it ( and we can get high lvl without it, anyway ). But drop 7->0 in leaks sounds unlikeky, must be very specific build

@216, Oh I definitely would prefer that classic survival mode actually contain a real challenge, which we both know it doesn't after level 200, latest. And I've said before, I fully agree that it was necessary for Peter to patch the combine special bug, but the result is that playing a long run is now 10 times more tedious than it used to be, requiring more than 200 actual perfect aquamarines. And it adds no challenge at all-- you always have far more gold than you need to repick as often as necessary for the PAs, but it's incredibly, incredibly, incredibly tedious. Just by virtue of RNG, sometimes you may have to repick dozens of times to get the next PA. The answer is not restoring the bug, clearly, but the game in its current form is, incredibly, even more tedious than it used to be. Far more. And now it's not a matter of passively waiting for 8 to 10 minutes for late levels to finish. Now, with the 4x speed booster and no more glitched enemy movement in late levels, it's maybe a couple of minutes per level, and then you're right back to having to repick endlessly for PAs. Too little downtime, too much active (but totally tedious, non-strategy-based, repetitive) repicking, often spending more time to get another PA than the downtime waiting for the level to play out after your pick. So the game could really use an overall rebalance, and I think the most fruitful approach is adding new game elements like the ones that have been suggested over the years by various folks, rather than even trying to rebalance the game by just tweaking tower stats. I like your ideas. I've forgotten what most of mine have been. I know one idea, which I still stand by, is to simply eliminate gold to purchase lives, so that it only affects being able to repick, which would mean rebalancing Jades. Having gold affect these two different game stats, lives and repicks, is impossible to balance. I still like the idea of making one of the useless towers a non-attack tower which earns lives back on a low % basis, akin to the jades earning gold. Creates an interesting tradeoff you have to consider between raw attack power and sufficient replenishment of lives. But there have been lots of other ideas over the years. I can't speak to the uberstone, cause I've never gotten one. :) The great opal absolutely should not be as important as it is, that much I'm sure of, though. I've had runs where I was leaking 7 or 8 air enemies every air level, then got a late GO and immediately stopped leaking any air enemies at all. That's far too great an effect for a tower that you can't count on getting. There is definitely going to be a new challenge now in very late game figuring out the optimal way to shorten the maze in light of the gold saved up so that I don't end up bleeding lives on ground levels. I'm still only at level *780* at this point, but I'm going to have to start shortening the maze. I'm almost out of room otherwise.

@WGW: so... You actually prefer harder survival mode (lose before 400) or play to end of space? There are some interesting aspects of end of space play (i.e. proper shortening maze without losing to grounds), but i prefer trying to stop air leak and lose faster. I suggested before to leave current surival mode for those who like it and add NEW, 6th difficulty, which includes: - multiple lives per leak from lvl 201 - extra enemies (but much less than in s2) OR little stun resistant enemies in late lvls Regardless of new difficulty, classic need some changes: - full weakness and colored damage text (like in s2) - some adjustments, such as paraiba/some great gems damage - MINOR jade nerf (if weakness added, difficulty little drops, due to green dmg gets x1.5 on flyers - will compensate jades) -Uber Stone nerf ("nobody will get it", but what if? it should not soloing whole game) Do we aggre with it?

@Peter I have a decent if not spectacular run going, probably will get to level 1225 or so if I don't mess it up. I experienced a bug I've never seen before: the header text for the game, which shows level, gold, lives, time and score disappeared! The game is otherwise still playing normally. Screenshot here: https://imgur.com/a/kTHX0s7 Thanks again for making classic mode stable and far faster to play! @216 So many interesting ideas have been brought up over the years for changes to rebalance classic survival mode. I think it'll require a lot of tinkering and folks like us actually playing it out to see what tweaks work as intended. In the meantime, I'm happy to have my digital fidget spinner back. It's way harder to get a good run going now with the combine special bug fixed. I got a great opal somewhere around level 250, so I overbuilt jades disgracefully. I don't know exactly how much gold I have at this point since the header text is invisible, but it's far too much. ;) But last time I had a good run going, I ended up bleeding lives on ground levels so badly after shortening the maze, I really don't know how far this run will get. I think, if things work as they did for my last good run, I'll at least be able to sort of see gold/level/time/score on the high score list after level 500, when Peter built in a "save per level" feature. I'm at around level 429 now.

@Peter The aura bug fix definitelly should be applied to classic. The damage table and Uber nerf likely too. Great gems rebalance needs more discussion (the new mechanics should not be in classic IMO). The thing i really wish it was in classic is the 6th difficulty - like Survival but with 2 and 3 lives cost at 201/301 and extra enemies (but not by 5 at once, 1 every 50-60 lvls starting somewhere at 110 -180)

@ttj @wgw I am planning to bring some of the fixes to classic that we have solved in season 2. I just don’t want to mess up classic again.

@Peter I appreciate your concern, but I don't mind at all. @WGW Thanks! It was fun chasing your high scores in classic. I don't miss all the times my laptop crashed past level 1200. The current version is much better.

Also, to avoid turn/level inflation, probably there would need to be a rule that once you combine two identical gems for a higher quality gem, that you can't combine the resulting gem with another identical one again. Otherwise you could build a great gem starting with chipped gems and it would take around 25 turns/levels. But this is also not intended to rebalance Classic Mode on its own. Just a suggestion for one way to mitigate frustrating RNG. No one (including me) really wants to play Classic Mode building nothing but paraibas for 1000 levels!

Hey @TTJ! I don't recall having seen comments from you here before now-- you really kept me on my toes in Classic Mode before Peter fixed the Combine Special bug et al. :) I know Peter's focus is understandably on Season 2 now, and not on Classic Mode (and thanks, @216, for also chiming in that Classic Mode has room for potential improvement), but just to get this down, I had one idea that I don't recall ever being discussed before: Being able to combine two already placed gems of the same color and quality into a single higher quality gem, just as you can do when drawing two identical gems in a single turn. I'd have to actually play a version of the game with this change to see whether it makes things more or less balanced, but my thinking is: 1) You need so many perfect gems before level 40, and especially level 50, for a viable run, being able to construct perfect gems would really reduce the number of runs that are hopeless due only to bad early RNG (you pretty much need 2 perfect opals, and one each of perfect amethyst, aquamarine, emerald, and ideally ruby, so that you'll have at least one perfect opal, one Black Opal, one Egyptian Gold, one Paraiba, one Enchanted Emerald, and, especially if you get it early, one unupgraded bloodstone) 2) Repicking early in the game is basically off limits 3) Sacrificing an entire turn to make a higher quality gem from two identical lower quality ones is a pretty big tradeoff 4) Even picking two flawless gems of the same color is far from a guarantee within a small number of picks 5) You can construct an almost non-optional great opal, rather than doing run after run hoping for one Just putting it out there!